EVE Online: Invasion - General Feedback

[Kilon_Alios]

like most things in EVE don’t know what it is or why I should care. From what I am reading its another RNG of too much effort for little gain.

Ironic because even though Tris are clearly inspired by Elite’s Thargoids, yet they so much harder to find, much easier to kill and far, far less scary.

While Thargoids sent player alliances to panic mode in Elite with seeing NPC stations (no player station available in game) torn into pieces with mass abandonment of systems by myriads of players and NPCs. Weapons unlike anything the players ever seen. Extremely hard to kill. Shrouded into confusion of good vs bad Thargoids , should you shoot and pray or should you beg for your life ? Basically pure havoc.

I remember the first I was jumped in an area that a Thargoid devastated a fleet of npcs ships equivelant to a dozen of Titans , paniced at first, not that I will lose my dirty cheap ship but the fact I did not even knew what was the the Thargoid I was seeing. Was it a ship, a small station , a monuments , some kind celestial body. Add to that the spooky atmosphere of its whale like sounds. I was lucky to have landed next to a good Thargoid. Did not fight yet I had more excitement that I had an entire year playing EVE. Hands down the best experience in a sci fi game after the pure terror the first AVP game was.

On the other side the reaction of EVE players with the invasions have been “meeehhh…”.

If you at least try to rip off a feature from another game at least make it a decent one.

I had high hopes with the introduction of Tris but I could not care less with CCP has done with them. Vastly missed opportunity to make the mission system relevant and actually fun to play.

Nonetheless I love EVE as a game, but yeah, Triglavians have been extremely underwhelming for me. Other than unlike Thargoids I can actually fly Tris ships which are kinda cool looking.

[Sylvia_Kildare]

@Solecist_Project

I remember the first time Incursions got nerfed.

How is friendship related to income?

Is your post telling me that Incusrioneers are all about the community,
as long as it’s worth the income?

Isn’t that seriously contradictionary?

People can enjoy hanging out with each other and enjoy making ISK at the same time. What’s contradictory about that?

@Tallon_Darkwyrm

TBH the changes feel intentional and malicious.

I dunno about that, but I will say that ever since Drifter incursions began, if you as an incursioner (and I have been one as well for much of the past 4 years) haven’t realized that CCP could easily 100% remove sansha incursions due to introducing new content that replaces it… you aren’t paranoid enough/haven’t had enough of your favorite ships/playstyles nerfed into irrelevance in the past.

So I’m not very surprised they’ve cut down the HS incursion spawns from 3 to 1… I’m surprised they didn’t do it sooner. Be thankful they didn’t kill every spawn at once.

@Vela_Lightbringer_Ho

Yeah. As a wormholer and incursion runner… Take a guess about how I feel about CCP’s choices right about now

Wormholer/incursioner squad roll out! (no, don’t roll yourself out, that’s not what I mea… argh!)

@Zane_Chakaid

CCP Hilmar said at Eve down under that they want to inject the mystery back into Eve. So, I’m pretty sure that’s why it never hit the test server. Personally, I think they should probably save the mystery box for content that is specifically designed for explorer type players, and forget about it for content designed for achiever type players (a.k.a. incursion runners).

Thing is, there’s no way CCP wants this new Triglavian Invasion content to only appeal to incursioners. Incursioners are somewhere around 1% of players, I believe I’ve heard quoted, and if only 1% of EVE players are interested in the new content, I think CCP will feel they’ve failed.

Now, I don’t know how many of the active players over the past year or so have even tried the abyssal content at all… but I’ll bet it’s more than just the incursioner community. And CCP was hoping to snag some mix of abyss runners, incursioners, missioners, etc. with this new invasion content. Success? TBD.

@Solecist_Project

Farmers don’t have friends.

Such an over-generalization. SOME farmers don’t have friends. Some of ANY type/group of people don’t make friends… but your strange feeling that farmers/crabs/carebears/whatever are less likely/capable to form friendships than… what, PVPers? ninja looters/salvagers? griefers? trade hub scammers?

What a weird, weird theory you have.

[Sylvia_Kildare]

@Turlough_Dominian

One of the issue’s we have experienced as a half decent sized group is splitting the iskies/loot keeping track of who was in fleet/ how long they where around who deserves what payout % wise on loot + salvage is tedious and for me not a fun experience if i am the one organsieing the pew pew

This is the same thing sleeper fleets deal with in j-space. FCs gotta either split up the loot evenly or gotta haul it to Jita, sell it, and pay out shares. Those are the only way a multi-person fleet that gets its ISK from loot/salvage/ore/whatever-non-direct-ISK/LP-method can fairly split up the profits.

This is one thing that makes incursioning so much simpler… sure, the FC’s still got tons of other things to handle, but at least the ISK/LP splitting handles itself. CCP really needs to think about how payouts get distributed/split a bit more. The conduits pay way too little ISK and they spawn too rarely atm… and the trig rats outside of them should at least have some amount of bounty from DED if not from CONCORD attached to 'em.

@Hurtigen

I think this is great content for new(er) players-re. the opportunity to ninja-salvage the triglavian wrecks. When you can pull in ISK to the hundreds of millions with a bit of application and it becomes like “salvage pvp” competing against other ninjas-and there is definitely “risk”-ive had 3 or 4 ships shot out from under me and dozens of times warping away in structure by the Trigs. Complainers could try remembering how it used to be when earning <10 million was a big thing. Its laughable seeing pilots in obviously big high skilled/high ISK ships supported by half a dozen logistics complaining(shooting the wrecks to stop you salvaging).

I’ve been the Noctis pilot for several fleets now and it’s not too hard to stop most of the ninja salvaging… it just requires at least one toon’s full attention per big fleet.

The problem is that single pilots or smaller gangs trying to do this content without a dedicated salvager are going to lose more and more of their payout to ninjas and just stop doing the content.

Once all the fleets/rat killers have gone away, the ninjas will have to create their own wrecks or go find something else to do. Don’t kill the golden goose, IOW, with overfarming the farmers.

@Hurtigen

If you want/need ISK you ninja salvage, if pure ISK making not your thing and you want to give flying in a fleet a go(for the experience) you do that, same if maybe you want to try FC for the experience-seems like its set up to cater for multiple experiences on multiple levels(whilst it still in Hi-Sec). Everyone can do mix of things or stick to one.

And if you wanted to do all that fleet stuff but get wayyyy more profit than either the fleets doing the triglavian invasions or the ninjas trying to steal their payouts, you were already incursioning where there is no ninja risk (most incursioners do not bother to salvage their 1 mil ISK of empty wrecks per VG site that makes them 10 mil ISK x 10 pilots worth of money per ~5 minutes unless they have idle alts that can follow along behind the fleet, and if a ninja came in on that? pfft, sure, have it).

@Bleichrodt

Unfortunately, go to any Invasion foothold system this week and what do you see more often than not? 10-15 Marauders, T3s and Faction BS sitting blasting frigates and claiming what to them is chump change-as for low skill/noobs being able to take part for (to them) decent ISK reward-they have no chance.
Honestly-the myopic bleating from clearly well off(jaded?) players being deprived of a few shekels by ninjas is ridiculous-if i was a noob you damn right i would be jumping in my salvage ship and taking from these “whales”.

Don’t blame the vets trying out the new content, blame the slow conduit site spawn rates, CCP adding majors, removing majors… adding zoryas, removing zoryas… having roaming BC/BS spawns and then removing them… IOW, not having enough content in the new content zones for everyone. There easily could have been 2 or 3 minor conduits up at once the first 2-3 weeks of this invasion, instead of 1 at a time most of the time (saw 2 up at the same time just twice in like 6 nights of trying out running invasions).

@Castor_Raines

But the point is, you can’t defend your loot since the ninja salvager gets no suspect flag. Is the pilot doing the invasion supposed to get their ship Concorded?

You’ve got to beat the ninja to the wreck. Noctis with max skills, t2 tractors are faster than MTU/Packrat/Magpie/any other tractor, salvagers cycle faster than any other ship’s salvagers, etc. etc. Just pray that CCP never changes the rat AI to start targeting the Noctis (so far, so good).

@Zane_Chakaid

I originally posted this in the WTM forums, but figured I’d share with everyone.

Great stuff there, love the assessment and the info on the em/therm/kin/expl breakdowns. Thanks for sharing.

[Mannochmore]

The horror.

[Vol_Arm_OOO]

I disagree, this expansion has a lot to do with players leaving. Whatever the root cause of the loss of players - plex price, capital proliferation, the softening of the game, etc. . ., this expansion does not address those issues in any meaningful way. Consequently, CCP is offering content that no one asked for or wants. Its kinda like trying to paint a house that is burning down. The numbers speak for themselves. People simply dont want what CCP is providing. And the worst part is that they just dont seem to get it. They just double down and hope that somehow the players will see the light. I’m just wondering how low the numbers can get before eve becomes non-viable. Sure there were numbers like this in 2007 but eve had a lot smaller universe and there was also hope and expectation that it was going to get better and bigger. Now, no one thinks eve is going to grow.

[Chan_aar]

@Vol_Arm_OOO

CCP is offering content that no one asked for or wants.

See also

• Resource Wars
• NPC Mining Teams
• Pirate FOB’s

Recent content development displays that CCP seem to be more interested in using new toys / updating their CV’s with flashy highlights than listening to their playerbase.

[Dragos_Highwind]

As stated the numbers likely have nothing to do with this expansion, the numbers likely have more to do with PLEX prices and Null Sec changes (or lack thereof) and honestly it’s not a bad thing. Those account numbers are very likely alt skillfarm and roqual accounts that were left to go alpha. The abyss and trig content is very good content for new and highsec playes and helps with their retention. I’ve seen countless players excited to try it out when the invasion hit’s their sector.

That said, if the salvage and payouts don’t get fixed that will quickly fade. Risk without reward is a potent turnoff.

[Darth_Cruz]

I love the diversity of the EVE universe and the choices each different player can make but forcing a player to not play because they have not taken the road of PvP in big wars for corporations and null sec is not on, I pay real money to enjoy playing it relatively safe staying in high sec doing missions and PvE specifically to not have to keep starting from scratch. Now I am stuck in a station in an invasion that no one cares about fighting not able to leave.

[Tipa_Riot]

@Darth_Cruz

I am stuck in a station in an invasion that no one cares about fighting not able to leave.

Lol, but you know where the undock button is on the UI?

[Brigitte_Schmidt]

CCPlease make the NPC ships warping out lockable\targetable. We can do that to player ships, so why are NPC’s immune from the lock when they engage a warp?

Few Major conduits are totally bugged because there’s a frigate stuck WITHIN an asteroid rock formation who engaged the warp and there’s nothing a player can do - it’s embarrassing.

Or at least introduce a fail-safe “self-destruct” mechanism if NPC is longer than two minutes in the “engaging warp” state.

[Brigitte_Schmidt]

CCPlease, we just finished the World ARK.

BUT with one big, “awesome”, surprise:

• No wrecks being spawned.
• Additional 3 waves (+100) ships on the field.
• ???
• PROFIT? No!
• 3 DC’s from clients who never DC’d before! They were stable 100% of the time.
• The World ARK, after completed, is not named “ROUTED” or similar - it just disappears from the overview.

[niters_rocks]

I agree that CCP shouldn’t pander to people but then the content won’t be used/ used less… so as feedback as to why many people aren’t bothering to run it, most of the reward being stolen with no counter unless you have multiple accounts would be a reason.

Out of interest would you be against a change in mechanics so that salvaging wrecks that aren’t yours flags you as suspect? This way you can take the loot/fight without having lots of accounts

[Tipa_Riot]

There is a solution, mine the asteroid.

[Quor_Dresden]

Not sure suspect flags are going to be much of an issue anymore. Last few days I have noticed a huge jump in invasion forces in systems. So much so it’s hard to keep up with the waves incoming. Takes no time to find another group if no new waves show.

With this increase it should be far more dangerous for small ships to run around ninja looting.

[niters_rocks]

you would hope but the agro mechanic means the NPCs only target people that would get payouts, so you have to be doing dps or repping to take agro (unless they are the only people ongrid)

its very safe for no tank noctis to sit in the site provided there is a fleet that will pull all the agro switches. In majors you can very reliably bounce the agro between 2 nesters to tank the waves

[TehCloud]

Gotta admit I’m impressed. Adding 100+ new ships to the World ark, but they don’t even create wrecks.
Did someone smoke too much crack when coming up with an idea like that?

The sites being harder I don’t have any problems with. But making you waste so much ammo for no compensation at all is a grade A male cow excrement.

[Sieera_Starwhisper]

That’s just wrong. We were in world ark just 5 minutes ago and the ninja looters are even there. They have absolutely nothing to lose, so why not? If they get aggro, reclone and come again.

[TehCloud]

Ok update after running yet another of these Zorya Challenge things.

Everytime we kill the Zorya, 3 people in fleet drop connection or their game crashes.

Having 4 timed spawns in quick succession before the Zorya and then another 4 waves with the Challenge is a complete cluster of reproductive actions.

Still no wrecks or salvage from these ships. The damage is really high, especially considering that those sites are intended for 10 people. We had probably around 120-150 ships on grid, Ignoring the forced setup of 4+ Logi for 10man content, just the amount of ammo it takes to kill all these ships is insane. And there is not a single bit of reward for doing so.

Ninja salvagers and loot thieves still can’t be dealt with thanks to the new neutral logi change.
If you try and get your loot back, you can’t get repped anymore, Whoever had this idea and thought it was a good idea to implement. Please never have an idea again.

Smartbomb Towers did not spawn for the last site, I consider these the only protection that is offered against these corvettes, so I hoped they’d be always there for the last wave. It at least forces most of these vultures off grid.

The YEET-Towers appear to also be spawning at various location and are not fixed like the sensor and ECM Pylons. I like that. If the other pylons ever get variable positions though, I expect the site to be pure cancer as a single pylon can destroy your fleet.

tl;dr

New Neutral Logi Mechanic makes it way too easy for thieves, whoever came up with that consider yourself -10
Ninja Salvagers still can’t be defended against

THREE People crash out of the game every single time we finish the Ark site.
NO REWARD for any of these 100-150 new ships that spawn. Wrecks & Loot or GTFO.
Site is meant for 10 people, but requires way more to actually meet DPS and RR requirements.
???
PROFIT is rather meager

YEET-Towers are fun though, and cancer at the same time!

I rate this 2/10 and I will most likely let my subscriptions run out again.

Please focus on the roaming fleets, they have so much potential. Especially for clearing up low power and vulnerable Citadels hint hint - It’s called Invasion ffs.

Regards
Cloud

[Quor_Dresden]

Well I guess I should be more specific. I just solo the random groups in the system not the conduits. I rarely see ninja salvage and even less now that there is so many trigs in each system. New waves do tend to prefer to go for the more threatening target, but not always. Making it more dangerous to the smaller ninja ships.

Not that there is any reason for wrecks to be a free for all. Still am waiting for some official reason behind CCPs choice or lack of correction on the subject.

[Brigitte_Schmidt]

@Quor_Dresden

Still am waiting for some official reason behind CCPs choice or lack of correction on the subject.

Good luck. It seems that CCP has a record of ignoring the general feedback related to PvE (and related player interaction).