Speed tank, for one, but I won’t pretend I’m psychically able to predict the meta. It’s quite possible this won’t improve the situation of HACs much, in which case I hope CCP buff them. They indicated at fanfest they were considering doing just that if the T3C changes didn’t help them much.
That’s kind of a problem with the Ishtar specifically and drone-boats in general. CCP indicated in the latest Carrier nerf threadnaught that they’re looking at changes to how drones interact with PvE.
I don’t think that’s the point, you keep a subsystem or two in your cargo if you’re swapping from travel to combat or to run different sites, but mostly people will keep their spare fits in a station or Citadel. Now they just don’t need six different rigged T3 hulls for their six different fits, they just need the different subsystems and rigs.
Yes, because site running was clearly the extent of the problem T3C overperformance presented in the game… right. Well, everyone has their own little corner of the game I guess.
I’m sure myself or someone else will happily buy them off you at a discount!
youre getting confused we were talking about cloaky gank fit which is why i was talking about buffer tank
you tried to argue that local reps would be better for ganking
im not gonna be running level 4s with a cloak am i
[quote=“Cade_Windstalker, post:713, topic:8414”]
This is just false. The Proteus gets bonuses to overheating and can overheat for longer. The only way a Deimos is out-tanking an overheating Proteus is if you’ve fail-fit the Proteus.
[/quote]is there any other way to fit a proteus anymore
[quote=“Cade_Windstalker, post:713, topic:8414”]
If you run Blasters you get the same disparity, and if you’re running a Blaster Deimos in a L4 mission you’re asking to lose it.
[/quote]nope im talking about 250mm rails
no im talking about 2 fits
1 for level 4s
and 1 for cloaky ganking
the 2 reasons i explained i trained proteus for in the first place
i think youre confusing yourself
so to clarify
deimos is more suitable for level 4s than proteus
proteus has a tiny bit more dps
and better warp speed
but deimos is stronger in every other area and is cheaper and doesnt cost sp if you die
the thing you said where proteus doesnt have better warp speed shows you have fit the proteus wrong
because you should be using the warp speed sub anyway
if youre not using that then you lose a low slot so idk how you can even try to compete with a deimos without that lowslot
for cloaky ganking you lose 60k ehp of buffer for a couple hundred dps overheated
unless you go with active tank which is asking to die
Apples and Oranges. Why one ship is or isn’t popular can be due to a number of reasons. From a PVE perspective people could talk things like: cap stability, range, moveability. Engageability, damage application, tactical options and current meta, could be topics for PVP focussed discussions. Just as examples, which not nearly grasp either PVE or PVP fully.
Additionally people might be influenced by other peoples choices, be it unchecked hearsay or after the well reflected rational thought.
On top of that it isn’t easy to measure their popularity purely in numbers from Zkill, because these numbers don’t tell us wether they are used heavily in large fleet doctrines or in a specific role with small gang warfare. Just because a ship doesn’t hit the Top 20 most used ships on Zkill it doesn’t mean it serves no purpose or is broken.
Their class is called “Heavy Assault Cruiser”, which could insinuate one of two things:
them being HEAVY (assault) CRUISERS in terms of advanced defensive capabilities
them being _HEAVY ASSAULT (cruisers) _ in terms of unusually high damage output
Since we have 2 of each faction, you could say that one of them should always be the insane damage dealer with paper-like tank and the other a heavy brawler kind of ship with mediocre dps. It would seem that you can already fit them like this, but we all know DPS on paper doesn’t say much and almost the same for active tank stats alone.
One way to go might be to
buff some of the “Damage HACs” damage application and (ever so slightly) agility
buff the “Defense HACs” capacitor and resistance to energy warfare (while possibly nerfing their damage output a bit)
Since the Deimos, Cerberus, Vagabond, Ishtar, Vagabond and Sacrilege all being decently used, I can’t see the pressure to change anything more on them.
Zealot and especially Muninn and Eagle could need some thought and or love in regards of fitting options. And that’s it. Continue to play. It feels like we are having more discussions about stats then actually trying things out
To be fair, if Fozzie and Rise were not so stubborn about that bonus when they balanced HACs a while ago, there wouldn’t have been such an issue with that class of ship. A greater reduction to signature radius and a bonus to the speed of afterburners would have fixed HAC’s back then.
Yes, this would be an absolute must for solo. The new Tengu is very obviously a ship made to be flown in droves now, but for the sake of others please allow these to do lower DEDs.
So the actual subsystems in our hangars we lost -no reimburse. I cannot found any trace… searching “Tengu” returns nothing. My net worth dropped 2B instantly after re-balance. So the loose subsystems in hangers, destroyed, and the ones in the ship or ship cargo hold are kept but converted. In all 8000 SP reimbursed. Doesn’t seem right to me. Would there have been another form of compensation I didn’t see? The subsystems I had in hangars were quite an investment. Not like critically huge ISK but some money none the less.
I dont understand how you get the DPS to do these reasonably in a Tengu lol it is just not the ship for this task now. Gila actually works fairly well, and i have a sorta permatank that can run 5/10 and below and laugh through it…
I don’t get why you are finding it so difficult to understand, and I can’t explain it any simpler than I have done.
If you can’t be bothered to read and comprehend my explanation, don’t just keep arguing for no reason. Go and compare the subsystems now with how they were before and prove to us that the tengus ability to land quickly on grid, has not been removed (or a least, nerfed to the point of uselessness). The proteus is the only ship that retains the same ability to warp fast, without having it’s align time nerfed into the ground.
Right, so I am slightly more relaxed after running a Standard Sleeper Cache in my new Tengu Fit. Still not too happy with the need to do a considerable refit in space when in red NULL but at least the tank holds running the site using the shortcut. It was quite obvious the lower resists do impact quite a bit but the tank held comfortably and we’re cap stable which is good and I can even run a +20 coherence rig with a T1 Cap Control rig. Having 165 coherence obviously gives a good bit of headroom…
Hope to find myself a Superior today or tomorrow to try…
