Main AFK cloaky thread

I don’t think you understand the geometry of how big space is. If you can engage NPCs from anywhere in a 100km radius sphere the sheer volume of space enclosed by that sphere is going to make it very difficult to catch you. By the time you run out of volume to run through you’ve probably finished the site and moved on. Sure, you could get unlucky and happen to fly right at the cloaked ship, but 100% safety was never promised.

Without it, or something similar there is no warning whatsoever.

Nope. Stop being terrible at EVE. Cloaked ships have a delay before they can even start to lock you, a delay that is more than long enough for an aligned ship to warp out to safety even if you don’t click warp until the cloaked attacker appears on your overview within tackle range. Removing local makes it more difficult to survive (as it should be) while farming, it does not make survival impossible.

The current situation is the exact thing you just claimed is good

No it isn’t. It isn’t an alert player being faster, it’s about even a half-asleep player being automatically faster because the minimum possible time to reach and engage a target after entering a system is much longer than the time required to warp out. Competing skill vs. skill does not mean that success should be impossible for the hunter unless the prey is spectacularly incompetent.

Yet you have the colossal temerity to suggest that a cloak is Ok when it does not require even that tiny amount effort to maintain it’s own safety.

Again, you continue to be an ignorant sheep ****er (and probably a RMTer) and fail to understand the most basic of concepts. A player that is making billions of ISK an hour should be required to spend more effort maintaining their safety than one who is sitting idle in space. Maintaining your safety while idle in space has only the cost of fitting a cloak because sitting idle in space has no reward beyond mitigating the effectiveness of an intel system that shouldn’t exist in the first place. Can you honestly not understand why a player farming the most profitable content in the game should be required to spend more effort on staying safe?

You are correct, cloaks do not in their current state require any meaningful skill component.

AFK CLOAKING does not. AFK cloaking alone accomplishes nothing, however. Once you decide to use your cloak for something besides sitting idle in space (such as attacking and destroying a target) skill is required.

Even if that were true, it’s still an effect being inflicted from a perfectly safe position that deserves, like all things in EVE, to be opposed on many levels, including direct combat.

Fine. Nothing should be safe, and you can have a mechanic that allows you to defeat AFK cloaking with a level of effort inversely proportional to the benefits of AFK cloaking (basic risk vs. reward, the higher the profit you’re making the more vulnerable you should be). Since AFK cloaking alone provides a non-zero but extremely small value the cost should be appropriately high. Say, paying CCP 10,000 PLEX to generate a system-wide pulse with a 1% chance of deactivating each cloak it hits for 5 seconds.

None of that has anything to do with your proposal to remove the ability to warp while cloaked, or addresses why stealth bombers (which had cloaks but couldn’t warp while cloaked) were a joke class until they gained the ability to warp while cloaked.

And no, none of your ideas could work. They, like anti-cloaking proposals inevitably are, are either ineffective (and therefore pointless to implement) or massive over-nerfs.

Merin, you’re exposed. You’ll shoot down anything but mostly anyone just to keep your autowin cloak.

Post Snipped by ISD Buldath

Quote manipulation is not very nice of you.

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Well, which is it, are they never going to catch the ship, or would it be possible. You seem to be confused on this point. Also, are they staying aligned, or not? If they are maneuvering around a 100km sphere then they can’t be aligned all the time. If they are aligned most of the time they are either moving very slow in a straight line, or doubling back in a relatively small area very often, either way very easy to catch. If they are in anything large, you have plenty of time to catch them under those circumstances, given that for the skill component to have any effect the time to land tackle must be greater than the align time or it’s absolutely Loki’s autowin scenario.

What’s the delay on most of those cloaked ships, something like 5 seconds? Gee, I hope they weren’t busy doing something else like maneuvering, or engaged by tackling rats already, or stuck on some space object. You seem to think it’s Ok for someone doing something for an extended time to have to react to your sudden presence and take effective action within seconds, while you want to just hop in your ship and find a waiting target to shoot-- even better, that target needs to be a ship specifically designed to not be effective in PvP combat, because Risk is only for other people, not you. Even better, if that someone does fly in such a way as they can react to you within the necessary time frame you cry all about how they are 100% safe as if by magic rather than their own efforts.

I’m not saying the PvE person should not be doing things to secure his own safety. In fact, he is in a variety of ways from ensuring he is in an alliance that can provide defense, hunting in a remote area of space far from heavily trafficked areas, flying right and staying aware of threats in local. On the other side the cloaker has…pushed a button? once? like 15 hours ago? The issue isn’t that the relative gap in effort is too great, it’s that the cloakers effort is as close to absolute zero you can manage and still be logged into the game. You first have to have some effort before your efforts can be compared to someone else’s. Cloaks lack that effort, and that is the entire issue.

Yep. Making billions of ISK per hour should be dangerous. You should be spending every moment if your time desperately paranoid, knowing that even the slightest mis-step can mean your death. If you don’t like that kind of need for constant vigilance there are less profitable options that come with a lower level of risk. For example, highsec level 4s still pay reasonably good money and are effectively 100% safe.

even better, that target needs to be a ship specifically designed to not be effective in PvP combat

Nobody is forcing you to fit your PvE ship that way. Nor are they forcing you to farm solo, instead of having PvP ships ready to assist you and counter-gank any attempt at disrupting your farming.

Sure, but on the flip side going deep into enemy territory and camping their industry should be dangerous. You should be spending your time desperately paranoid, knowing that an entire alliance’s defensive forces are hunting you just as you are hunting them and even the slightest mis-step can mean your death. If you don’t like that kind of need for constant vigilance there are easier places to get your kills that come with a lower level of risk. For instance, in High sec you can can flip or wardec and keep your kill board reasonably green.

And guess what: against a competent alliance that’s exactly what you get. You can sit idle in space under cloak and be safe, but then they just ignore your presence and continue their industrial operations. To actually accomplish anything you have to drop your cloak and attack, at which point you’d better be damn careful about which targets you pick, how many seconds you have to finish the gank before a support fleet can arrive from the adjacent system, whether that tempting target is a legitimate lapse in security or just a bait ship, etc. Any mistake in executing your attack means the loss of your ship.

The only times when attacking an alliance’s industry is a low-risk activity that doesn’t require constant vigilance and flawless execution (outside of the times when you’re just sitting idle in space not attacking anything) is when you’re attacking a weak alliance that deserves to die. And the fact that they have failed to use the available mechanics and make themselves a difficult target does not mean that they’re entitled to a “make AFK cloakers go away” button to give themselves more safety.

PS: it should always be more difficult to build than to destroy in EVE. Your attempt at parity between the two sides is just demonstrating your ignorance and pathetic obsession with 100% safe RMT farming.

While you are showing your ignorance of PvP and specifically cloaking. But unlike you, Merin isn’t commenting on how to change PvE.

No, it doesn’t.

You’re right for once, they wouldn’t. If you had the tiniest clue about cloaky gameplay you’d even understand why.

Cloaky/BOT camping is a problem. It interferes with any activity in system. In Null, according to what I’m told, most cloakers are hot droppers.

To prevent BOT campers, require activity every 30 minutes, a Cloak reset vulnerability period, so to speak. If no reset is initiated, modules are consumed similar to overloads. The first consumed is the cyno and offensive modules, then shields, armor, and hull, then your in a POD. Once the consumption process begins repairs can only be done in your home station. If boat is naked, immediate destruction.

Did you read the picture above and thought “I can trump Loki”? Your post sure reads like it.

You must be a BOT user.

Am I the one here advocating for 100% risk-free no-botting-downtime rmt nullsec farming? Nope, that’s you.

Wrong again. As long as the Non-Bot cloaker proves they are active , all is fine. you want to have 35 accounts, 30 running BOTs, not my problem if this would interfere with your cheat.

Wow, you must be some special kind of daft to think that cloaky bots could in any way generate even 0.01 ISK… Did you know that cloaked ships can’t lock or shoot anything? That they pose no threat until such time as they decloak?

You wanting to rat in perfect safety, however, does generate ISK. Henceforth it is obviously you that’s the botter and you accusing the other side of botting is just throwing mud in a feeble attempt of distraction. But don’t worry, Team Security will get around to banning you for RMTing soon enough.

Leaving EVE open with your account logged in =/= bot. Please stop posting this idiocy.

“Perfect Safety”. You keep throwing that term at me. Since when has there ever been a “Perfect Safety” activity in EVE? You want to camp, camp. Just make it cost you some time and effort. There are campers 24/7 in some systems. Making them work a little to maintain the cloak seems reasonable to me. Everyone else in system is actively playing, so should the cloaker.

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Everyone else in the system isn’t giving up the opportunity to make ISK. Local provides you with perfect, unfailable intel and thus perfect safety for very little effort. You want to remove AFK cloakers because those are the only option to defeat your perfect intel tool through simple mind games.

CCP said it ain’t going to happen so you can stop crying your ass off that you can’t let your ratting bot farm 24/7.

Point to one of my comments where I specifically stated I wanted to eliminate AFK Cloakers. Can’t see it can you. You assume content in my words to suit your argument. At no time have I stated I wanted “Perfect Safety”, but you have. You seem to think putting your words in my comments justifies your rude assertions. Arrogance does not prove intelligence, only ignorance.

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Q.e.d.