Warping away is disproportionate effort?
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Not what Iâm talking about.
I maybe have a fitting analogy for âdisproportionate effortâ. Posting on the forums without any thought to trigger a response takes very little effort, but if other players then want to continue the discussion in a normal manner, it takes them a lot more effort than it took the first person. Luckily the forums do have counterplay options such as the ignore function.
Why canât you just warp away?
The standard method of play.
What is so special and disproportionate?
And stop with the troll dodge, âEveryone who posts something I canât answer or donât agree with is a troll.â
Do you think you are fooling people?
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Seems to me you are the one trolling.
There exists in the game quite a few ways to not die to covert (or other) cynos, and they can be done with accounts as soon as theyâre created.
- If youâre not in a corp:
- Do as you should be doing already. Stay aligned to something at all times. If anything warps to you, decloaks, or you get a random itch, warp off. Since youâre aligned, this happens IMMEDIATELY - before anyone can do anything to you.
- If youâre in a corp:
- The corp needs to OWN its space, not just occupy it. There is a huge difference between the two.
- Be on comms and in fleet any and all times that you are undocked.
- Donât fit your ships like a moron.
And while this might not apply during the age of chaos/shortage, null has the best resources. You want that advantage with no risk at all? When I was in null, I looked over my shoulder all the time, just like when I was in a wh. Thatâs the price you pay for those advantages.
I know the ways to not die to covert cynos. You could read my previous posts in this thread if youâd like.
My point is that, while the gameplay of cynos and cloaks is fair, it takes effort from people to defend against cynos. Disproportionate effort in case the cloaks are AFK most of the day.
Why should someone be able to put another on their toes all day long while they themselves are asleep or at work?
Iâd like something to be done to make it harder to light a cyno after a day of AFK cloaking in system. Mind: I donât want normal cloaked gameplay to get touched, and cynos are fine as they are.
When I lived in null, at first I did look over the shoulder all the time, but when I got into SOUND that mentality changed to a âsupport the corpmates, and they got my back tooâ.
Owning your space instead of just⌠occupying it, makes all the difference in the world.
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An AFK cloaker takes 0 extra effort to mitigate in comparison to the stuff you should be doing anyways.
If the cloaking duder is actually there, paying attention and ready to light that uber-scary cyno, it will take you the same amount of effort as if he was AFK.
This all comes down to owning the space you live in. 9-FOB was incessantly cloaky-camped. We were all n00b scrubs fresh off the account creation screen for the most part â only a few of the leadership actually had more than 15 million SP. 90% of the rest of us had just enough SP to â â â â -fit a frigate. We didnât give a rats-ass if there was a cloaky camper in system â hell, there were times when the we werenât camped, weâd send mails to the usual duders to see if they were OK cause we missed them.
Your corp should be on its toes all day. Youâre in null, and null space is player policed, not CONCORD, or CCP, but player. Itâs not CCPs job to invest development time into a system that really isnât broken to start with, and lord knows theyâll just find a way to completely screw it up if they did try.
All comes down to owning your space. If the peeps youâre with now donât own their space, and let a simple cloaky dude in system shut things down, then you need to look for another employer.
It is really that simple.
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Thatâs my point⌠it takes the same effort for defensive preparations whether the cloaked pilot is there or AFK.
You need to pay extra attention and effort when a cloaked ship is in system, something Iâm willing to do.
But it shouldnât be the case that people can force others to put in that extra effort just because theyâve put a cloaky ship in space all day long.
Notice, it takes effort to defend against cynos has nothing to do with cloaking.
It takes effort to fit a cyno, and hunt.
None of which have anything to do with cloaking.
This is not the way to get rid of the names in local that scare you.
Well, if I put a cloaky ship in high-sec, does anyone really care?
That is the only place where you shouldnât be on your toes when undocked (only referencing cloaking/cynos, highsec is more scary to me than any other space).
I know quite a few people, myself included, that turned off blink on Local, and only open it to talk when saying âGood Fight!â, then it gets minimized and out of my way. It provides no value otherwise, except in low/null, where its just a free intel tool when the system is too big for dscan to see the entire system, and youâre by yourself raiding nullbearsâ DED sites.
What would be any different from a cloaky ship, than if the guy managed to get docking rights at some point, logged the char off in station, and just logged in to reap the âlocalâ tears? That would be totally do-able with the mentality that youâre using.
If there is a possible hostile in system (which is all the time), then your corp should have a standing fleet, and people should be in it. They should be on comms, even if itâs to listen only. (SOUND had a mute member with a speech synth, and another deaf member that just watched the âtalkingâ indicator to pay extra attention to chat).
Your miners should be in Procurers or Skiffs if there isnât a large enough standing fleet to handle things that would jump on an Orca or higher. Ratters should have enough tank to survive until the fleet is on-site to delete the attackers, and/or be aligned at all times. I was a ratter â and I had a âsphereâ of tacticals all around the system that I just cone-aligned to while I was ratting.
Didnât matter if there was an AFK dude in the system or not, that is how you roll in null- or low-sec, or in J-space. Your corp has to own its space. Iâm not sure what is hard to get about this. After getting 123M SP on my main, I still fly a Skiff with max tank and a point when I mine rocks. (Much more fun and profitable to drag a hauler, and mine the minerâs hulls for the rocks tbh). When I krab, I fly with either enough dudes that weâre not fun to engage (without a co-ordinated fleet, content is always fun), or enough tank to act as a content magnet that will live until the fleet arrives.
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fyi 
These are entitled SOLO players, not sov Alliances.
I didnât explain well then. I look over my shoulder as a matter of habit. I didnât like Goons/null simply because it was a noisy commâs, thatâs all.
If theyâre solo, it doesnât matter. I go solo all the time hunting⌠or ninja-ratting the DEDs.
I still donât use local unless the system is mcfuckall huge and dscan wonât cover it. Blap tackle, if dscan shows hostiles/probes, Iâm gone â cloaked up in system waiting for them to f off so I can finish up, or I move to another place to farm. Or I just sit silently and wait for them to get comfy and stupid, delete an Ishtar, or call for the rest of the guys that are hungry to come eat some nullbears.
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I get what you are talking about.
The ratter has to remain vigilant and aware 100% of the time. The cloaking camper only needs to wait for the right time to strike.
The thing is that is essentially the nature of the hunter vs the hunted.
Game mechanics wonât change that. Stop being the prey.
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Lion vs antelope.
The antelope knows thereâs always a lion out there somewhere and it never lets down itâs guard.
Edit; Just thought of this. You should thank the AFKCC for keeping your defense fleet on top of their game! Militaries of the world spend billions a yr to do just that.
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Except the hunter knows that theyâre also the hunted. Or at least I think that way. And Iâm pretty sure that dude that used to camp 9-F0B figured it out after he attempted with friends to gank in our system so many times. Sure, a bunch of scrubs with frigates generally got dunked by fleets of T3Cs and crap, but 99% of the time weâd win the ISK war in those cases, cause weâd fight tooth and nail to murder the hell out of at least one of them so theyâd bleed a bit.
If the people whining were to put up half of the energy to fight instead of whenge, Iâd imagine that theyâd not be getting camped so hard.
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Except that this just muddyâs the waters. It is not the cloaky hunters that are calling for changes to cloak mechanics. They already know the risks of hunting.
It is those who donât know how to be anything but the hunted that I am directing my reply at.
This is why I love Eve.
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Sorry, I didnât realize that thread was for this idea. I thought it was just for people to talk about their love of cloaky camping. I donât think I can move the thread.
Annalyssa makes a great point. The thread title and OP of this thread are woefully inadequate and guranteed to continue giving everyone headaches and hard feelings.
I suggest renaming it to âANY and ALL ideas/discussions about CHANGES TO CLOAKING go hereâ, cause lets face it, the AFK part does not matter to the thread mergers and closures anymore.