The only thing CCP gives an ever living ■■■■ about is placating the jita filiment gangs that want to see hulks go boom.
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its space dust, it disappears like a puff of smoke
@CCP_Psych @CCP_Swift @CCP_Dopamine @CCP_Rattati @CCP_Paragon
I thought this was supposed to be a PLAYER DRIVEN sandbox???
Seems like you all keep saying that and yet do not listen to any players even the ones we have elected to represent us to you
Why is it Mining has received the least amount of attention than any other aspect of this MMO we all love
You have added dozens of new ships for PVP(mostly), Exploration, etc and yet there is only the same 3 ships to mine with, with the exception of the Venture which really is only for new players really
All mining has ever really gotten the short end of the stick, never have we even been given a carrot on the end of it, just nerf after nerf in mining as a whole
I hate to say it, to be honest why dont you just go ahead and close the game down already, it seems that is al youre doing anyway you just keep driving away your player base with each and every major changes you drop
Maybe its not necessarily your fault maybe whoevers in charge makes you do the things you do
Id rather see the game shut down then ran into the ground and turn into a piece of garbage, its what i would do for a suffering animal put it out of its misery so it wouldnt suffer anymore
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I’m not sure what balancing out the Orca means. What is left for solo miners to use. I pay for multiple Omega to have a small hisec corp to mine. it’s already very difficult to not get ganked. Orca in hisec get ganked by a set of Catalysts, so if CCP reduces the amount of org it can hold thereby reducing the total amount of DPS it takes to tank. What’s left. traveling back and forth using cans?
How far back will you push the solo miner. I hope this is not yet another hit on solo miners.
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Orca was never that. Not even close. Period.
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By your way of thinking then ALL command ships including pvp should only be there to boost, not participate in the activity they are boosting and should also be locked in place when being used
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Can I have everyone’s stuff?
Plenty about the patch bother me - but the waste concept is just ■■■■■■■ stupid, in both mining and compression (it’s stupid in reprocessing too, but it’s always been there as far as I recall, so at least they’re not screwing people over there).
I won’t comment on the industrial aspects of the patch, because they’re actually not in my wheelhouse. But I’ve done enough resource gathering in Eve and other games to know when something’s very rotten in the state of Iceland.
CCP crows that scarcity is ending, but that’s an outright lie. Belts/anoms/moon pulls will have double the ore (Bigger rocks? More rocks? Both?), but then put the base mining capability to basically ruin half of that double - taking us down to base rate anyway. Sure, if people want to put more isk on the field (at risk), they’ll get a bit better - but otherwise we’re working on a base of there effectively being no better off. Instead of introducing complex and challenging concepts (let’s look at their history of implementation for a moment), why not just leave the spawn exactly as it is now, and increase yield for those who’ve seriously invested in the skills? Instead of punishing everyone, reward (minorly) those who’ve really put the effort in.
On the much hyped compression for gas an moon ore - what a complete non-event. People will continue to deal with both exactly as they do now - they’ll reprocess or manufacture locally, with the output from those activities being substantially smaller than the input (in terms of m3).
I get the fact that they want to rationalise the Porpoise/Orca/Rorq. Giving them a useless compression array (it’s too slow, the waste is too high) doesn’t do it though. Nobody uses Orcas in lowsec/nullsec already because they’re simply too squishy (they survive in highsec mostly because the cost to gank a well piloted one before Concord comes to save the day is, by and large, higher than the benefit of killing them), putting a device on them that prevents them from escaping (however that may be achieved) when local spikes negates the potential benefits of the new modules.
Rorqs already copped a massive nerf a few years ago. Right now, you’re still looking at putting 10b+ isk on grid every time you take one out, with a “no escape” module on it which is then countered by the PANIC module, giving a smart rorq pilot a chance to pick up the bat phone for reinforcements. The risk vs reward is probably still in favour of the ship - but it has to be, or nobody will use it. The proposed changes as they currently stand take away too much and don’t give enough back as compensation, we’re going to just end up with another ship that nobody flies (and that people will simply extract the skills for, I know exactly what my rorqual alt will be doing instead).
The changes to Expedition Frigates/Barges/Exhumers/other industrial ships - these just don’t have any sense to them. There’s no sense of “over-riding goal” to the changes, they don’t help certain ships specialise better (if you’re going to use resource-specific holds, just give the Endurance an ice-only hold for the love of god, and a prospect a gas-only hold - at least that’d actually make some sense). Nobody in their right mind will put a Rorq in a gas cloud, and nor are they going to compress gas with one given the losses. I’m also 100% positive that there’s been no groundswell of people crying out for Barges or Exhumers to mine gas, or that the game was in a poor place for not having them. I’m also damned sure that taking gas harvesting away from the Venture (along with forcing them to waste other people’s resources if they mine ore) absolutely kills one reasonable revenue stream that alpha pilots could have if they wanted to focus on being a resource gatherer.
For those who say “bah, the carebear miners are whinging again”, just remember - you don’t get to fly your shiny ships (or your cheap gank boats) if people don’t harvest the resources required to manufacture them.
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You know what this absolutely kills? The bait Procurer doctrine. Hull tank with two webs, a disruptor and a scram, it was hilarious seeing a few prccs grabbing hold of a Loki and beating it to death with light drones (some of them only T1 drones at that)…
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Following on from my bait proc comments earlier, we used to fit useful mining procs with enough trouble to make people think carefully before taking us on - that included a mining laser upgrade II, two strip miners of whatever type took your fancy), a T2 bulkhead, three hull rigs and then enough mid-slot “fun stuff” to hold an attacker until either a) the cavalry arrived) or b) your light drones could take them down. It wasn’t the most effective mining ship in terms of m3 per hour, but when you factored in the smaller number of losses when mining in hostile territory, it was overall a net positive.
Removing the mid-slots means the proc simply can’t do this any more. And the Skiff is a ~300m hull vs the 30-50m isk for a proc hull - so the economics go out the window.
A shame. It was a good useful doctrine.
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Dude… absolutely ■■■■ using your lows for tank aside from a single dcu. Those are mining laser upgrade slots.
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If demand rises and supply does not, then prices will rise. This is simple economics.
So, in order for faction items to become cheaper, any increase in demand needs to be outstripped by supply. AND production cost of them needs to stay the same or get cheaper. I’ve not seen anything in the blog yet to indicate that there’s any changes to either availability or cost of the faction modules, so…
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Hard to know what the devs are thinking. You can only speculate - looks a lot like they want to make mining so difficult and so gank intensive that people will just break out the plastic and buy their ISK from CCP instead. I’m still pissed over scarcity for two years - This is worse.
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Guy Guys Guys,
I don’t know why you’re all up in arms…
Wait 6 months while you extract skills and get into hulks etc and basically milk your wallets, patience and good will, and then Dynamic Distribution comes into effect, and then! the 200% roid base you have after this patch is reduced to 30% because u mined the system the day before, leaving u with less roids to mine until mining ships get destroyed in system, to raise the new index.
This is not the last of the nerfs freinds, winter is coming.
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I’ve been too busy with my RL recently to pay too much attention to this
I’ve been through it, and so far my opinion is as follows:
All topics I don’t mention are okay by my standard:
-
Wasteage seems okay, due to the doubling of resources ingame, and different equipment which will reduce waste (giving more reason to use ORE Strip Miners for example)
It’s not a positive nor a negative to me… it’s just meh -
“Removal of all basic materials from R4 moon ore, finalizing the plan of removing basic minerals from moons” – I disagree with that.
Having moons which gave normal build materials in the past was actually really nice, and made the moons worth mining. Just my opinion tbh… -
Compression stuff – Amazing that Gas and Moon Ore can be compressed at all
The amount of time and effort it takes to compress stuff – WHAT’S THE ACTUAL POINT? It’s so slow, I’ll become an old man by the time I’m done… This needs changing entirely, it’s total garbage.
I’m sorry CCP – I’m very very leanient when it comes to defending you guys, but the amount of time it takes to compress is just a big bad bad no no. Please change. EVE is a very grown up mature game, and many of us are busy with family, kids, and work, so we don’t have time to sit doing stupid compression for days… (liturally days) – Currently it’s at 5 minutes base rate. Make it 5 seconds, and you’ll make everyone very happy.
FURTHERMORE – Only being able to compress Moon Ore in a Rorqual is mad…
Think about the logistics of what people are going to need to do with HS Moon Ores
They are not going to be able to transport and move raw ore easily because where they’re mining it in HS, you cannot compress it – Just give the players what they want, and let us compress stuff in a station.
Also the losses from compression are just lame… Stop that, let us compress like we used to. Stop fixing stuff that’s not broken. 100 pieces of X to make 1 piece of Compressed X, with the same reprocessing as 100 pieces of X was perfect as it was. We only wanted compression for Gas and Moon Ores. We didn’t ask, want, or need, for wastage from compression, and NOR did we ask for Rorquals to be involved with only Moon Ore compression.
AS STATED PREVIOUSLY… The large majority of your playerbase are adults, typically in their mid twenties or older, I for one am in my early 30’s, and we’re working professionals, we have kids, and marriages to maintain. EVE is our escape, but with these compression changes, it’s making logistics difficult, because now we are going to need to move stuff around more, taking more time… and time is valuable, especially to working adults.
Now… a question to the EVE Community…
Is there anything else I missed guys?
These are my immediate concerns… Is there anything else I’ve overlooked?
Let me know, I would be very interested to see your opinions on the matter
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Well, since POS’s are no longer a thing… even so, the Commander Core could be set so that it can only be activated when X km away from any other structure. Not that difficult to imagine or implement.
This game has nearly always given the shaft to miners. Are literally all of these people too new to remember Catalyst mining?
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The New Dawn splash with mining command ships flying into the sun makes perfect sense on this patch as their mining capability is being destroyed. Here is why…
Going by the info on ice presented
All ice doubled - Great!
New waste mechanic introduced - ???
Mining Example:
Cycle 0: 10 Ice remaining, 0 in hold, 0 waste
Cycle 1: 8 Ice remaining, 1 in hold, 1 waste
That’s when I noticed the update lists all resources being doubled then repeats it again in the new waste mechanic prior to explaining the waste. I guess the hope is we just see the resource doubling information
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@CCP_Rattati is technically correct here. CCP makes no more money with PLEX costing 2.6m per unit then they do if PLEX costs 3m per unit or 1.5m per unit.
The way CCP make money is through the store. PLEX, packs, skins, game time, etc.
No matter how someone pays for Omega, be it directly through a paid subscription, or by PLEXing their toons, it is paid for with real world money. There is NO other way for PLEX to enter the game.
PLEX is also ISK neutral to the game. At no stage does it remove ISK from the economy, it simply helps it move around. If I pay ~1.3b ISK on the market for 500 plex and then push that PLEX to CCP for my next 30 days game time, the ISK does not leave the game - it ultimately goes to whoever introduced the PLEX into the game by buying it from CCP.
The ONLY way to actually introduce PLEX into the game is through real world money purchase. THEN, and only THEN, AFTER CCP has made their real world money, the plex, once in the game, is traded for ISK.
What some people are concerned with is that with a reducing player base, rather than trying to attract more real-world customers (as opposed to accounts, we all know that many of us have multiple accounts) to play their game, CCP are trying to artificially inflate or protect their income by raising the amount of real world money they make out of each current real world customer by forcing them to have multiple subscriptions to the game in order to prosper.
Should there be a benefit to a real world customer having multiple accounts? Yes, I believe their should be, otherwise they’d never do it.
Should it be necessary for each real world customer to have multiple accounts in order to carry out pretty basic (and necessary for the game to survive) activities? No.
Right now, instead of encouraging us to play more, it feels that CCP are punishing us for playing less. In a game of stick vs carrot, it really feels that we’re getting the stick here…
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I’m uncertain about the vast majority of these changes. I don’t really care if capital industry’s get the hammer for mining - as long as something suitable replaces it. Like, 1:1 suitable. Not now needing 4-5 ships to do the same job, not needing a fleet of miners - are we even sure that’ll happen? Will the former roaqs come back to mine at that scale?
Prices are already a little screwed, especially for new players. Let’s not shoot them further.
Also, double the ore in belts? What about the belts that don’t have ore? Or the systems that had their ores removed/nerfed/etc? And wasn’t the ore reduced by 90% pre-scarcity levels?
You’re only giving us 20% of what we had before? How about you give it ALL back. And in all the systems you removed it, too.
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