Which is not exactly true, as the gambling part threw the deadspace and faction module market out of balance. Being on the receiving end is not that nice (I missed the opportunity due to RL commitments).
Dont you feel that you gamble when you run those sites? The next pocket may be the last one for ship and clone.
Isnt gambling addicting?
Fair enough, nothing is isolated. Even the low-cost Triglavian ships will affect the market for equivalent role hardware eventually. I think though, while the mutaplasmids will mix up the high-end module market some, I don’t think it will have that profound an effect long-term given that it also consumes an item for every item it randomizes. Some specific items will change dramatically I am sure, but on whole the market will adjust, although until CCP implements a functional market tools to trade them and find their value efficiently, I think mutated modules will remain a niche thing to actually trade. Most people using them will just buy the mutaplasmids and roll themselves until there is a fair and transparent way to trade them.
However, the current spike in many faction/deadspace items comes mostly from massively increased demand to fit the ships running these sites (and to replace losses), not increased consumption by mutaplasmids in my estimation. CCP has definitely succeeded in juicing the destruction numbers this month which we will see on the next MER and will be no doubt unprecedented in scope. That is something at least.
I hope next abyssal style pockets will vary more in look and environment, i mean most of star systems in universe are binary and in eve almost everywhere we got 1 star systems… We got now those incredible looking (at close) stars, so maybe pockets near them? Or near shattered planets, moons, some ice fields.
Maybe next one will be drifter pockets or rogue drones with giant structure, bases in the background.
Black holes, neutron stars, red giants, brown dwarws, bigger sucking matter from smaller object, there’s plenty of possibillities of incredible environments and thx to that dungeon style gameplay everything is now possible. Im really excited.
Also stargate building could be developed to that idea, lets say with possible multiple stargates connections to one system so different corps need to compete inside
Not true. Cyno itself does nothing aggressive.
Yea, in addition to ‘simple cyno’ you need players willing to protect and defend you. And what game mechanics prevents you from having such friends in high-sec?
And don’t try to say that you need cynos and dreads to defend yourself in high-sec. 
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Absolutely. You can even follow the trail of your customers and see how they are re-buying faction modules after losing another cruiser.
Mutaplasmids would have provided a chance to shake up the meta while being a massive material sink, but given their extremely low droprate, high chance creating a worthless brick and the contract system being a pain in the ass for trading mutated items, it was all just a lot of hot air for nothing.
After the hype is gone, which will be soon if nothing big is changed, everything will go back to normal, apart from probably leaving a lot of players behind in a state of confusion about the weird trip they’ve taken.
About Triglavian ships: the general price will go down and I’m not even sure how much we’ll see them in use compared to other ships. Looking at how miserably many players died to AD rats, I wonder how many will actually manage to put Damavik/Vedmak/Leshak to good use, as in they’re happy with their own results when flying them. As damage dealers they are not an easy ship to fly and certainly require higher than normal situational awareness for small gangs, while for the typical 10 vs 1 situations, there are simply better ships for the job. While potentially being powerful in a number of niches, the average player will stick to an easier concept I think.
The entire thing feels weird. First CCP shocked the players who were generally against the concept of AD, by introducing it in the first place. Then they baffled the ones who were up for it if done right, by ignoring most of the provided feedback before launch. Then came the time of the goldrush, everyone was happy, extreme short term profits, everyone wanted to lose a ship in AD because it is cool. What is next?
I am not actually sure where we are at this point. Player losses in the sites went down which could simply mean that more people learned how to not die in there or it could mean that less people are running it. Certain market data indicates that it would be a mixture of both.
Edit:
If I had known the exact mechanics before launch, I’d probably suggested to make this a 3 week event rather than a permament part of the game. Reusable for other events, but that’s it.
The really sad part is that the replayability value of abysmal pockets is very low. Unless a player intends to become a professional grinder for ~reasons~, PvErs have better places to invest their time for their preferred risk/reward.
Abysmal pockets and other high-end PvE are like those hitech toys children play a lot for a week or a month after Xmas and then are thrown into a drawer and never again see the light of day while the child keeps playing with the toys he actually plays with.
Back when I was a child, one of the boys in my classroom had a rich father so he always could show up the latest electronic toys, whatever they were. But what made everyone envious and the thing he was really proud of was his Playmobil sets. He had literally over 200+ klickies and God knows what many sets -the pirate ship, the police station, the western fort, it was awesome. Some boys went to his house for an asignment and was impressive, and he was very, very proud, not just for having so much Playmobil sets, but because he played with them everyday. Go figure, with 200+ klickies, he even made battles between standing armies… 
Guess that CCP developers tasked with PvE never Lego’ed and never Playmobil’ed. 
Concord.
No, really. Concord.
I know people love to cite Concord as providing some sort of safety in high-sec, but it doesn’t and isn’t meant to either. It’s a punitive action, a mechanical response. It does one thing and one thing only: it enforces a threshold of damage you have to commit in a limited timespan. That isn’t the same thing as safety. Similar, yes, there is some overlap, yes, but it isn’t the same thing.
Safety, as commonly considered, is being able to actively defend, or proactively defend yourself. The cloak + mwd is a measure of safety. Having scouts in adjacent systems is a measure of safety. D-scanning is a measure of safety. Shooting hostiles before they can lock is a measure of safety. Concord is not.
In nullsec, you can have an alt and corpmates watching your abyss exit, alliance and fleet members ready to warp to you to help. They can actively fight off intruders, so when you emerge from abyss space, there’s just interesting wreckage being looted in the area.
In highsec, if you emerge from abyss space with a suspect timer, there isn’t nearly as much they can do to help you. Maybe some bumps and neutral logi to give you a fighting chance, but if someone lands a small fleet to ambush you on exit, Concord ensures that it is just you verses the fleet. Your friends cannot, by mechanics, provide the same level of active or proactive assistance or safety that they can in nullsec. If your friends try to help in the same way they would in nullsec, they themselves will be Concorded.
The very mechanic people love to cite as providing safety, in this case, actively works against the player to make their venture a lot more dangerous than in other areas of space. Concord isn’t safety. Awareness of tools and mechanics is safety. Having friends is safety. But above all else, organization and coordination is safety. That is only provided by decent player corps. Players, training, experience, awareness, preparation, organization. All of those are safety. Concord is not safety; at best it is a double-edged sword.
5 Likes
Lvl 4 and 5 in high sec is a BAIT from CCP.
In case you would want to risk your Billions and go there alone to try your luck on exit. Yes, its next level gambling.
Dream on baby …
Who want your suggestion … 
You can’t fight back directly, but you can make the life of those attacking as miserable as possible with an equal sized fleet of logistics to keep you alive and an Orca to store all your shinies before you eventually die. If the attackers engage the logis, they can reship into combat ships and are able to fight back those who attacked. Which can escalate quickly to a proper fight with all being suspect or in limited engagements. The mechanics are different, but you can do something.
Though I have never seen this kind of mechanics usage and organization … it’s highsec after all.
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Agreed, but I already implied as such (“same level”). However your point relies upon rather specific circumstances
-That the attacking fleet won’t have enough DPS to push through your logi reps.
-That an organized group of hunters would attack the logi and invite such a counter-escalation
-That they don’t actually manage to destroy the logi ships and the logi gets away despite the aggressors specifically having a PvP fleet (unless you’re willing to absorb the costs of a lot of logi ships to make the point)
-That such an engagement isn’t already over by the time logi pilots reship and come back since now they’re not even repping the abyss runner
-That the aggressors stick around for the escalation when there’s nobody that can DPS or tackle them except for the specific logi pilot(s) they may or may not have engaged
-That the former logi pilots can now win in these limited engagements against whichever few aggressors engaged them and let them get away
Etc etc. All these things are possible, yes, but unlikely. Mistakes happen, but you shouldn’t have to rely on professional hunter groups to make a series of mistakes just so you can actually fight back against them.
Likely, the abyss runner and a bunch of logi will die in a fire. Again, because Concord prevents proactively combating the aggressors. That’s an expensive series of mistakes to make and a considerable amount of man hours devoted to people on standby to a situation you can’t help and chances are will only be made worse by your participation.
The Orca thing seems quite viable and I do like it, as when it was brought up in other threads relating to hunting abyss runners. But that does shift the goalposts since that was not the point I was making. The point is that Concord ensures you cannot fight back against aggressors. Hiding your ship in a friendly Orca does not change that. It saves the ship, but that might not be enough solace when you get podded on the spot since you just stored your ship and dispersed that gate jump immunity timer by taking an action.
Edit 1: This also assumes the hunters don’t just go “easy mode” and land ten Tornadoes, one or two Thrashers, and an interceptor to instantly blap your ship and your pod.
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If you store or switch a ship everyone loses the lock on you and since there are no bubbles in highsec you can insta-warp away. If done right it is impossible to catch you.
You can also switch ship instead of just storing it. Maybe something with a huge buffer or whatever. Also depending on whats waiting outside, switch to a PvP ship if you think you can win. You are the one who can decide if you take the fight or run. That’s pretty nice.
3 Likes
In consideration, yes, that is actually pretty nice.
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“It’s not therefore surprising then that there are going to be issues figuring out how to reward content that can endlessly be run in complete safety that won’t trash the economy. In fact, I am not even sure it is possible. It’s a reflection of the core idea of risk vs. reward of this game; safe and easy/effortless content will have near worthless rewards.”
It’s quite simple, like all other sources of wealth in the game it will balance at a point when the isk per hour and fun per hour balance. If more people think it is fun the iskph will be lower. If only a few enjoy it the iskph will be higher so more people will run them for economic reasons. Either way it might not be enough for you or me. Resource wars failed because the isk was too low despite being fun and experienced players refused to run the sites. In this case the ships and ammo should keep rewards a little higher since they are consumable. I think it will settle out with level 4 sites being roughly equivalent in profitability to level 4 missions, when run efficiently.
Its also fundamental in gambling.
I have seen a goon who lost in few days more than a billion in ships just to PvE in abyss instead of farming bounties. He have been losing them and coming back for more spanking.
Like a gambler who returns to cassino to gamble.
One of my alliance mates is well over 7bn in losses…, but he has a a ton of BPO’s and material and is offering to build the ships for people who have fat wallets, so I wonder how he will do in the end…
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Exactly, that’s what is triggered with this expansion.