I actually agree, there needs to be way more ship destruction in EVE.
A seat is only useful if one rides the broomstick in a straddling position, instead of firmly planting it a quarter-deep into the rectal cavity.
But you know how angry miners get when you tell them they’re not playing/flying properly…
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Hmm well then let’s see. I said Destiny’s comments were BS without evidence, out of touch with reality. You disagreed.
So please, go back and read what you replied to, and tell me which point of hers is correct and has evidence to back it up. Is it:
- Changes like the recent barge buffs (for example) are massively popular. At least three-quarters of the player base is absolutely ecstatic about them
Or perhaps:
- three-quarters of the player base is absolutely ecstatic about them, and would love it if more such changes were made to the game, up to the total removal of any nonconsensual PvP mechanics in the game. Another 15-20% will be indifferent, and only the final 5-10% will be sad.
Or maybe:
- Ten to fifteen years ago, these ratios were reversed
Those points are what I quoted, and that’s what I said was BS. You’re welcome to provide as much proof of those statements as you can. Actual proof please, not just “well I know all the miners and all the PvPers and all the haulers and I infiltrated a corp once and they said…” - which is what appears to constitute ‘proof’ from Destiny.
Well, that, plus Destiny makes up new numbers for each ‘fact’ needed. They often directly contradict each other but that’s no problem I guess, numbers are very flexible it seems.
Yes, CCP makes their decisions based on how much $$ they think it will bring in, not what’s good for the game or playerbase. Yes, CCP stats show production has always beat destruction by a huge margin. I’ve made those points many times before, thanks for agreeing.
You perhaps seem to be attempting to make some point that CCP is doing things unwisely and that more PvP is needed or something. That’s been my position throughout this entire thread, which Destiny and other PvPers have vigorously opposed with more hot air than anything.
So thanks for agreeing again, although you seem to be going about it in a rather confused manner.
Guess you missed all the “Kezrai you have no PvP kills you can’t talk about PvP here. Kezrai you have no PvP kills so you’re a coward hiding behind your mother’s knees. Kezrai you hate PvP and should leave EVE because you obviously don’t understand PvP” comments. What you stated is exactly what I’m pointing out - that since forum alts are a thing, judging someone’s comments based on their forum alt’s PvP record is foolish. You just missed all the context.
Anyways, thanks for the support even if you bunged it up. Do try to follow the thread and the posts a little more closely next time.
Well we tried as best as we could to get through to you, but it seems that you are a dismissive and ignorant person with completely no idea about Eve, it’s history, who designed the game and why, and why the game is still very good. I will never understand the fact that the gaming market is choc a block full to the absolute brim of games you describe, but you have to come to the ONE AND ONLY game that was specifically built for people like me and demand changes. I could argue that it is in fact you who is not in touch with reality because what you desire is blatantly on the gaming market for you to purchase anytime you please.
If there are any less experienced pilots here and you are looking for Info about the game Just make sure you do not listen to anyone like Kezrai as there are plenty of people who are knowledgeable about Eve and are very happy to help you gain a better understanding.
Eve online isn’t for everybody and it is a difficult game that can provide lots of entertainment, just do your best to stay well clear of the negative people who only have bad things to say, try to find a positive group of people who like Eve in order to improve your experience.
If any newer player ever has any questions, shoot me an evemail, I am happy to help generally.
honest question but is the destruction associated with production factored into the figures? For example if i want to build a t2 module ………I first need to build the T1 module. Which is then destroyed in making the the t2 versions. So if the T1 module is worth 30mill and the T2 module is worth 50mill does the production figure recorded state 50mill? or 80 mill? Because if it is the later and the production figure includes everything built regardless of whether its removed from the economy as part of further production then the prodcution figure has to be more than the destruction figure otherwise it would be broken.
Can you confirm. I mean i assume you can because you have an opinion on this and have been very clear that its bad to have an opinion that isnt based on FACTS.
Please note that is Destiny’s Corrupted’s point you are quoting and replying to, not mine.
As it happens, I called that section of her post lies and BS.
Guess you missed all the actual points made, just like every other time you’ve posted.
I’m done, there’s only so much I can talk to a person who has a complete lack of understanding of what they are talking about.
So let’s see… you missed Destiny’s post where they made this claim:
Then you completely misunderstood my post where I said that was BS with no evidence:
Then you completely misread my second post about it (a reply to Sgt Ocker), which clearly states:
Then, you tried to rip me a new one for making the statement which came from Destiny:
And then when I pointed out that you were trying to rip me a new one over Destiny’s statement, you run away with your tail between your legs saying I understand nothing?
I mean, I’d like to say this is laughable. But sadly, it’s pretty much par for the course for everyone arguing that “PvP is just fine, it’s the carebears that are the problem” in this thread.
There’s a few forum-PvP types out there who demonstrate the ability to understand what they read and make rational replies. Too bad none of them are here to contribute something useful.
Not addressing the point I raised?
Bro you don’t even play 
You can lecture all you want but its clear that envy has poisoned you.
It just rankles deep in your soul that peeps are still having fun playing EVE huh? What’s even more funny is it’ll never be enough for you. You’ll always move the goal posts.
To be clear mate, I just got pity for you. Its clear you loved EVE at one point. I feel for ya. I would suggest stepping away. Its ok bro, you just need a hug.
I would, but there’s two issues:
-
The answer is obvious, irrelevant to the thread topic, and better addressed to CCP than to me.
-
And you’re the guy who can’t understand the concept of “an example”. (50% of destroyed value, in case it’s slipped your mind.) So there’s really not much point in debating with someone who’s either that dense, or not arguing in good faith.
Demonstrate a few shreds of intelligence and something other than a desire to split hairs and argue, and you might get some replies. Otherwise you go back in the troll hole.
It’s totally relevant. Your whole premise is that pvp is broken and one of the reasons it’s broken is that production outweighs destruction.
However if the figures for production don’t take into account items that are produced for further production (I.e consumed in production of t2) then the figure is skewed and it doesn’t align with your assertion.
So since I don’t understand how these figures are compiled I would appreciate if you could explain to me what is included and excluded so I can better understand the issue and your position.
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Huh. I didn’t know you could use Evasive Maneuvers 5 in the forums too.
I don’t believe he’s gonna answer you, cause he knows you have a solid point.
Yennoe what I find funny about ole Kez is he spends so much time forum warlording for a game he doesn’t play. It boggles me mind.
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Production just measures the monetary value of end products. It doesn’t matter what is “consumed” during production because it’s a value-added calculation. E.g. if it takes a Thorax and 1,000 Morphite to build a Deimos (arbitrary numbers for simplicity), the Thorax is “consumed” in the production process but also created when the Deimos is built. Add to that the value of 1,000 Morphite, and you get the final production value.
Edit: this would mean that items used in value-added production (like T2 production) are double-counted, unless CCP specifically accounts for this in their calculation. A Thorax and a Deimos are both end products.
Pretty sure my response was in regard to things you posted. I was simply posting MY opinion on what YOU said.
You went on to straight up disrespect me and try to negate my post with “woosh”.
As I said, the ACTUAL proof, from what CCP makes publicy available IS ALL THERE. It may not use the same wording Destiny did but if you bother to look you’ll find changes made by CCP have led to the Eve we now log into. A mere shadow of the game we loved to hate year after year.
PVP isn’t broken because of production vs destruction - PVP isn’t “broken” at all, CCP just eliminated and eroded away many of the reasons PVP was carried out. Which had a side affect made production safer and easier.
Removing PVP drivers by making PVE activities “safer”, 1 example…
Not too many years ago R64 moons were primarily in lowsec, they were pretty much all controlled by large nulsec groups and the fights to protect them were ongoing and costly to players and groups who wanted them.
Due to CCP “dynamically distributing moons” all over nulsec that PVP driver was completely changed. You now couldn’t attack a pos to take a moon from someone else, you had to attack an alliances sov, take the sov, remove a bunch of structures, set up your own sov, then take the moons.
As it turned out, which should have been more than obvious to devs at the time. Why bother fighting over an R64 moon in someone elses sov when EVERY region had multiple R64’s.
Bottom line,
“PVP isn’t broken”, CCP have simply made it less necessary by design.
NB; Doesn’t address your post directly I know but it might help you understand why many see PVP as being broken due to production. It isn’t “broken”, it just isn’t necessary.
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Wow. So then, these are all true, factual statements, backed up by CCP data. Which is kinda weird since they all apply to something happening in the last month and not even in CCP’s published data yet:
Would you care to point to just one piece of published data that confirms any one of these statements? Any one will do. There’s obviously years and years of them so you shouldn’t have difficulty with it.
Supporting your statement with a fact, I mean. In case you forgot what a fact is, it’s a link or a reference backing up your statement with verifiable data. Rather than typing "the ACTUAL proof IS ALL THERE’ - as if somehow putting it in all caps makes it true.
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It was among the first things I asked: Is it a question of SOV?
Of course I didn’t took it deep enough but I consider this moon thing part of the whole SOV issue.
Of course it’s fundamental to tap into SOV for increasing PVP (destruction among --between-- players) or DBP.
But the thing has been discussed to the marrow and it’s still that untouchable part than only receives interventions to phuk it up. --But makes some sharacters happy–
SOV used to be thy ultimate driver. I just can’t see it happening… not even at the horizon’s horizon.
I welcome anything you guys want to input regarding SOV but be aware, it will derail the thread further than this personal attacking bs.
But hey! as long as it brings DBP, beat yourselves up. It will get nowhere, tho.
Ok, I’ll keep this last response to you simple.
Historically, anyone who watches happenings in Eve closely can predict reasonably well how changes made by CCP will be accepted by players.
EG; When CCP first announced that Rorquals would become monster level miners many players said it would not end well, CCP ignored them and instead listened only to those who saw the potential to abuse them (the minority).
Ok it took a few years but…
The overall result of those changes was “chaos era” and “scarcity”, both of which have a had very negative affects on game play and activity across the board.
Yep there is nothing concrete data wise to back it up but even if the data (when available in a few months) is poor CCP will try to spin it positively. So any “data” CCP make public may not show much at all.
Simply using available data from past CCP experiments can give you an idea on how certain changes will be received, which is all I and I believe Destiny have done.
Take it or leave it… Time will tell.
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I guess I need to narrow it down for you. Please use CCP data to prove one of these statements is factual. All of these were stated as a fact by Destiny Corrupted. I said they weren’t. You disagreed.
- the recent barge buffs (for example) are massively popular.
- At least three-quarters of the player base is absolutely ecstatic about them
- (At least three-quarters of the player base) “would love it if more such changes were made to the game, up to the total removal of any nonconsensual PvP mechanics in the game”
- (Same as previous, plus) “Another 15-20% will be indifferent, and only the final 5-10% will be sad.”
- Ten to fifteen years ago, these ratios were reversed
You also said “the ACTUAL proof IS ALL THERE”, in regards to these statements of Destiny’s. Please back up your statement. Either that or admit you got it wrong, re-read the convo, and try again with more understanding.
No apologies necessary. I understand that people these days aren’t really used to doing more than spouting off their favorite opinion at any opportunity without bothering to do any homework or fact-checking in advance.