Correct, without industry there would be no PvP. However, good industrial players love AFK cloaking. AFK cloaking only hurts incompetent players who don’t deserve to exist. Those players get camped into station and out of the market, resulting in increased sale prices (supply vs. demand) for the industrial players who are capable of continuing to operate. If you are a good industrial player then you want AFK cloaking to continue exactly as it is, and any nerf to it would be a nerf to your income. If you’re a terrible RMT farmer, well, the records of posting in this thread speak for themselves…
The fact that tech law is slowly catching up, I am sure there will be a case of harm - Which is why I started the process of replying to a post saying that NO HARM came from a cloaky camper, ELU are an excuse and could be challenged in a court if the person was of not the right state of mind when starting the game or gets a mental issue in RL and still plays the game, problem with the law is there is always and answer to one thing or another, and unless tested in a court no one will have an answer until a precedent is set.
Uh, what? Can I have some of whatever drugs you’re on?
No. When 10 people continuously rant about something, and 99 people try to reason with these 10 people, then that does not mean that there is a problem with the game.
It means that the problem is you. There is nothing to discuss about this.
The problem absolutely is you and, under specific circumstances, each and every single person who continuously gives people like you a stage to continue creating an issue where there is none.
No, I will suport the AFK cloakers on saying this one is a bad idea.
Why, Because it gives no way for an active player to stay cloaked… Which is not cool for RP, tactical usage or realistic usage.
I posted an idea that was far more reasonable. (I believe so) Some will disagre, but here it is, why don’t you peruse it Dalia Boilstun and get back to me.
I’m all for timers and such… But not in such a way as an active player suffers so grievously that it makes using the cloak no longer practically viable.
Having a very loud minority cry about a topic they don’t understand beyond the basic level isn’t indication of a problem with the topic, it’s indication of a problem with the uneducated minority.
CCP is in Iceland. They don’t give a ■■■■ about your US courts and in pretty much every court outside a US one, you’d get laughed out of the courtroom for making a case like this, if you even make it that far.
I’m pretty sure it’s clear in the EULA that this is a PvP game and you agree to be shot at if you undock. Given that the AFK Cloaky literally can’t shoot anyone without decloaking I doubt the argument of ‘I was scared’ would hold up in court.
If it did then every single multi-player game would have to shut down. Even single player games would be at risk of lawsuits if someone found a level too difficult.
Anyone who is [harmed] by a video game, probobly should not be using the internet in the first place… or driving a car or automobile, or operate heavy equipment or allowed to own a firearm.
NOTE: I’m a 2nd amendment supporting American.
The mentally impaired who manifest their illness in a physiologically visible way can not be trusted to maintain a safe grasp on reality.
The 10 people are those defending cloaks, the 99 are the veritable legions who have come and gone, starting new threads about this to the point that the old forum got a sticky and a standing policy to simply close all cloak related threads other than the one official one.
Yeah, there’s a problem. This topic is more of a sore point than just about any other I can think of, like wardecs, bumping, suicide ganking, or letting drones target their mothership.
First off Daichi has it exactly right. It is not a popularity contest. As such any kind of metric based on who thinks what is flawed in determining who is right or wrong.
Second the forums are not a representative sample even if we wanted to count who thinks what about AFK cloaking.
“Problem” is not something that is concrete. The definition is “a matter or situation regarded as unwelcome or harmful and needing to be dealt with and overcome.”
The key word there is “regarded” . What is a problem for me may or may not be a problem for you. There is very little that would be considered a problem for everyone.
You losing your job is a big problem for you. I don’t care. Very few others do. It is definitely a problem for you. It definitely is not for me. Your definition is simply not a good one. We all have different problems and they are not problems for everyone else.
If a large number of their customers view something as a problem though… it is probably a good idea for CCP to view it as a problem as well… even if they privately don’t view it as such.
Sure. But the people on the forums is not a representative sample.
In fact, I think one can make the case that the shift from “Here is your noob ship now ■■■■ off,” has been a huge problem as seen by the data at EVE Offline. And those customers have registered there discontent in the way typical of consumers; the stopped being a customer.
Edit: And of course we should try and control for such factors as a longer skill queue which would most likely effect daily logins.
In other news, my corp finally drove off a bunch of cloaky campers by using triangulation and probes right at server restart, after 81 days of hot drops and constant fleeting up and vigilance… They gave up and left.
I should have said what would be a good way to get a legitimate representative sample in a recognized and accredited survey as I know what a representative sample is.
I can admit I have not been as active of late as I should be. That is because every time I try to log in and get something done, some guy with a cloaker on sits in my system afk all day doing nothing. I know he is semi-active as he leaves system when fleets show up and comes right back afterwords. My proposed solution is to treat cloaks like cynos, make them use fuel and make that fuel so a cloaker can only use 2-3 cycles before having to refuel. The workaround for cloaky haulers would be a fuel bay, and making it so that they can not be used for full days of camping, or just use them, I don’t mind camping a gate and scanning you when you do run out of fuel.
From a business standpoint, having people not play is bad. I have personally stopped playing (and paying) numerous times because nothing can be done either in my system, or my corp mates have stopped playing because of this as well. “but it is a guerilla tactic, and that is what eve is all about” nah, its a stupid tactic that only 5-6 alliances actually use because, for whatever reason they think peeping in peoples windows is fun. there is zero counter for it besides bait and wait, and you just have no clue whats coming when they light the cyno. I play this game to relax and have fun with friends, and having someone sit in 7 systems next to each other with an infinite cloak is not relaxing, fun, or make the game any better.
“but you assume the risk hurff durff” well, when the fleet commanders and alliance directors say “don’t do stupid stuff with campers in system” and there is not much else you can do other then stupid stuff, there really is not much of a reason to play. I like to do that stuff, as I can do a couple sites, munch a couple rocks, then to make lunch. I can come and go as I please, accountable to nobody, and as long as I watch the highway, I can see the enemy scouts before they come.
The issue at hand is the infinite use of something that should not be used infinitely. I know I am going to get roasted to hell, but this is one of those things that has been hurting nullsec for a long time now. If you wanna camp, I am all for it, go ahead, I may (and have) provide bait for you and content, because I’m not just a krabber, I do a fair amount of pvp as well.
It’s no use discussing this, really. The developers tend to take their view of the game from the big alliances/coalitions, and cloaky camping isn’t an issue for them. (Yay for super umbrellas.)
I tend to just look at cloky camping as a known pest problem and work around it. Base out of several systems and move around as they get infested.
This problem also doesn’t exist in w-space, as cynos don’t work there. It’s a nice alternative if your space is crawling in cloaky campers.
