I know, but I question if those are really live views and don’t have an overview to look at ships that could be outside… The major trade hubs is where I could really use them…
Would you mind explaining why you believe these major trade hubs could use this change? Is there is an actual reason, or is this just another one of those “I got ganked and now I’m afraid to undock” type scenarios?
Spot the difference! 
Maekchu wasn’t starting one of the usual threads.
He’s also not a known asshole, like others.
He tried to help and share information.
It’s not the words that are the problem.
It’s the attitude behind it.
We’re getting “policed” for our attitude and behaviour and not for our words.
That’s why getting distance helps.
Trust me. On the last forums I have went through literally every single possible ban, including several 180s. I’m literally part of the 0.1% who managed to pull this off and I’m really happy about it, because it helped me learning what caused this.
It’s a fascinating phenomenon and it’s absolutely real. When we’re constantly being surrounded by ignorant assholes inevitably pissing us off, eventually - but inevitably - the mind seeks a way of getting that ■■■■ out of the system again.
I am offering you my advice and an informed, neutral third perspective on the matter.
Don’t be like them, Sol, and just outright ignore it or “know better”.
… *someone in the distance asks why @Nicolai_Serkanner hasn’t been banned yet* …
Because he’s primarily posting one liners and he’s not actually crossing the line with his behaviour.
2 Likes
You didn’t read what I posted did you? And that actually isn’t true. Undocking can sometimes have a lagged load if you haven’t noticed. Invulnerability wont save you if you’ve moving away from the undock in a freighter. On more than one occasion I was well outside of docking range on the old Caldari outposts in null just in the time it took my screen to finally load. Not that I was ever in danger personally, but it doesn’t change the fact that the danger is there. Hell on non-kickouts I’ve had my ship move 10km or more by the time i actually loaded. But regardless, I for one am okay with that danger existing. I just said he’d have an easier time asking for the docking radius of stations being extended than asking for an overview to be available while docked.
Excuse me, but that’s irrelevant to the point. Why are you bringing up a “freighter”?
You don’t undock in your ship to look around, you do so in your pod.
No they can’t. The 30 secnd invulnerability timer is exactly that. In that 30 seconds you cant be bumped or targeted, or affected by AOE weapons. You are fully invulnerable, unless you do something to break the invul timer early.
I wouldn’t really mind having the overview active while using the outside view while docked. It’s available for structure controllers but would be handy for regular people. Other than that its easy enough to undock tethered to get access to dscan/overview.
I’ll start with this since you both seem to fail at either reading comprehension or actually reading an entire post before replying. I am not in favor of any change.
Now for the actual reply. Would you rather I have said Rookie ship? The point was that if you get a lagged load and are moving away from the undock you will never be able to turn around and get within dock range before the invulnerability wears off. This problem is exacerbated on kickouts. You are taking issue with a simple example as to why you can’t talk about invulnerability timers in regards to kickouts as if they make an ounce of difference to being able to redock before being open to attack. And for the record, the same goes with pods. The only safe(ish) ways to do so is with a ship that can jump or have an alt or buddy sitting off the undock giving you eyes. Even then the danger still exists, I’ve personally undocked sabres behind people.
The OP smells like a known troll.
…
No, I wouldn’t want you to write rookie ship.
I want you to write “pod”, because that’s the smartest option in general,
though when we look at specifics things can change of course.
Anyhow, the whole approach towards this is bonkers.
You guys in here fail to look at what’s important.
For a successfull analysis first we have to split it up in two:
highsec stations.
nullsec stations.
In highsec it is absolutely no ■■■■■■■ problem whatsoever to just undock in your pod to take a look. Kickout station or not, doesn’t even ■■■■■■■ matter. All one needs to do is undocking in his pod and, in case he can’t dock back up, just warp somewhere.
The situation in nullsec is different, because nullsec has bubbles, which means one can not warp off in case the black-screen takes too long and one drifts out of docking range. This though is really only ever a problem for those who dock up in a kickout station!
The vast majority of stations are not kickout stations. Those are rare and the fact that they are rare means that nothing is broken. There’s simply a chance that you’re ■■■■-outta-luck when you’re picking the wrong station to dock at.
OP’s just whining for very personal reasons. What he asks for can already be done and changing things for everyone, because of a tiny amount of exceptions, is absolutely ridiculous. The one thing we learn from this thread is that people are apparently so starved of interesting content on the forum that they willingly jump onto every single ■■■■■■■■ out there.
I didn’t mention lowsec stations as an exercise for the reader.
/thread.
4 Likes
Or you know, use local?
So you’re suggesting that had he said:
I guess, you were born incompetent which prevents you from using your eyes and hands at the same time?
Then the ‘community’ would have reacted the same way? Because I think not, I think it is the words.
On topic, to the OP, stop being bad, git gud, etc, etc.
Regards,
Cypr3ss.
Can’t be bumped while invuln. They just fly through you.
Ctrl-space buddy. Do it the moment you undock. Any trouble outside - wait a couple seconds for the session change, then prop mod back toward station and spam dock.
And as always, any stations you regularly use, set up and insta-undock bookmark.
1 Like
No, it isn’t the words. It’s the attitude behind it.
Words don’t come out randomly, they’re based on your feelings and your ability to deal with them. Policing people based on what they’re writing alone is a bad approach, because it ignores context. That’s something SJW and easily offended people like to ignore so they can scream at anyone who uses a word they don’t like.
Context, though, is literally everything when it comes to communication and it includes far more than just the topic and everything around it.
It is actually much more reasonable and simpler to police people based on their behaviour, because it’s all-encompassing. It makes sure that assholes, who hide behind passive aggressiveness without ever directly insulting you, still get punished when they’re crossing the line.
A stereo-typical (and mostly true) US-American thing, btw, is to believe that “using certain words makes you a bad person, but I can keep behaving like an asshole all day as long as I don’t insult you directly”.
If he had written it in the way you did now, it would show that he’d be calm and reasonable (or, at least, he’d fake it well enough), which makes it a completely different thing. I know there’s people who believe that words do not actually transport emotional context, but they do. Ones usage of words tells a LOT about what’s going on in the person using them. Context is everything.
He, though, showed all the pent up emotions from being surrounded by idiots around here. His “attack” was completely unsubstantiated and unreasonable, showing that he’s going through what many regular posters eventually go through. Call it “forum grief” if you want, I have no term for it. At that point it’s growing increasingly normal to explode on random people who didn’t even give a reason, more and more often, with increasing intensity, which is why I’ve jumped in. I’ve seen that happening a LOT over the years!
That’s why I call certain people assholes around here all day, when they deserve it, and it’s fine. What wouldn’t be fine would be calling them assholes out of nowhere, for no rational reasons, continuously, everyone.
I’ll give you an example. The Naarian guy is a huge pile of steaming ■■■■ and I can claim that based on all the ■■■■ he posts, literally all the time. Lies, deceit, abusing new players, literally calling CCP criminals. ■■■■ that guy, and I’ve told him pretty often already. That’s my words, they’re not getting policed.
Though following him around through threads, posting the same words, turns it into something completely different and CCP Falcon reminded me that it’s not okay. That’s bad behaviour and will get policed.
Words are nothing but shells for feelings turned into emotions. Feelings control logic, logic mirrors ones analytical abilities and words are the outwards expression of that. It’s important to not only take people literally, but also to be aware of what’s going on in their personal context.
The fact that most people suck at communicating doesn’t really change anything about the insane complexity that comes with communication.
That’s also why I’m pretty good at sniffing “trolls” like the OP.
He’s not legit.
1 Like
There is really no reason to not have same “view outside structure” button in stations as all Upwell citadels/complexes have.
When you’re docked at a station you are literally outside of space, on the server, while when you’re docked at a citadel you’re actually still in space, but invisible. Afair It’s a completely different code path and touching it would probably cause all gates to explode or something.
They are identical in that part. But i’d love to have/read some dev-posted material that proves me wrong.
Circumstantial evidence - you don’t/can’t see overview when you use the option to see outside of citadel which supports the idea that You are not in space.
What, “they are identical” ? They’re not.
There’s tons of evidence for that claim, like how the station code is a decade old, like the difference in the session timer, the fact that your ship cloaks up and vanishes when docking at an Upwell structure, or the fact that you can actually look outside because the whole process is programmed in a way that does not actually remove “space” from the server’s “awareness”.
I don’t need to prove you wrong.
If you don’t want to believe it, then you don’t.
It doesn’t make a difference whatsoever.
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Well, you claimed that they are different, so there has to be some basis to your claims. Never hurts to ask.
Upwell structures are an amalgam of decades old POS system (the “spaghetti code” that devs want to get rid of) with decades old player-owned outposts system that, imo, is VERY similar (if not he same) to NPC stations. So the core is the same, again, imo.
1 Like
Interesting. I can’t unlike your post after your edit.
They definitely did not take old code to create Upwell Structures. The whole reason these structures exist in the first place was, as stated, to replace the old code with much better, newer one.
Actually they should also not let docked pilots see local.
They didn’t go far enough.