HS Moon mining ore protection system. Will it be?


(Black Pedro) #21

Yes, they work fine to limit bumping, at least for ships that can fit rigs.


(Johnny Boggart) #22

No need to change anything…

  1. As the owner, you detonate the moon chunk so if your corp is big enough to own an Athanor, you might be big enough to have an apporpriate cast of miners ready to get the best of the chunk before others players join the party to steal the ore.

  2. the corp mining ledger will tell you who get what and which quantity…. You can contact those miners and agree a tax with them. Like for exemple, they give you back 20% of what they mine and they keep 80%. If they Don’t agree or Don’t answer, next time, be ready with a gang party of catalyst to make them understand…

It’s your athanor, it’s your ore, I agree but it doesn’t mean people cannot try to steal it from you… It’s up to you to mine it fast or defend it….


(Solstice Projekt) #23

There would be an insane amount of complaints when mining ore from an unauthorized source causes suspect state. It would drive tons of weak, useless miners either out of highsec, or out of the game.

Sounds like a good thing, making room for miners who are aren’t waste of space.


(Anderson Geten) #24

Whut ?

What do you mean by “tons of” ?

If they are allowed to mine, they mine. If they are not, they mine where they are. Sounds like a good idea to me.

ATM the person who installed the athanor in HS has to pay a B for installation, plus a monthly fee and he can’t get money out of it. If he could allow only specific persons to to mine without a suspect timer, that would allow him to make people pay for his fuel.


(Solstice Projekt) #25

Yeah, well, they won’t mine in highsec, then. That would be the inevitable outcome. Eventually.Probably sooner than even I think. vOv

Derp.

For some reason I was expanding this to every single asteroid belt, instead of just moons.

Wishfull thinking, I guess. : - )


(Ima Wreckyou) #26

So everyone in your corp creates a second character on all their accounts and train into Catalysts. You produce a stack of Catalysts and modules for all of them in the refinery. If illegal miners enter the belt you switch to those accounts and kill the miners.

If you have enough people in the corp you will be able to takeout the orcas just fine. Checkout minerbumping.com if you need some info about how to gank.


(Mephiztopheleze) #27

in 0.0 space, ninjas can some and mine your moon belts, so why not in HiSec?
If you want to protect your moon goo that badly, as suggested, train some Alpha accounts into gank cattys and protect your low grade goo!


(Anderson Geten) #28

because in null sec you can protect it while in HS concord protects them.


(Ryan B Thiesant) #29
  1. Asset size is not an indication of Corp size.
  1. Based on the first assumption.
  1. You are right, it’s his athanor, his ore. So why isn’t it come with a suspect timer?

Just like wrecks, there should be a way to assign ownership to the ore field.
a. the owner can release his ownership if he wishes.
b. The corp can mine without penalty


(Lugues Slive) #30

So if your counter to the first two points is that your corp is not big enough to defend “your ore” then what does a suspect timer get you?

Are you going to defend your belt now that they have a timer?
Are you hoping that someone else (CODE. ish) that will defend your belt for you?
Are you hoping that the timer itself will prevent random miners from taking your ore?


(Anderson Geten) #31

this is three possibilities that are are not present now.


(Ryan B Thiesant) #32

yes or sell "mining permits

see above but also - they might just hang around for the lulz… or is it hulls?"

Yes, this is EVE. if a refinery is silly enough to leave something valuable and unguarded, then so be it.

But also looking forward to those that “release the rock for free”.

Ultimately I think there should be a choice.

Please see my, Feature request for this https://forums.eveonline.com/t/moon-mining-notifications-beacons-and-times/

Add your voice there as well.


(Penance Toralen) #33

OP. A history lesson.

A long time ago, jetcan’s did not have owners. If you ejected something from the cargohold anybody could take it. For miners, this enabled pirates to show up in a hauler and make off with the ore. The game was changed, to add ownership. So then the pirate would show up in a rifter, intentionally steal the ore. Attempting to asset ownership of ore - usually resulted in a mining ship loss. And no concord intervention.

In a vague way - what you are asking for is Canflipping Vers.2. Because something/one will come - intentionally to get you to engage. Do you have solid experience with combat? Do you have solid training in attack/defense? Will the rest of the fleet back you at risk? (betting no to all three).

You do have options;

  1. location - pick somewhere quiet, away from the trade-hubs or mission hubs.

  2. time - you set the timer for the generation of the belt. You know where, when and what - have your fleet/friends prepped. Logistical fleet boosts and support, the right skills/crystals. max skill up in the mining drones. And then blitz cherry pick the best. After that - do you really care if they want ninja the omber?

  3. Fleet. you can use this to advantage against a solo thief. Have a MWD frigate get to the best, fleet warp to member. You can be in position as needed, where needed. Frigate swaps into the orca for a mining ship. Repeat as required.


(Anderson Geten) #34

no this is not canflipping.

canflipping is available whenever onecan get the suspect tag.

it goes along with suspect. Really this is not the issue.


(Jenne Wain) #35

What @Penance_Toralen is saying is that if a suspect flag is given to non-corp/fleet members who takes the ore, then there is a new baiting mechanic that will be available for gankers. Fly in, take a roid, get a flag, wait to be engaged, then call in the fleet that’s waiting to pop the miner.

While I sympathize with what the OP is saying, I guess I see this as a tradeoff of HS moon mining. If you want to do this in HS under Concord protection, then the tradeoff is that you can have your ore taken. That’s a good approach at balance IMO.


(Anderson Geten) #36

This is not how it works.
If you get engaged, only YOU have a limited engagement with the player who engaged you. so your fleet comes in and …?
Nothing. They don’t have engagement.

So if the fleet that responds only attacks ONE suspect, only THIS suspect can fight.
Tackle ONE suspect, web+paint him, alpha him with nados, bye bye, rinse and repeat.
Meanwhile the other suspects can’t attack legally.

They already can do it, by putting two carbons in a can from an alt, looting it to get suspects and put it in again.

It does not prevent people from ninja farming your moon. It does not prevent moon owner from farming it, it does not make it more difficult for the corp to harvest their moon, it however makes it possible to defend agains ninja harvesters or to hunt ninja harvesters.

Another possibility is to make wardecced moon not give the suspect flag. That would require however that the corporation that wardecs has something to lose (as people already suggested, a specific structure that needs to be defended to keep the war on)


(Jenne Wain) #37

You’re right. Let me rephrase then. I get a timer in my Venture. You engage me. I go get my Phantasm or whatever else and kill you. Classic baiting, but perhaps more effective since the baiter is seen taking the ore.

And yes, they can already do it. That doesn’t mean that this mechanic won’t add another baiting element.


(Anderson Geten) #38

You can do it already, and this is not an issue. cf station games. But in station games it is possible because you can dock when being pointed. Try to switch ship when I engage you in a real tackler

This would not change a thing.
They can already do exactly the same, thus this would not add this kind of mechanism because it already is present.


(Jenne Wain) #39

If you say so. I’m out.


(Anderson Geten) #40

No, this is not because I say so.

Everything you say that would add is already present.

You can already get a suspect timer at will in a belt. It does not create any issue for miners, just don’t shoot the baiter or get a fleet ready to take him down.