The Trigs have forced themselves upon us as they see us as inferior and wish to expand and accumulate power, resources and territory. Perhaps some mean well, but I do not hear them advocating for peace - they do not condemn their brothers and sisters for blockading our stargates and killing us on sight. Until there is distinctual division amongst those Trigs whom wish to war with us, and those whom do not - we must group them together and at the very least advocate for their removal. Peaceably, or non-peaceably. No racism attached.
The Godless, fear
The Godly, fear not
1 Like
They die just the same.
Re-opens the comm link.
Then let me tell you the events that had taken place. Abyssal Space had be found out of sheer dumb luck and after the events of the famous Amarrian queen throwing a terran weapon into a blue star in YC111. The Seyllin Incident. I canât remember who found the Triglavians first. If it was the Drifters, or the Sansha, I donât know, but some one who is more akin to the wealth of knowledge gathered by independent capsuleers and Kybernauts with data encryptions. Once the Triglavians were met with the first encounter, imagine how Jamal Sarum felt when she seen the Drifter horde.
Us as human are alike in many ways.
The Triglavians knew what those things were and fought them because we have record that they see the Sansha and the Drifters as the Great Old Evil.
Yeah, Iâm not really looking forward to UâK, for example, getting ahold of this stuff either. Or the Templis. Or the U-Nats. Or âŚ
⌠you know, it seems like every society has plenty of people whoâd never think of doing such things to people? Probably even the pirate factions. But then youâve got the people who would definitely think of it, and those who definitely and even eagerly would.
Itâs a persistent problem with nation-states: theyâre all pretty much full of people, of all different kinds.
I guess what we really need to do, all of us, is figure out how to cure or innoculate against mutaplasmid bioadaptives or weâre likely to start seeing tit-for-tat mutation spasms popping up all over.
(Really, werenât doomsday orbital strikes and antimatter bombs enough?)
The problem is that the Triglavians slaughtering refugees isnât exactly a dice roll, their behavior can be erratic at times but during the invasion pretty much every report I saw emphasized Triglavian indifference to evacuation efforts during the conflict. You seem to be under this impression theyâre the face of evil because âyou know evil when you see itâ and yet evil simply does not look like that.
More then anything Bioadaption seemed like an intervention to save lives in the aftermath of system conquests because, as you pointed out, without it the people on their worlds will likely die. That reliance is unfortunate, but it is also nowhere near the scale of horror as Vitoxin in itâs extreme, which effectively breaks you so thoroughly that not only are you going to die without it, but itâs also your primary source of pleasure and pain. Nothing iâv seen from Bioadaption indicates a similar level of horror.
As far as death goes: Iâm not strictly talking about military death in the service of a fleet, more often then not civilians tend to die for various reasons in the line of duty while working on Empire projects their systems. Whether thatâs due to deliberate targeting as in the case of Militiaâs operating in the buffer zone, killed in the line of duty fighting pirates,or other things of the like. Fundamentally though the high death toll tied to Empire projects is not really important to me as a specific number beyond emphasizing the point that Empire actions require an enormous amount of manpower just by default, but their wars definitely kill several planets worth on their own given the sheer size and scope involved.
Finally: The Troikaâs are very much individuals, they arenât hive minds and that seems to be done on purpose considering their distaste for Sanshaâs hivelinking tech. Just because they inhabit the same body doesnât mean each of the three doesnât have a say in what they do,or their own independent sense of self.
Further, the Clades definitely have their own sense of sustained individuality, in fact evidence seems to point to the opposite of what youâre saying. That the Convocation of Triglav, the overall body composed of the three, may itself be a temporary organization. Even if itâs not, it doesnât interfere in âthe Struggleâ beyond emergencies like this. If the Triglavians believe what they believe within the Clades and do what they do just to find a balancing point iâv seen no indication of it. By and large Veles, Perun, and Svarog still behave like themselves within their individual Kraiâs and do not change that behavior for the sake of synthesis, to the point that theyâre actively hostile to another Clade who tries to do so.
1 Like
Except, yâknow, not. There are a number of reports, many of them right here on the IGS, of the trigs attacking unarmed transport ships leaving the planets. Hereâs one from the news reports:
Updated accounts of the final evacuation flights from Skarkon II and the former Republic Parliament station have told of Triglavian invasion units cutting off access to spaceports and docking bays during their final assaults on system infrastructure. It is claimed that Svarog units are particularly brutal and indiscriminate when attacking. The final flights to escape intact from the Parliament station have reported Svarog Clade carried out boarding assaults with heavy infantry equipped with powered armor, personal shields and kinetic weapons. A number of evacuation ships were trapped or heavily damaged, apparently leading to several being destroyed in space before they could escape.
Thatâs what you call âindifferentâ? Really?
Look like what, exactly? Forced violation of human beings? Destruction of entire biospheres? Manipulation of the gullible and easily corrupted with promises of shiny new toys? Yeah, sorry. Evil looks like that.
An âinterventionâ to âsave livesâ on worlds only endangered because of the Trigsâ actions. And thatâs after we had reliable reporting of Triglavian assaults on planetside facilities to capture and experiment on civilians.
Thatâs a very easy claim to make when the sum total of data we have about bioadaptation wouldnât fill a single hole in a thimble.
No no. No moving goal posts. You said the empires kill that many every month just by moving. Back it up or shut yer yap.
And yet, the human being doesnât have control over their own body. So no, that singular physical being is not an individual. Theyâre a troika.
A sustained sense of group identity is not a sense of individuality. Itâs a sustained sense of group identity.
Or itâs the overseeing aspect within the whole. Again: internal class specialization isnât individuality. Ants have varying classes and roles, including an overseeing role. Are you gonna claim ants are individuals?
Yeah no, Svarogs actions on Skarkon are not even remotely representative of Triglavian actions across the board. By and large across Liminality systems Triglavians didnât seem overly interested in the civilian populations, and even in other places like Vale where Triglavian interdiction efforts made movement for Federation evacuation difficult Clade Veles was notably uninterested in harming the population. The one major incident of violence coming during an orbital bombardment of a Federal base that had fired upon Triglavian ships.
Mind you this assumes that all attacks by the Triglavians are taken at their face. During the assault on Port Sarum one group of people stated that a transhub had been annihilated, when a broadcast from the system later stated that the port defenses had been neutralized and a landing had occurred. The order of battle was chaotic, people were confused, and it appeared that the original assumption people had given was just wrong.
As far as our knowledge of bioadaption goes: It doesnât seem to â â â â with your brain, only your physical body. If I start getting reports that people are en mass going to Triglavian facilities because they crave Bioadaption iâll change my tune, but nothing points to such thusfar.
With regards to moving goal posts: I donât really care because establishing the precise sense of scale isnât important to the overall point compared to the fact those excessively high death tolls do occur during wars. By the same standard of focusing on minor points: I canât help but notice you havenât brought up the Drifters again. Either because youâve just never seen anyone from the Council of Tyrants and are making a claim out of ignorance, or you have and you realize in hindsight itâs a stupid and bad position to hold Iâv been letting it slide thusfar because I just figured you were doing it out of hyperbole, but thatâs a way more egregious claim that you just havenât talked about since you first brought it up.
Regarding Troika: Yeah no, the human inside of it is still an individual. The fact they donât have total control over their body doesnât change that by all appearances their minds completely intact, in fact Troika often seem to be disharmonious when they choose to disagree on any point, even the minutia of how to address someone.
Regarding the Clades: This isnât a case of class specialization. Veles doesnât mix in Svarog to serve as diplomats while the latter forms the fighting body, in fact at times they are actively hostile to one another and that shoots any claim of them doing this out of some universally shared group identity right in the dick. They fundamentally disagree on how to handle situations and rule their worlds in vastly different fashions, with no attempt to mix them and occasionally with outright hostility to another Clades interference in their worlds.
Maybe youâre right in that each Clade and Sub-clade does just work towards a sense of group identity and nothing else, but if they have enough independence to tell each other to butt out of their business between Kraiâs and even between each others consciousnesses when speaking inside a Troika, I donât see why it wouldnât be the case when they talk to everyone else.
Svarogâs actions on Skarkon may not mean that the Trigs always attack transports, but they also mean that no, any claims of âthe Trigs are indifferentâ are false, too. The Trigs arenât indifferent. The Trigs have a number of responses, and which response youâll get can be highly variable. There is no safety where there is no consistency.
Evidence, please. If youâre going to claim that bioadaptation doesnât alter your neurochemistry, youâve got to demonstrate precisely what all of the biochemical effects of mutaplasmid bioadaptation are.
Aaaaand now more evasion and changing of your claims.
And no, I havenât brought up the Drifters again because you havenât actually provided any concrete refutation of the original point. There hasnât been any need to expand on or defend it. So, you know, another attempted deflection on your part. Way to demonstrate argument in bad faith.
So, the human doesnât have control over their body. This means the human doesnât, for example, control what substances are ingested. The human mind is a product of neurochemistry, which is directly impacted by what you consume.
Follow the breadcrumbs hereâŚ
- The human mind is not in control of the body.
- The body consumes things without the human mind being in control of this.
- Brain chemistry is directly impacted by what the body consumes.
- The human mind is a product of brain chemistry.
- The human mind is supposed to somehow be unaffected by alterations in the underlying brain chemistry that gives rise to the human mind.
Sorry, no. Biology doesnât work like that.
No, it really doesnât. It just illustrates convergent development in the wake of isolation caused by specialization. Thatâs it.
And that, again, doesnât require individuality, only territoriality.
There is absolutely consistency though, you can literally tell what each Triglavian group is likely to do because of their Clade. Attempts to paint it as some kind of inconsistent chaos are at best disingenuous.
Regarding evidence: No report iâv seen thusfar indicates that Bioadapted individuals work with some kind of hive link or act based on wildly divergent actions. As far as we can tell itâs standard body modification in the vein of the Jove, who had to go out of their way to screw around with their brain chemistry to reach the point of mentally breaking themselves.
Regarding the Council of Tyrants: The burden of proof is on you to actually provide a reason to why they are the same because as I said, you can see why Triglavians and Drifters arenât alike just with your eyes: Drifters donât talk, to work with a singular ruthless efficiency, there seems to be no divergence in their actions or motives nor any infighting to speak of, itâs possible they are not even in and of themselves unique individuals. Even the Triglavians have noticed this, pointing out that whatever happened to them in their virtual world has changed their behavior patterns on the whole, indicating they may very well be one entity. Even if I accepted that Troika were not individual people anymore, thatâs collectivism on a whole different scale to the point of not even being able to really think of them in as different members of a race so much as one large body that happens to have differently named limbs. The attempt to compare is, as I said before, stupid.
Regarding the biochemistry: Are you arguing that the human component of a Troika is no longer a individual human anymore because the Navaka and Koschei might decide to get smashed in a two to one ruling? I assume what you are actually complaining about is that they might choose to get Bioadapted without consulding the Nardonya but considering that too may be voluntary, iâm not sure. A lot of your argument seems to hinge on Bioadaption radically changing the human mind, but given weâve made radical changes to ourselves with boosters and augs while still considering ourselves âindividualsâ iâm not buying into that without some kind of proof.
Regarding Triglavian development: The problem is itâs convergent outside the Clades, which indicates they arenât anymore a hive then the Empires of New Eden are the same body because weâve all overspecialized and occasionally work together. Thatâs not how this works, they identify as Triglavian but their actual style of rule and behavior is wildly divergent from one another and they clearly do not agree on many things.
Iâve never said different sub-groups would behave differently, only that the Triglavians, taken as a whole, are inconsistent. And they are. Weâve seen indications of different Clades coming into conflict even within Pochven, which indicates that thereâs no guarantee that a transport lifting off from any given planet will consistently encounter the same Clade. If they canât be sure of encountering the same Clade, they canât be sure of consistent reactions.
A) you keep bringing up hive minds. But nobodyâincluding meâhas made any claim that thereâs a âhive mindâ in effect, only a loss of individuality. Which, again, is possible because of the troika: multiple minds in each being.
B) Itâs really funny. You say the Jove had to go out of their was to screw with their brain chemistry to reach the point of breaking themselves. Human beings can do it completely inadvertantly just by eating the wrong things. Or do you think psychoactive substances donât impact brain chemistry? Are you unaware that diet can be a major contributor to mental stress conditions that result in clinical depression, manic episodes, and so on?
No, you donât need to engage in millennia of genetic engineering to mess with brain chemistry. Hell, thatâs why the word âhangryâ exists.
Iâm asserting that the very fact that there are two other intelligences riding shotgun in the body, capable of making decisions that override the native consciousness of the body, in ways that can alter that native consciousness, means that no, that creature is no longer H. sapiens, even before the bioadaptive mutations that alter the genome. Itâs not human. It is something else.
Yes. We have. Ourselves. Not âtwo other intelligences have decided weâre doing this whether we like it or notâ. So, yeah, we, individually, without two other minds, remain individuals. The troika does not.
This has absolutely nothing to do with anything, and only demonstrates that you didnât understand a damned word of what I was saying.
Sure? but unless Svarog makes a major invasion of Krai Veles then 90% of the time youâre going to be dealing with Veles around Veles. I could, conceivably, bump into Caldari Millitary in Gallente space, but I probably wouldnât consider that the standard interaction while bouncing around Sinq Laison.
Regarding âhangryâ-ness: Also sure? but if youâre arguing that this isnât some kind of wide reaching mental effect, and that it basically boils down to the idea that potentially Bioadapated individuals may get very hangry as a result of the process, I kind of donât care?
To your comment on Troika: The idea that the Navaka and Koschei might significantly alter the mind of the human body is pure speculation. Far as iâm concerned it is for all intents and purposes a human, with the minutia of genetic alteration only mattering to scientific classification. The councils ability to overrule the human component does not make that human component any less themselves. Until thereâs some indication they lack a distinct self identity, rather then evidence pointing to the opposite, they are an individual unless you define individuals as only qualifying as such with their own physical body. Which i personally donât a detatched consciousnesses enough to qualify as itâs own person.
Finally: It has everything to do with what you said. The purpose of specialization within a society is to better the whole by doing specific things you cannot by being a jack of all trades. Clade specialization does not always, or even usually, serve in that capacity. They develop their own styles individually in the same fashion any New Eden culture might.
And, again, youâre putting words into my mouth. I didnât say there was any specific âstandard interactionâ, I said it wasnât consistent. Because itâs not. And all your contortions donât change that.
Iâm arguing that even minor changes in what the body does or doesnât consume have significant impact on the chemistry of the brain. That impact, in turn, effects how the human mind interprets and reacts to the world around it. You want to talk about a âlack of distinct self identityâ? What kind of self-identity can develop within those conditions, with two other ever-present minds hooked directly into the nervous system? How can that one thing, setting aside all of the biochemical changes to the brain from the mutaplasmid, not significantly change the human component?
Did you grow up with two other minds in your head? How many humans do you know who did? Because the populations on those planets who were forced to undergo this⌠they werenât all adults. So yeah, I think itâs pretty clear that it impacts the human component in a way that inhibits the very idea of a distinct self-identity.
1 + 2 != 1. Three is not one. This shouldnât be a difficult concept.
This would be more convincing if it had a verb.
Seems to me that it serves in precisely that capacity, given that the greater purpose within the society is to pit heterodox ideas, tools, policies, and strategies against one another in service of bettering the whole. And yes, the clades serve that goal by doing specific thingsâusing tools and strategies, pursing policies and idealsâthat they could not do as generalists, because generalists would not be as strongly invested or focused on those tools and ideals.
To begin: I am not putting words in your mouth, iâm pointing out a fact. That if itâs not inconsistent on a significant scale then itâs not really that different from any section of Empire space. Sure you COULD run into a massive Amarrian fleet in the middle of Minmatar space, but itâs not a common enough occurrence to register as something you need to regularly prepare for.
While I agree that minor changes to the body and what it consumes can have some long term effects on your mental state, I wouldnât qualify that as a stripping of identity in the slightest. If a person has to adapt to constantly having two other people with them who vote on decision making, that person does not cease to be that person. He simply has to work within an unusual framework compared to the rest of us, but itâs not the same thing as say, Sanshaâs Nation.
Hell, to an extent itâs not even the same as the example of food you brought up earlier. Consuming a vast quantity of alcohol in a short amount of time can change your personality but itâs not a process of adaption, whatever substance youâve consumed is forcing the change to happen in your mood and behave in ways you would not. Hence the emphasis on altering the body and the councils rulership over it, the other detached entities within a Troika do not as far as we can tell actually change the opinions and personality of the human. To the contrary, the point seems to be that these three are to remain wholly separate individuals in and of themselves for the purposes of decision making. Their consciousnesses are individuals and qualify as such with or without their own bodies.
As far as dialectics goes: While the Clades definitely struggle to produce ideas from what remains, the realms of each one of them remains Sacrosanct. Veles governs Veles, Svarog governs Svarog, and Perun governs Perun with none of the others able to infringe upon that. In this way they determine their own styles of rulership and culture that donât fill in the âoptimalâ role of the collective, at no point do their behaviors seem to change because another Clades behavior proves superior. Possibly because their styles of rule are so vastly different from one another that they each come with unique benefits, and because their styles are not strictly âbadâ or âgoodâ they have been allowed to effectively form their own subsociety within the Triglavian whole. Potentially given a conflict thatâs large enough in scale one of the Clades could go into a radical overhaul to fit another, but we havenât seen it yet. The only exception to this rule is the Convocation of Triglav, who are able to request things from each individually as a governing body composed of all three Clades.
1 Like
My god, Arrendis. You know, initially I was content in just lurking here and watching the disagreement but hooooly â â â â , watching you argue is actually embarrassing. Your idiotic pedantics constantly shifting the argument until it no longer even resembles the initial point!
For instance, you made the stupid argument that bioadaptation makes you inhuman, then you started conflating simple bioadaptation with a troika in your ignorance, then you are arguing that a TROIKA isnât a person because âOhhhh~ What if the non-narodnya components decide to intentionally ingest psychotropics against the humanâs will?!â
Shut the â â â â up, the fact that you make these assertions and the only backing you have for one of them (The erratic evacuation responses) comes from reports before Pochven was even formed and the Krais were properly divided then come along and call any actual data invalid because âuhhhhhh CONCORD just hasnât updated the information!â is so stupid I am amazed Mr. Arnolles has wasted so much of his time on you.
Letâs get some quick points out of the way:
-
Bioadaptation isnât mutation. All mutaplasmid tech we have encountered thus far operates on the bacterial level. Unless you can point to me a single god damn instance ever of something operating on a bacterial order of magnitude altering the DNA of anything that isnât other, similar bacteria, I think its pretty safe to assume this isnât the case here either. Therefore, bioadapted people are by definition still human, just featuring quasi-organic microbial augmentations.
-
Not everyone becomes a troika, especially not newly bioadapted k-spacer populations. That is an entirely baseless assumption by you.
-
Troikas are also human, unless you can point me towards any evidence that they engage in any form of genetic tampering. Or is this more of a stupid nebulous argument about the abstract concept of humanity, because if thatâs so then the only correct answer is âI donât give a â â â â what you subjectively think is and isnât âreally humanâ.â
How about providing some actual evidence of your own for any of your claims for a change?
1 Like
I think, if you look at the statistical likelihood, youâll find the level of inconsistency is far greater in Pochven. Thereâs certainly a case to be made that thatâs because with the smaller sample size of system, statistical noise will necessarily be amplified, but in the long run, thatâs not really relevant, because it doesnât change the fact that in fact, that statistical noise is amplified in the smaller sample size of systems.
If two other beings are capable of making long-term decisions that inevitably alter the functioning of the human mind, then yes, those other beings are damaging the human mindâs identity and individuality. It doesnât matter if theyâre in your head, or if theyâre keeping you juiced up on a drug cocktail that twists your mind and considerably diminishes your capacity for being a self-aware individual.
See, again, youâre treating this as nothing more than having two other people hanging around with you. Itâs not. Theyâre directly plugged into your nervous system. The nervous system that reacts, stem to stern, on every decision, on every stress consideration. In effect, you are never even alone with your thoughtsâtheyâre influencing those, too, simply by altering the level of stress you feel and the way your body is reacting to that stress.
So, yeah, gonna have to say that having two other beings influencing your thoughts all the time? Yeah, that, too, significantly detracts from any ability to form or retain a sense of self that is in any way separate from the other two beings.
And, again, in fact, itâs impossible that they donât impact the human mind. Purely because of, once again, how biology works, and how the human brainâs wired.
You mean in the massive amount of time weâve got, observing their societyâs development? All of what? Under 3 years of lack-of-actual-observation? Yeah, thatâs just gonna be so enlightening as to the long-term development of things.
In fact, we have seen them alter behaviors across all clades. The relevant trinary is AEA2. Here, Iâll make it simple and give you Urielâs de-trig-ification:
Yeah. There is it. All cladeships entered into main dataflow. Across all Clades. Granted, itâs not a result of proving, but the point stands that when changes are made, theyâre made everywhere.
Now now, Iâm not that arrogant. Not quite. I mean, I wonât turn down tithing, but worship is right out.
Any shifts have been in responding to someone who is consistently moving the goalposts. My initial points remain: a) bioadaptation fundamentally changes the exposed into something inhuman. b) this is a worse crime than anything we have seen from the empires.
That has not changed, nor will it.
If youâll go back and check, Iâve also specifically requested any actual data on what does occur within bioadaptation, and shockingly, noneâs been provided. We know mutaplasmids work via bacterial agent on modules, but those are inanimate objects. Unless youâve got yourself a Gravid Caldari Citizen 135636984 Mutaplasmid laying around, we canât say for sure what process is actually used on something with cells of its own.
As for bacteria altering DNA⌠yeah, microbes larger than viruses can alter DNA. Usually it happens when one cell tries to consume another, but thereâs no indication that such active aggression is needed. All it really requires is the invasive DNA enter the target cell and make use of the messenger RNA. And when youâre talking about an engineered system? Itâs really not at all difficult to see where a bacterial agent could be a DNA- or RNA-bomb.
So, again, before things get ruled out, letâs see the hard data on how this stuff actually works, and what the complete list of effects are on a human being.
Every example weâve seen of functioning personal units within Trig society is a troika. Every. Single. One. So, yâknow, not exactly âbaselessâ. You want to argue for an exception, first demonstrate that such exceptions exist.
How many human beings do you know who are part genetically-engineered bacterial mutagen-goo? Who have three minds? Cite examples, please.
As for the stellar data⌠I didnât say CONCORD hadnât updated it, I said we donât have any way to confirm they have. And I asked for independently-verifiable data. Really now, if youâre going to insist on twisting my words and lying about what Iâve said, feel free to go back to lurking, cuz blocking you takes less time than writing this sentence.
Every single instance of mutaplasmid technology observed thus far operates on a bacterial level. Not a single instance of mutaplasmid technology has been observed thus far deviates from this. Any claim that it deviates from the established norm is a claim that requires backing from your end.
As I said, yes, bacteria can alter and be altered by other bacteria. Please give me a singular example across all known biology where the cells of multicellular organisms is affected like this.
Also no, you absolutely donât use bacteria to inject DNA or RNA, you use viruses for that, like, thatâs their whole thing you know. Come on now, I donât know what things were like in the Republic but this is genetic engineering elementary enough that I learned when I was 8.
Except we havenât. We know about the detached Navka. We know that Troikas are put together for specific purposes on a whim, such as Kreshnik Svarog. We know about all new subjects of the Collective in Pochvenâs worlds that have simply not been altered in any such way. This is entirely baseless.
Well, personally I know two troikas, so, two. Please, do define what âhumanâ is for you, because I see you havenât addressed that.
This seems to point towards you just being very confused, mixing species classifications with your own subjective opinion on what a human is. Very bold of you to proclaim yourself the arbiter of who is and is not âhuman.â
1 Like
Howâre your mitochondria doing? (Note: thatâs a joke. Iâm well aware that mitochondrial acquisition should predate multicellular life.)
I agree, theyâre much easier to do it with, as theyâre already a perfect delivery system for that, but if for some reason you canât use them, like because the mutaplasmid requires a bacterial agent, then yeah, you can use a bacterial agent.
References, please. Identify them so the whole class can confirm they do, in fact, have brain slugs.
Well, I am very arrogant. So nice of you to notice the boldness, though.
They are very public figures, not sure how you donât know them too.
Zorya Triglav, Detached Executive Troika for Sublimation of Poshlost Flow
Kreshnik Svarog, Special Operational Troika for Extirpation of Corrupted Narodnya
1 Like
Well I can actually assess this based on my own travels in Pochven and during the time iâv lived there. Not months like some people, but still a significant chunk. While in all likeliehood you are correct that thereâs some inconsistency, saying itâs far greater seems something of a stretch. The constant presence of Rogue Drones and the Council of Tyrants means battle lines fluctuate even without EDENCOM and thereâs the potential for Triglavian forces to move to, say, a nearby stargate to reinforce a system but itâs honestly unlikely to be extremely common.
For that I can point to Skarkon: Initially there was some interaction between the Clades as they fought over who would rule the system, but Svarog ultimately made a stronger claim and seem to be governing it according to their tenants. Iâv certainly not seen any instances of Veles setting up provisional governments in the region or Perun organizing bioadaption en mass. Itâs hard to tell with individual Triglavian ships as they donât outright signal what Clade they are from, but I think itâs safe to assume that the majority of Krai patrols come from the ruling Clade.
Regarding the Troika: This assumes that the other portions of said Troika are doing that which is pretty much all assumption, to an extent it defeats the purpose of what a Troika even is. All three components need to be running to take full advantage of their tactical ability and make decisions if necessary, doing things that result in permanently damaging the human body are counter productive and likely a last resort. They have to live with the human component too and abide by his vote, itâs not a one way street as far as we can tell.
Iâm sure a case could be made about why the other parts of a Troika might want to increase the strain on their human portion, perhaps because they want to influence a vote or get them to say something in particular, but I think itâs a leap to assume thatâs commonplace. This all also, assumes of course, that whatever is straining the human body also isnât altering the other two portions of the Troika as well, in which case those kinds of tactics would be pretty discouraged.
Regarding the Convocation of Triglav: That looks more like an executive order from an overall representative body to allow resources to be entered into the Cladeflow rather then a thing that occurs on the regular, it doesnât even appear to be forcing the Clades to do anything in particular so much as itâs removing obstructions to their ability to participate. Hell, in the text itself itâs shown that the reason the Militant and Technical clades are engaging with each other is because the leadership in the Convocation of Triglav have all consented to that action.
1 Like