You’re beautiful, and so are the rest of the CCP teams.
God speed and good luck!
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Very interesting idea. Innovative, but not game breaking. Clever way to transform mining waste into something productive.
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Kudos to the EVE players who have scrutinised the pros and cons of the balance changes. Seems to me, it would be less contentious if you just remove the ‘waste’ aspect of the forthcoming change. Also, unless I have misread it or missed it, it appears Moon Goo can only be compressed by Rorqs… if my take on this is correct, then why are Hi Sec Moon Goo miners in 0.5 Hi Sec systems being penalised ?
And I don’t think it’s been mentioned yet.
How do the values look like when processing on Athanor / Tatara with T1 or T2 rigs?
How far will changes come?
I understand what you guys are trying to do here. But it is terrible update when we speak about player driven content. As well as majority of so called increase make no sense at all.
- Idea or waste is clear, players would have to invest to get better yields etc.
- Double increase or ore in space. Why? Majority of belts just hang around unmined anyway. So what’s the point? Clearly just to show that “CCP is ending scarcity”. I would agree in minor increases in some belts.
- Followed by 2nd we go to increased yields for subcaps, which is increased reward. That is something that sound more like “end of scarcity”, Yet with a waste introduced it’s just a smoke screen.
- Looks like you want to push people into organizing complex mining fleets? And have loads of fun crushing those rocks together? Amazing content, would do that 24/7. This will only benefit dudes who mass multibox 20+ toons. While mining in solo rorqual won’t be worth it anymore. So your plan is to push those rorq pilots into multibox subcap fleets? Would make sense - more account - more euros.
- Most importantly - I am going to repeat that over and over again - we need pilots in space. We need them out in shinny ships. We need claiming high rewards for little higher risk than it is now. Changes you are going to launch here are going to have opposite effect and we will have even LESS stuff in space. You are nerfing rorquals once again. Best content generator in game is going to get nefred again as well as whaling. Fights over rorquals are hard to create already and you want to delete that option entirely. What are you going to propose in return? Nothing? Zero? Other capitals are absolute pain tackle and most of them are killing only because or spywork, not because of random whaling. Not because CCP created oportunities. It is because of very few tireless nerds who keep trying and trying but investing countless hours. Guys like me sat for 2 years hoping CCP will deliver their promises and will make sure space is full of people again. Instead we are getting backstabbed slowly. We are the one who take people out, we are the one who create content for YOUR customers. And you fck us up over and over again instead of trying to make opposite. I am extremely disappointed. If you want this game to turn into PVE shtshow and introduce scarcity again because players are making too easy ISK too quickly - so be it. You have understand one simply thing. One basic thing - YOU DON’T NEED TO BALANCE STUFF WITH CONSTANT NERFS - PLAYERS CAN REGULATE HEALTHY STATE BY THEMSELVES. ALL YOU HAVE TO IS TO MAKE SURE THAT PVP GUYS HAVE MEANS TO TACKLE STUFF AND PVE GUYS ARE GETTING HIGH ENOUGH REWARDS TO STAY OUT IN SPACE AND RISK IT. Get your sh*t together. Start thinking instead of overthinking. I hope this release never sees daylight.
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Okay.
Mackinaw currently has 2 -2% duration bonuses via levelling.
If you consider some arbitrary duration x, this would mean the current Mackinaw’s bonuses, at maximum would give you 0.81x (0.9x*09.x).
Lets assume you mine 1 unit of something in that time, so you get 1 = 0.81x, which comes out to 1.23, or effectively 23% over the baseline yield of the module itself.
The new mackinaw has a role bonus of 12.5% reduced duration, a per level bonus of 5% (mining barge) and a per level bonus of 3% from exhumer.
So this would look like 1 x 1.25 x 1.15 = 1.4375 units per cycle, and the cycle is 87.5% of it’s normal duration, so 0.875.
So from whatever the base cycle/mining yield of the module is, the new Mackinaw gets 43.75% more material in 12.5% less time.
1.4375 = 0.875x
solve for x, and you get x = about 1.64.
So the new mackinaw’s bonuses improve the base rate by 64%.
1.64 / 1.23 = 1.3333333
or 33% improvement.
The numbers are different for ice because the Mackinaw does not get a bonus to ice harvesting from the Exhumer skill.
I’m sorry, but you’re straight up lying through your teeth to justify your position.
It has been made very clear that direct action on the part of CCP was required.
I suggest you cool off, come back in a few days and really dive into the changes.
I only see positives from where I sit.
You sir have just convinced me I was wrong and I admit that. Thanks.
In the same way an abusive parent “loves” their children.
You only hurt and punish the players because you love them so much right?
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You’re very welcome.
It’s a shame CCP presented the changes in the way they did, it’s more difficult for people to come to grips with the changes this way.
i cant wait to form giant fleets of inefficient miners to go disrupt someone elses betls. makes as much sense as those monster fleets that were going to rob reserve banks (instead of people just sellng the keys). does anyone at CCP actually play EVE>
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Bye. Take your beloved Rorquals with you on the way out, I don’t want to see them anymore.
Hopefully this is the right forum to actually put down feedback you guys might listen to, lookin at you @CCP_Swift. Anyway my main is a rorqual pilot and that will not change. I like that it is no longer gonna be a solo mining ship and you guys are trying to make it into the support role it is supposed to be. However all I see in this are nerfs across the board and next to no buffs for boosting.
FIRST Is the new fitting requirements for the industrial core. These are just absurd. I could see a small increase but changing powergrid from 55K to 150K is insane. 150K is over 1/5th of the fitting space for the rorqual basically cutting off the fitting room for tank at the knees. SO not only are you removing the mining to make it viable for the price point, now you are forcing players to remove tank so they can actually fit the MAIN module that makes a rorq a rorq.
NEXT, moving compression to a module. this removes another of a viablity of using a rorq in a fleet. It also proves that you guys dont understand how many people mine in fleets. Typically I anchor my rorq on a rock towards the middle of a belt and core up, then the other players that are with me will deposit their ore into my fleet hanger, compress it themselves, and take it back out. So tying it to a module that cant take out of any hanger except the main hanger is killing another fleet activity that you claim to want to promote. if you are gonna keep it as a module, allow it to load from the other hangers for the love of god. You love to push out these QOL updates that limit the amount of clicks then add this stupid module that will increase what was 2 clicks to 20 clicks, drags, and general ■■■■■■■ about to get the same result.
ALL STICK AND NO CARROT As I stated before, I am fine with rebalancing to be more of a support, but when you guys only increase the boost by 4% and all these other drastic nerfs and reductions, that is just a slap in the face to us that actually want to help boost fleets and make it a group activity. It is also another punch to the viability to actually putting this 10b isk asset on field with no real payout with it.
Compact industrial core While I like that this helps out the orca especially with its cost and the fact it needs capital parts, making it have a 5min timer just like the full core is just another in a bad string of decisions. Without a panic button. the orca is much to squishy to use this module anywhere other than highsec. That might be your point but once again just a slap in the face to all other parts of space. I would recommend decreasing it to even 2.5min or better yet 1min as a COMPACT core should be doing.
anyway thats most of my rant and what I have issues with these changes
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Okay, I get it, and I agree.
Assuming a meaningful portion of the mining base starts fitting faction lasers, this will result in a disruption of the existing gank meta and it will become sustainable to maintain more alts per ganker.
That makes sense to me.
I’m still less concerned about the loss in Skiff tank in and of itself, but I acknowledge that if there’s also a significant increase in the prevalence of faction lasers, it may lead to gankers being sustainable at higher levels, which will in turn disrupt miners who are not using faction lasers.
I don’t doubt there will be an increase in use of those lasers, as there is now a strong incentive to use them.
I think/hope the limiting factor will be supply of faction lasers, because so long as they’re readily available, some miners are likely to use them, and therefore lose them.
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Thank you, it is good to see people look above the actual changes to look at what could happen and how it changes the balance of the game. I respect you for it a lot. o7
@CSM
So what if we don’t do any of the waste nonsense BUT we add anti-asteroid guns (lasers, launchers, idk, you name it)?
You fit your ship for rock debauchery.
You go there.
You mess their mining operation.
You gtfo.
Leave the harvesting gear alone. Hmm?
I can see the point of every change, but here is the thing. There are some mining/industry players that was skilling for YEARS a roqual mining to have the “end game” ship. Now they are leaved with this solution making them 100% a support player/miner role, and there is a lot of miners that wanna miner alone, yust watch a movie or something in meantime (with big risk in meantime) meaning that game is gonna loose some players responsible before for economy weath and balance with some unique play style too. problems:
- players SP spended for ship that is not worth it for most of players
- some will stop playing
- its gonna push prices for EVERYTHING up (less players are gonna be able to mine needed ammount of minerals)
- isk in bilions investment in ship that are gonna be propouble at least half of the price in coming future
propositions that can easy help:
- reimbursment of SP (meaning free SP for the exhumers) for roqual players if they want (role changing of the entire ship with few milions SP is a big deal), we not talking a bout 1 skill putted for this ship but a big bunch of them
- NEW CAPITAL MINING SHIP (capital mining ship, even not for drones, but big some kind of big laser/AOE mining) with big ammount of mining with big isk risk reward
- NEW MINING ROLE FOR TITAN mining the entire belt with small portion, but at a time/ mining moon without the need of extraction etc. there is bunch of ideas
But at the end, capital pilots are the ones building the game the most (veterans, knowing the game, and building most of its economy system) so why they are always hitting the most in all updates? in other games if you hit the end game (last lvl etc.) there is still something to do by achieving this. Here our end game are capital ships, but you putted they role to be only supportive in mining. Its not good for most of the players types, most of us are not gonna put few milions SP and lfie time (and dollars for OMEGA in the meanitme) to be pushed only to this role. We want more! Yustice for Cap Pilots! 
How you are gonna look at the player that was skilling for rorqual for last YEAR to have better ISK income machine, and now reading the new changes feeling like… seriously do something for rorqual players, or its gonna affect EVE economy and well beaing more than you thing.
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That would also mean no longer doubling the resources in belts and anoms. You sure that’s what you want?
Yep. Rorquals have to sit in dangerous space to compress moon ore.
But there is no change for hisec. It’s not a penalty.
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I see the DOOM cycle is in full rotation!
I still don’t understand the drama over Scarcity. From my vantage point in HiSec, I can go to any of the trade hubs and find abundant amounts of minerals and ores for sale. After some initial volatility, prices have largely returned to pre Scarcity levels. I can buy what I need at the hubs and still make a profit in Industry. Yes, in some cases, what I make is now different but that has always been the case as markets change. The fact that large and capital ships are still priced below material costs demonstrates just how over abundant supply remains in those categories. Mining output pre-scarcity was unhealthy for the economy. Returning to that level of mining output will simply see a return of the over supply problem.
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question still remains. what is the goal of all this dev activity? seems like a lot of work without any specific purpose being explained. who is supposed to benefit from the changes? is this an economic thing? if so, surely it didnt have to be so complex. is it a new gankfest for rorquals by reducing their tank? (and the tank on other mining ships)
who wanted these changes?
why bother with waste calculations, if the intent is to add ore and then remove it, just dont add as much.
just seems like a lot of effort but no substance
oh. and by the way rorq pilots. stop complaining about all those skills you learned, you got value for them at the time , but wait, you get to learn more skills so you can compress…