Devblog: Navigation Structures Inbound!


(Rivr Luzade) #21

What are you talking about? It sounds very much like sov attack. :thinking: That’s not what I am talking about. But CCP seems to think in the same direction, which is nice for you.

A roaming or camper group does not use Boson titans or can deny access on the gates of the locals.

(Capqu) #22


current situation:
5 min anchor (1 pre-anchored max) 30 mins to online, 1 grid, no keepstar within 1000km, no minimum time to reinforce

post patch situation:
45 min anchor (3 pre-anchored max), 5 mins to online, 3 grids 100 au apart in system, probably keepstar within 200km, 27+ min to reinforce

are you intending to completely rape the ability of anyone to attack an established foe?
these changes are bad for the game for a number of reasons, and i’ll address each point individually

  • alowing 3 pre-anchored completely negates the only reasonable length timer the attacker can respond to
  • multiple grids hundreds of AU apart with a 5 minute timer means no chance of getting to whichever grid gets activated in time with any reasonable load (tidi) on the system (for reference, jammers are mostly used in tidi situations)
  • keepstar in range - lol speaks for itself
  • 27+ mins to reinforce. this is an unreasonable amount of time for something that used to be instant (and still considered critical to defending a system)

the jb / gen changes are terrible for the same reasons, but honestly you can already do most of it with poses already (but it takes more effort and most people don’t bother putting keepstars on pos grids)

(Old Pervert) #23

I’m trying to find a scenario where what you’re talking about is in any way relevant. A POS bridge invariably has a wide variety of guns on it if the owners aren’t retarded. If you start incapping the POS, they’re just going to not use the bridge.

“camping and causing general mayhem” isn’t even a thing now. Not sure why you think that it being on a citadel grid is somehow different than a deathstar.

(Rivr Luzade) #24

You are not trying hard enough because you can’t even comprehend what I am talking about, nor do you seem to know how you camp a JB.

Case in point.

(Old Pervert) #25

Feel free to educate me.

At this point, I maintain that being on a citadel grid is better for antagonists, for the simple fact that the citadel needs an active gunner and POS guns will shoot whoever lands. Unless the POS owner is ■■■■ and didn’t anchor enough guns, you won’t be camping it. Which is why I have NEVER had any issues with jumping through a pos bridge.

(Cypherous) #26

You’re not the target audience, even the current cyno beacons had to be outside of the shield on a POS to stop people from just jumping with immunity, the same applies here, the manual method is always going to be better but not everyone has an alt online at all times for an emergency cyno

(Old Pervert) #27

Sorry to meme this, but get good scrub. It’s sovnull. If you don’t have a cyno alt, it’s stupid easy to get one. If you’re one of those “I ONLY want one account” folks, train friendship up.

A blind jump to a beacon 200km off your docking point is terribly foolish.

(Cypherous) #28

Oh i have an alt, but like i said not everyone who lives in sov null is going to have one logged in 24/7 i mean you can disagree but not everyone who owns a jump drive equipped ship is going to have an alt around all the time, i don’t have my alt online if i’m moving about in my BLOPs because it can still warp in a decent time but having beacons around does make life a little easier for everyone, yes you may not want to jump blind to a beacon but if that beacon is deep inside your own space there is no need for it to be sitting right on the undock, and as i said, thats what manual cyno’s are for

(Old Pervert) #29

They don’t need it logged in 24/7, they only need it logged in while they’re undocked in a capital. As you rightly say, blops are generally going to be just fine warping to the citadel.

Make no mistake, anyone hunting capitals will park a cepter on the beacon. If the citadel doesn’t have a gunner (which most of them don’t until you rage ping for a permitted gunner to log in) it won’t push you off the grid.

They’ll park a point, wait for you to jump to the beacon, and kill you right on your own citadel grid.

The argument that it’s deep inside your own space means that you’ve got a large alliance, and there’s more than enough people in your standing fleet to light a cyno for an e-jump. Should be standard practice for every alliance that doesn’t suck.

The only people that these will help are as you say the people that won’t have a player-lit cyno. And those ones won’t have the help they need to get rescued when they get pointed 200km away from their citadel.

(stephan Rin) #30

can we talk about the following point on the release list.

Supercapital Construction Facilities cost per day increased from 1m isk to 40m isk.

how is this going to create more content, as smaller alliances won’t be able to afford this change so easily.

(GhostWhite) #31

“In a future patch we will be implementing a reimbursement program for the old starbase navigation structures and their blueprints so that owners of the old structures can recoup SOME of their value.”

“SOME” ? Really ?

(Cypherous) #32

Considering beacons can use an ACL you’re going to have to guess which beacon its going to be, its not restricted to them being in the same alliance as the beacon anymore, so if you have multiple beacons in range good luck guessing where they went in advance, if these were set up like the current beacons you might have a point

(Cypherous) #33

They basically mean they won’t reimburse any research you’ve done on prints, the structures themselves will likely be purchased by NPC orders at an average price based on the minerals used, meaning you may not get exactly what you invested back if you either overpaid or spent money researching the print, the same as always

(Querns) #34

Why would you expect a full refund? Those structures have been providing value for nearly two decades. The fact that anything is coming of them at all is, honestly, kinda surprising.

(Cypherous) #35

If you can afford to build supers you should be able to afford a couple of bil a month to run the facilities :stuck_out_tongue:

(Rivr Luzade) #36

These changes should make the Cyno Inhibitor more effective for springing traps before prey can scramble a cyno in the right fleet, as well as making them more viable to carry while roaming.

You are joking about yourself here, CCP? :smile: You can light a cyno and switch fleets and broadcast that beacon so that people can jump to it in the new fleet. Until the time when #CCPQualityCoding does not work and you can neither broadcast the beacon and/or do not see the broadcast in your fleet window. Other than that, the change is nice and welcome.
What you could do to make that thing even more useful and actually really worth having: As soon as it onlines, it aborts running cynos in the area of effect. That would help a whole lot to get more destruction going. It is an inhibitor that cannot inhibit cynos. And a capital or Rorq can just light the cyno in the minute onlining time and make the inhibitor useless.

(Distant Cousin) #37

Nice changes on the inhibs. With the advancements coming from the new FLEX tech, which utilises abyssal technology, is it safe to assume the production of cyno inhibs is going to require abyssal components in the future? :slight_smile:

(Solecist Project) #38

Am I the only one who is bothered by the fact that it’s not CynosAUral …
… but CynosUral …
… despite it being called cynosaural since forever?

Did they rename it some years ago and I never noticed?

(Solecist Project) #39

Any alliance that can’t field a silly 1.2 billion isk in 30 days doesn’t belong in null sec.

(Old Pervert) #40

And you can bet the renters you’re advocating for (the ones that don’t have the standing fleets with the dozen or so trusted emergency cynos) will not have acl access to their landlord’s beacons.

If they’ve got more than one system, you can bet it’ll be directly attached and the goal will be to ejump to the beacon and warp to the citadel before the attackers can gate over.

The problem here is that alliances of any real size (we’re talking sovnull so lets talk sovnull sized) aren’t going to need these beacons. They aren’t going to use them period, because why would they ever choose to jump to something 200km away when they can just jump at zero?

Yet, the ones that could benefit from this, the smaller groups, haven’t got enough stones to throw to overcome the limitations.

They can’t jump to the cyno in the new fleet. Everyone learns that the hard way once lol.