see this is the problem bit. the value isn’t there for normal players.
We all know solo gankers are rare beasts (they exist) but we know many gankers multibox. So are you ever going to catch that one ganker with a bounty alone? unlikely. He will have alts on grid.
So what kind of ship do i need to bring on grid to take on the multiboxer. A blinged out cruiser? At 30mill? At 50mill? 100mill? And if I’m risking that amount of isk a 3million bounty just doesn’t cut it (theres no guarentee id have bounties for everyone of these alts). And when you factor in that you need to track this player down and get things set up for an engagement it gets worse. It could take hours to find them…and the risk on top. Nobody will interact with this for 3mill and standings apart from the players already creating anti ganking content. I mean a player will make more mining and thats just wrong for the level of risk.
And if nobody is going to interact with it then what does it change. Its just another broken mechanic on top of the rest of the broken mechanics.
Well first of all don’t bring me into this spaz-out. :V
Second, aside from the fact that I wouldn’t be flying a 6-million ship all the time (although some career gankers might) so that my bounty is essentially worthless, we come to the problem of there literally not being anyone with the stones to collect it aside from other players like myself, and most of us are friends or at least don’t get in each other’s way, aside from whatever happens on the 4-4 undock meat grinder, which is easily avoided.
I absolutely loved the old bounty system because I got to fly around with like five billion on my head which freaked carebears the ■■■■ out, and no one did a damn thing about it despite there being free kill rights available like a good third of the time. The only thing I couldn’t do was fly a non-combat ship, which I didn’t do anyway since I had wars up 100% of the time. And I needed an alt to shop at the hub, because the killing there is indiscriminate since you’re unlikely to be friends with all of the factions hovering about.
I’ve posted about this before. Anyone is able to test this very easily. Get a decent combat ship, suspect-flag yourself, and just fly around random space. No one will do anything.
As an aside, one possible solution to low bounty values I’ve thought about is offloading some ship/module stats to implants. If what today is a 3% damage implant gave 13%, and that extra 10% was taken from other stats, gankers would likely use them, making pod kills more valuable.
Nah you’re just being obtuse now. The proposition is “50% of destroyed value, plus a power core, plus drops”, not 3 million. I certainly don’t need a 100 mill blinged out cruiser to tackle somebody in a gankfit Catalyst.
Anyway, you had your chance for discourse, moving on.
Mostly true, because there is no economic incentive for doing so. Tell you what. Fit yourself in a cheap, heavily tanked hauler with 30k+ EHP and no cargo, and fly around in high sec. Guess what? No gankers will do anything. Because it’s not an economically valid proposition.
Make it a valid, paying choice, and you’ll see plenty of bounty hunters.
It’s also kinda weird to keep bragging about your wardec and PvP days when you literally haven’t done anything since 2014 and are in a carebear corp.
so the ganker is going to be running around in a providence full to the gills with all the good stuff when he has a bounty on his head? He will be flying cheap as they always do. And you have said the bounty is less than 50% of the ship so that gankers cant exploit it. And the 3mill number came from you. Its your figure. I cant be obtuse when i am essentially quoting you.
And you don’t accept gankers have alts? and it wouldn’t always be a 1 on 1 fight? Whats the name of that guy that multiboxes the 20alts again? What cost effective fit would you recommend for bounty hunting? Im curious.
It appears your definition of discourse is “only type stuff that agrees with me”. All good.
I rather have an intermittent hull module that upon activation, simply could or could not be effective by chance at the very end of hull’s remaining, making it impervious, or not. Like a blockadrnium runnarickus or whatever as simple as any mind could come up to.
All this thens’ and then adds up to what should be simple in the first place.
Not a real or doable idea, just trying to illustrate that all this thens’ and then, bloats complexity in the form of a specific recipe per race, per ship.
I really don’t understand the concern that some innocent person might get zapped at a gate. Don’t they already ??
In my plan, a person would have an entire 2 minutes to get more than a certain distance from the gate. The whole idea is that nobody really has any valid ( non criminal ) reason for hanging around at gates…and that Concord should rightly become suspicious. One could even ( in fact I would ) add an element whereby the time period is dictated by the number of people at the gate.
There are many possible variants…but the main benefit is that people would be ‘allowed’ to attack gankers at gates…without Concord repercussion. This would add a whole new dynamic…as gankers would have to turn up ready for a ‘proper’ fight. One would have some splendid battles at stargates…lots of ships destroyed, and salty gankers would be a sight worth seeing too.
It can’t be any crazier than the current situation, where gate campers sit right under the nose of Concord and are effectively protected by them. I mean that is on par with the local burglar getting a police escort to your house !
As things currently stand, to take on gankers you have to be prepared to spend more ISK than them. So anti-gank is bound to be an ISK losing activity, done for fun ( well, gankers do it for lulz too ) or some sense of ‘ethics’ or being the ‘good guys’.
One does have to wonder just how many Catalysts are sold in Eve every day that the price is so absurdly low.
So I’m a troll because I posted a guide and disagree with you? Lovely
In other words, you can’t handle confrontation and you nope out because you can’t handle debate. Got it
Oh? I’ve PvPed across all secs
As should everyone be risk avoidant if they want to stay alive. High sec is safe for all peeps, if they use common sense and standard practices. You push these lies and victimhood upon others, and then wonder why they die? ROFL.
So basically you’re a krab and you’re better huh? Are the people that are dying better at PvP? Cyilla admitted she can barely keep track of a few belt rats plus overview and somehow the dude burned all the way to her into blaster/scram range and blapped her. But she’s better at PvP? Dudes barely fit a tank, or watch local and d-scan, yet they are better at PvP? ROFL.
When you are in a mining/indy/any ship whose role isn’t combat, your weapons become local/d-scan/game sense. I get why you avoid this. You are just enabling people to suck and then claiming its the gankers fault.
The payoff for AGing is the same as ganking. Salt mining. You can gank the gankers, you just choose not to Interesting how you avoid my pursuit fleet scenario, which actually represents learning how to PvP well in a fleet with doctrine/comms and tactics needed. But then you’d have to admit you’re wrong
Yes, only fools go AFK at easily findable celestials. Go afk at a safe or dock up ROFL. I notice you ducked answering my guide to you for how to AG effectively. Maybe because its all talk? You have all the tools you need to go and fight, but you won’t. Instead you’ll cry to daddy CCP to save you.
Save yourself, or don’t. But don’t expect sympathy when you’re too lazy to even attempt to protect yourself.
Wut. You really do not understand econ and I’m not sure if it makes me pity you or just cackle. I mean both but
So what you’re saying is we should have up to BS spawns in HS so that miners are forced to fit tanks. Got it
How are they being exploited? They are being killed entirely under in-game rules. It is entirely TOS/game supported.
What loophole are the gankers exploiting? I gave you the solution to the HS gate camp, which you ducked entirely because it absolutely shreds your narrative and actually means you have to actually play the game.
You know, if you understood PvP or the game, then you’d agree with my recommendations to you. The fact that you duck it, says everything about your narrative.
The gankers are the lions. But only because people like you choose to be the wildebeasts. You could choose to be a lion too, but you won’t. You’ll cower in your belt, waiting for a death you could have avoided and then crying to daddy CCP after for your revenge by nerfing a playstyle that’s valid simply because you’re bad at the game.
Its almost like maybe players should work together. Like maybe start some sort of corporation? Maybe recruiting people diverse interests so that when you haul, they protect and everyone splits the take. Wild idea.
As I’ve realized, all these peeps crying about ganking are bad at PvP
It was and is. Some of the best times ever had in UO was when peeps tried to kill you in lvl 3 Shame and the other denizens banded together to stop them. Long lasting game friendships came out of that situation, for both sides.
And yes, you learned what to do and what not to do. You want to go deceit bone room on a Saturday night? You’d better roll heavy. You wanna go to Britt x-roads before reset? Roll heavy. You wanna farm Wind garden for hides, pre Lost Lands of course, then you’d better bring friends. Blood ele room? Roll heavy. Yew liches? Roll heavy or have a good recall spot
See, you preach this victimhood mentality. All the tools players need are already in game. Of course you can abide by all of them, know them and still get blapped. That’s life.
All PvP is real PvP. From ganking to null sec wars. How you prep for those engagements is everything. I realize most people are bad at PvP, in terms of really understanding it. When you embrace that the frontline is everywhere, you tend to live a lot longer.
I would love for an actual good bounty system to be in place. With LP and its own corps.
How is it losing? They literally will make more money than they lose…
Again you are murdering people out here You got her dead to rights. She’ll just sling insults at you and dodge now. Its what she does.
Sadly true. Although I was fighting a gnosis with my tristan and started to win, then he dropped his alts on me Proudest death I’d had in a while.
No he isn’t. He simply shredding your narrative
Wut. I literally been killed by a ganker while suspect baiting in me indy. So yes, they will take the bait
No you don’t. I already outlined fits that are just as cheap as catas and can effectively stop them. You ducked the entire post
Let me repeat again: the vast majority of gankers don’t sit at gates, they sit a a safespot or next to a citadel until they know a target is inbound, then they warp to that gate. Mostly because they’re -10 and would be shot by people if they just lazily sit there.
The small time solo gankers who do sit on gates are active and paying attention, all they would have to do is warp off every few mins and then back again. Annoying but not countering their profession.
The only people who would get killed from this are people who are lazy, semi afk and who don’t take this whole “EVE is a PvP game where you can’t even blink” seriously. Now when you devide players in groups, which one fits the above description the most you think. Pve/carebear players or pvpers?
These people would be affected:
People sitting on the perimeter gate in Jita: carebears.
People sitting on random gates afk because their dog needs a hike or a family member calls them and they couldn’t be bothered to warp to a safe or station: carebears
People in a mining fleet where the FC fleetwarps his alts to the gate to jump, but there’s also another player in that fleet but he’s (shocker) afk, and now he’s on that gate: carebears
The only people caught by this are the lazies which, on average, will not be the pvpers or gankers. It’s a stupid idea.
But this is the entire problem with ganking. Gankers have minimal risk and consequence, whilst anyone taking them on has large risk and consequence. Do the maths, and anti-gank is a losing game.
The entire dynamics of ganking is based around it not only being profit-worthy for the ganker, but unprofitable for any persons taking proactive action against them. It is a no win scenario.
And it is this…rather than the fact that anything ranging from someone’s puny Condor to someone’s entire 15 years worth of Eve junk in a Providence can be blapped…that is what causes quitting. It is that Orwellian boot, stamping on one’s face…forever. Far from being an exciting cat and mouse dynamic…it is actually depressing because it seems after 18 years the wildebeast are still standing there apathetically watching fellow herd members get munched.
Nobody joins a game to be a wildebeast…and yet that is precisely the direction in which most are funnelled from the start. So much for all those glossy adverts showing you conquering the universe. No…you’re an inconsequential pork chop in the process of destroying ISK. They could just make a huge bonfire of ISK every day and burn them…that would at least be honest…but no, there is a pretend ‘PvP’ dynamic in which Dick Turpin shows up and burns the ISK for you. This is about as exciting as watching paint dry…because in what is laughably called ‘high security’ you are not allowed to proactively fight back as the police actively protect the known criminals.
So no…you can’t take on the role of Dirty Harry without incurring more loss than the gankers. The dynamic is to simply run away…hide…or just sit there like wildebeast watching a member of the herd be munched. I suspect hundreds who wanted to be Dirty Harry…heck, yes, some real PvP…have simply left the game.
Eve is a game where there are consequences. I like that if I make mistake I don’t just respawn and go again. I like that if I take an expensive ship out for an op I am putting that ship on the line.
This is why I play eve. This is why vets play eve. The thing you think is bad is why loads of people play.
I’m starting to lose patience here. Your situation is simple. If you dislike the game as much as you say then don’t play it. Trying to push changes that destroy the essence of what people love about the game by turning it into animal crossing or whatever other consequence free love fest you think new Eden should be.
You need to adapt to how the game is. The game won’t adapt for you. End of
This entire description of the dynamic is just pure, unadulterated, nonsense.
I’ve no doubt that gankers love the ’ if you get ganked it was all your own fault’ attempt at logic. It avoids being labelled what one actually is…a thief…and creates a backwards rationale in which the thieved is somehow ‘to blame’.
‘Could have avoided’ is of course the mainstay of this bogus logic. But it’s nonsense, because no ship is ungankable. Yet you argue as if it was…the entire bogus ‘blame’ game is based on that. Oh I’ve no doubt some people could better protect themselves…but nobody can 100% ‘avoid’ being ganked, and if they did…CCP would simply change the parameters so they could be !
Yet you create a totally bogus straw man ‘blame’ mechanic that falsely justifies all the ’ If you got ganked it was your fault ’ that in turn portrays the gankers somehow as heroic lions rescuing the Serengeti from stupid genes entering the pool.
It’s all just pure nonsense. The ‘blame’ mechanic is bogus…as anyone can be ganked.
In one breath people say you are free to play the game how you like…and in another they assert a rigid ’ how it is '. If you re-read my posts here…you’ll see what I’m actually doing is pointing out these absurd contradictions. Maybe I just haven’t gotten used to the doublethink yet.
From the single concept of HS market hubs’ geographic location in relation with the ganking traffic bottlenecks, one could conclude that someone up there loves them.
In a closed environment, everything that happens is because it can. In gaming, is because it’s either allowed or encouraged.
It is hardwired in EVE. Criticizing it is a waste of time. Anyone can be ganked and there is no doubt that when a pilot gets close, he falls under their indubitable dominance. It’s like a dress code: you abide to the code, prepare your attire, do and stop doing whatever fits and still can fail on the red carpet.
It is a necessary evil, that just deserves some looking into.
Do I want more of it? It doesn’t matter what I want, for in this case, being a driver for production/destruction results in being the game what needs it.
That, and the fact that I think it’s current mechanics are wrong for making it a potential deterrent of young toons is the reason why I think it’s right to allow the deviation from the topic. --In case someone up there is watching–
Yes but I’m simply pointing out that if person A’s ’ how I like it’ over-rides person B’s ’ how I like it’ then the entire ‘how I like it’ metric is bogus in the first place. People don’t ‘choose’ to be wildebeast…they are slotted in there by a hierarchy of ‘how I like it’ that makes a more general ‘play how you like’ rather suspect…yet still the ’ you can play the game how you like’ meme perpetuates.
All semantics and simply looking for reasons to complain in the cracks.
If you enjoy the game. Play the game.
If you don’t enjoy the game. Don’t play it.
But not enjoying the game continuing to play and spending what must now amount to hours typing on a forum…………
We get it. You don’t like it. And I’m very sorry CCP are not changing the game into your own little utopia. Not much anyone can do about it.
You have been given lots of advice on how to be successful and get more enjoyment out of the game within the existing mechanics. Those mechanics for better or worse are what we have. Not taking that advice and continuing to complain …………
You are the person at work that complains about having a headache but refuses to take a pill for it and just keeps complaining. Lol
