High skill point players are not progressing out of highsec

[Tark_Thahal]

@Clavine_South

So the question becomes, why arent these players moving away from doing basically starter level low ISK payout/low risk/low reward essentially starter introduction content, into lowsec, or null, or wormholes?

Maybe they don’t like lowsec/null. Maybe they are casual players who prefer to hang out in hisec. Maybe they are null/lowsec players taking a vacation in hisec.
And maybe EVE is a Sandbox and what they do is none of your business?

@Clavine_South

What is preventing them from leaving the nest and spreading their wings?

Maybe they already left the nest and they play as and where they wish. Maybe they train other pilots in hisec.
Have you tried to convo them and ask?

@Clavine_South

This is what I would consider to be a failure on the part of the game to nudge these players out of the nest

I would consider it a Sanbox success. No one is to “nudge” anyone anywhere in a game where you’re supposed to play as wished without ‘right’ or ‘wrong way’.

@Clavine_South

and it is affecting newbros and newgals

It is not.
“Think of the children” isn’t a valid point.

@Clavine_South

Because this is obviously a huge problem

It’s only a ‘problem’ in your mind.

@Clavine_South

You arent really just competing with other newer players

All space is open to all capsuleers. There is no segregation in New Eden.

@Clavine_South

but when all of the sites are eaten up by the long term players, who should be progressing into lowsec and nullsec or wormholes, are obviously not, its a problem

There is no such suggested ‘progression’ in EVE. Moving to lowsec or nullsec isn’t a graduation, it’s simply a decision in line with the sandbox. There is no ‘problem’, only jealousy on your part.
If you want more sites then you need to look for them. Preferably without whining about other players.

@Clavine_South

Why the hell are there so many old long term high skill point players mining with billions of ISK worth of ships in highsec?

Because they can and are allowed to.
You need to understand the concept of Sanbox.

@Clavine_South

How has the core game failed to nudge and push these players out into null and lowsec?

In no way has the core game failed to do anything.
Nothing is supposed to nudge anyone anywhere. Again, Lowsec and nullsec are not graduation areas.

@Clavine_South

Is the risk/reward payout not good enough for them to replace ships if they get ganked?

That’s right.

@Clavine_South

Are the lowsec stovepipes and bottlenecks areas just camped to death?

I don’t need to find out.

@Clavine_South

Not enough gates heading from highsec into lowsec?

How about they play where they wish and you can dictate to players once you become King of New Eden?

@Clavine_South

Games been going on for 20 years so there is no real estate available?

Most certainly.

@Clavine_South

There has to be some definitive and physical problem to be solved and worked out causing this

There is no problem. The only “problem” is you trying to tell others how and where to play.

@Clavine_South

Some factor or number slider to be nudged in some way

You just love that word, eh?
I love it when my hunny nudges me, too.

@Clavine_South

It’s really bad IMO. Players aren’t proverbially leaving Elwynn Forest to explore Westfall, let alone Blackrock Mountain, they are just farming Hogger endlessly…I will never get this (Data site) quest done until the level 60 players with epic drops stop farming him…

Share the space and don’t try to control what others do unless you can do it at the working ends of your turrets. If those players bug you so much then explode them.

[Githany_Red]

@Tark_Thahal

How about they play where they wish and you can dictate to players once you become King of New Eden?

I’ve met many high skilled player who just now play occasionally and high sec is great for that , they have done all the other stuff and now they found the end game , chilli out and have fun with their space ships .

Obviously there are some never left

In fact there is a lot of skills and isk in high going to waste just need to motivate some of them with short action packed content with a short duration and little commitment.

Now let me think!!!

[Spacetramp_Drago]

Been there done that, had fun in Null with a Sentry Domi hitting Sanctums and Havens etc and I’m currently sat with over 50bn isk in the bank just chilling in HS.

I don’t need to go there anymore so I do a bit of casual scanning and mission running in the little time I now have due to work, very likely like a lot of other older players.

Another plus for using this play style is that you tend to avoid burnout as well.

07

[Tark_Thahal]

@Githany_Red

I’ve met many high skilled player who just now play occasionally and high sec is great for that , they have done all the other stuff and now they found the end game , chilli out and have fun with their space ships

That’s it. The game exists for players and not the other way around. Just because Nullsec/Lowsec exist it doesn’t mean I have to go there. I may go mine in lowsec and explore in Null but then again I may not. It’s my choice, my money and my time.

@Githany_Red

In fact there is a lot of skills and isk in high going to waste just need to motivate some of them with short action packed content with a short duration and little commitment

Whatever floats their boat. That’s why I’m playing this game, because I can do anything I wish whenever I wish, within the constraints of isk/SP.
I only play Open-world Sandbox games because those are the most fun for me and I don’t like to be lead into contrived scenarios, I don’t follow.
If someone’s fun involves “short action packed content with a short duration and little commitment” then so be it.

[Edvarr_Anstian]

Eve is designed to allow all players freedom of choice, so high level players not looking to leave high sec is not a problem, it is a consequence of a completely free choice system.

[Wadiest_Yong]

Hi OP,
interesting topic, although a bit provocative to the “how dare you” inmates.
You’re right, they’re there, running the easy hisec sites, with VNI’s running Refuge sites (always makes me smh). But why do they do it, you ask ?
I can only think of two reasons:

1. risk aversity and complacency
2. true old age, taking it easy

However… does it matter in any way that they do ?

Nope. They can be risk averse and complacent all they want, or be content with their past and present achievements. Maybe they’re just zooming around while helping on the rookie channel - true story, btw. Maybe some of them never ever got past hisec - which is not a judgement, just an observation.

Have fun in what you do, let others have their fun.

[Distaine]

Im just responding to the title. Progressing out of highsec? Thats an idiotic assumption and is cancer to the game.

HIGHSEC IS ITS OWN END-GAME.

Nullsec is completely different and imo totally inferior to highsec. We do not need to “progress”. You need to understand that we would rather not play eve than leave our space and this is one of the major flaws coming from CCP and the CSM. Its not just coincidence that most of the backlash against CCP originates from highsec. CCP should be improving, facilitating, and expanding on the play-styles that we choose and not considering it as “playing wrong”.

[Githany_Red]

Something came to mind, Universe 25.

Maybe these guys are Eve’s beautiful ones
An experiments with mice in the 1950s
In reference to their perfected, unruffled appearances, Calhoun called these mice the “beautiful ones.” Living in seclusion from the other mice, they were spared the violence and conflict that waged in the crowded areas, yet made no social contributions.

[Aisha_Katalen]

@Wadiest_Yong

with VNI’s running Refuge sites (always makes me smh). But why do they do it, you ask ?

You run refuge sites for the escalation which based on what faction space you’re in is either a 3/10 or a 4/10. One could argue that there are better ships for this than a VNI (mostly more powerful ones) but the choice of using a faction cruiser, especially at lower sp or when alpha, makes good sense.

Those same people also, generally, scan for sites which means they could end up doing a Watch site which, again depending on faction, can be quite scary without good tank.

The real question would be why someone would use something less powerful.

[Aiko_Danuja]

Highsec sucks and CCP should delete it or nerf it so people leave.

[Altara_Zemara]

@Edvarr_Anstian

Eve is designed to allow all players freedom of choice, so high level players not looking to leave high sec is not a problem, it is a consequence of a completely free choice system.

There’s a number of highsec ‘islands’ ( Solitude, for example ) that people can only really get to via lowsec. Often with a jump of maybe 3 or 4 lowsec systems between the highsec areas…these are a great way of exploring lowsec for a brief period and what I would recommend for noobs.

The first surprise most noobs will get is that apart from gate camps in a few systems…a lot of lowsec is empty. Which might be one reason more people don’t go there.

[Distaine]

@Edvarr_Anstian

Eve is designed to allow all players freedom of choice, so high level players not looking to leave high sec is not a problem, it is a consequence of a completely free choice system.

This is so blatantly ignorant I just don’t know where to start… do you even play the game bro?

[Wadiest_Yong]

@Aisha_Katalen

The real question would be why someone would use something less powerful.

and add some dedspace mods to their fits…

Indeed, I agree, they should “share” their fun with others who have a 50% chance on the drops . I wonder if they still dscan in hisec.

Mission and DED complex robbing/baiting/ganking used to be fun. Does anyone still do this ? Or has it all dried up and become part of the dust of ages ?

P.S. Aisha, the VNI was just an example, I’ve seen “worse”, anything t2 and t3 up to battleships, lol.

[Aisha_Katalen]

@Wadiest_Yong

P.S. Aisha, the VNI was just an example, I’ve seen “worse”, anything t2 and t3

Sounds like you don’t understand, that’s fine. Using the fastest tool/ship for the job just makes sense. No one cares about one’s misplaced and self imposed “my honoure” fits or ideas. If an orthrus/sac/cerb/jackdaw or whatever else works best for the job, one’s skills and in the faction space you’re in, why use anything less. Personally I tend to run HACS with high grades just because it works better which means it works faster which means more income and less competition issues.

And yes people still bait in those sites, sometimes I get a kill when I got in the mood and swapped to a pvp fit.

[Wadiest_Yong]

@Aisha_Katalen

Sounds like you don’t understand

You wish Min/maxing is hardly a mystery.

In the spirit of what OP mentioned, it is funny to see these totally overpowered - and often underperforming - ships in what is essentially content for the less experienced. Whatever. They can do what they want, not everyone wants challenges all the time. That’s right. I do not mind someone else’s choices, there’s no need to go on the defensive and certainly no need to explain their or your choices.

Btw. one main reason of flying undersized is to push your own boundaries, test yourself, get better at flying a ship and handle a grid situation. Sure, it’s not the optimal isk/hr, and it’s certainly not possible for everything. But it can be creative and fun to get away from the cookie cutter solutions.

[Altara_Zemara]

@Edvarr_Anstian

Eve is designed to allow all players freedom of choice, so high level players not looking to leave high sec is not a problem, it is a consequence of a completely free choice system.

I think there are two completely different factors at play. A noob with just one character may be reluctant to take the risk, because that is the only character they have and they don’t want a killboard with lots of losses. On the other hand, after 2 years in Eve my noob characters ( I have 12 now ) are precisely the ones I send to lowsec, because by this stage those noob chars are somewhat expendable.

I wonder if anyone has looked at it that way.

[Aisha_Katalen]

@Wadiest_Yong

not everyone wants challenges all the time

It’s not a challenge thing, it’s a bit of well known pve you can optimise to perform the best and fastest in, especially because it’s competitive and you very often end up with other(s) in the same sites. If you run lvl 4 missions in a crap fit then you just earn a little bit less, but if you do combat sites with a crap fit pretty much every other runner will outperform then your income becomes VERY low.

If you brought a “more challenging” ship/fit (or you’re just a lowbie with 150 dps) to a serpentis 3/10 and I bring a 700 dps monster that has the range to apply right from when we both enter the last pocket, and the target is a massive structure where loot ownership is based on damage done (NOT on last hit like so many believe) then who do you think it going to own the loot can that potentially could be 280mil?

This is the daily reality of HS combat site running when you use probes to scan for your sites. It’s less of an issue for the basic anomalies you do in hopes of getting escalations but still, the ones that can target the fastest and apply the most dps (or the one that doesn’t need to target at all) will win. And being able to run the escalations quickly just wastes less time.

But please keep saying what you’re saying, it makes my life so much easier I already almost never lose and the more your view resonates with others or newbies, the better for me.

[Ax_l_Thorne]

@Aisha_Katalen

Using the fastest tool/ship for the job

Suppose this is true for people who treat EvE as a job.

Some people play for fun and don’t bother with such efficiency.

[Aisha_Katalen]

I highly doubt it would be fun losing 80% of the sites to other players. As said, combat exploration is competitive by nature. Also there’s nothing less fun about using a ship that works better unless it requires more effort than you’re prepared to put in. In fact, generally, the better performing ships are more chill to use.

[Ax_l_Thorne]

Glad you treat EvE like a job.

Thanks for confirming!