Pilot security status
No one has rights to loot. Botting is definitely a problem, but if spam-clicking is what you want to do for profit, I don’t see a problem with that.
People have even less risk to get stuff, like with Project Discovery. That doesn’t mean it should be removed, though.
My main is Flara Pediati. I do solo stuff and a lot of research out-of-game.
That’s great, but your greatest input here has been complaining about how Aiko needs to be banned, and how you would’ve quit the game if you got a bounty as a new player because you were too afraid to be killed. You are a non-factor to the discussion.
But at least you have the semblance of an actual player, I’ll give you that much. Meanwhile, there are people here who are responsible for the majority of this thread’s posts who’ve never so much as targeted another player with the intent to shoot them, ever, who are spit-balling their ideas on how to “improve” EVE’s PvP mechanics, while treating players who’ve done pretty much nothing but fight other players in this game for years if not decades (and I’m not just talking about myself here) with the contempt one would reserve for a plague-bearing rat. Those are the ones toward whom my comment is aimed.
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Owner can loot it without suspect hence he has rights.
How exactly is adding a killright right against the thief of one’s loot removing a gameplay?
Noobs don’t get hunted for bounties.
Veterans don’t waste money in noobs.
win/win.
Only if they are specifically targeting new players for no financial gain, only to grief.
I would not have, I just would have been a lot more anxious, and probably would not have played as much, at least until I learned it was meaningless.
This is true.
It adds a lot of risk and makes the process a lot slower, limiting its appeal for new players. I stumbled upon a Jackdaw wreck once (in nullsec), and got 12 mil in value from it. I freaked the heck out, because I had just nearly doubled my net worth, even after I was 5 months into the game.
Looting can be a great income for new pilots.
wtf, loot in nullsec is blue so there won’t be any killright
And even if there was, it doesn’t matter in space where anyone can kill you legally without CONCORD intervention. Killright would be generated only in highsec logically.
It is low risk high reward activity, I don’t see how it should be risk free or even accessible to newbies. You might not know it but highsec ganking was recetly nerfed to omega only which heavily lowered its accessibility to newibies. So get in line 
I know, just trying to show how good of an early income source it can be.
It does matter in a lot of instances. One exemple is the change they did in Hisec for pilots with bad security status.
I find this passage strange because it implies that it is OK to grief as long as you’re making money. I’m not ripping on you per se. I know you don’t mean to say any kind of griefing is OK, but reading the literal words gives me an unpleasant feeling.
What Aiko has going for her is that you’re not supposed to feel grief over the loss of a cheap noob ship in a PvP game. People are going into a game that, at least at the time of this post, has always on PvP baked into it and are expecting to be exempt for arbitrary reasons that are not reflected in the game’s implemented ruleset. I made this same mistake when I started playing, now that I think about it, and I learned the same way most highsec carebears seem to: I got blapped because I thought nobody would shoot me and I didn’t take any steps to protect myself.
CONCORD and sec status penalties are not proof that Highsec PvP is not OK, or not allowed. It is more of ‘the exception that prooves the rule’. If Highsec PvP was not OK, they’d lock everyone’s safety to green. If you weren’t allowed to shoot ventures, they wouldn’t be possible to harm. Why? Because it’s alot easier to implement an absolute than a system that punishes.
From the point of view of the PvE newbie, Safety is an antagonist. They present a challenge, inflict some damage to proove themselves a credible threat, then the newbie, the hero of their own story, learns from the experience and grows as a player so that they’re no longer a newbie. Highsec combat is pracitcally limited to cheap ships. Unprovoked attacks summon powerful NPC allies to fight on your behalf who always win. Sec status below -5 makes it impractical to be stationary in space more than a few seconds. New players have protection from CONCORD, the free corvettes for life safety net, immunity to war unless they opt in by joining a corporation with a structure, and automatic free 50% insurance on their ship hulls. They can still lose, and a loss is still felt to motivate them to do better, but if they’re actually new and poor the concequences for loss are fairly light.
I don’t like to lose, but in my view if it is not possible to lose, you can’t really win. It doesn’t mean anything or have any value to accomplish something that was guaranteed from the beginning. Every player has the means to limit their loss. You can’t lose any assets to PvP that you don’t put in space to be shot at. This is what we mean by ‘don’t fly what you can’t afford to lose’. If you would feel grief over the loss of a ship, then be responsible and don’t put it in space for your own sake.
The basic conflict here is between people who want protection provided by some external power, and people who want that people should learn to protect themselves. I ask, which methodology makes for better people in the end?
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This is going to return to the fact that there is no such thing as grief outside of a few throwned upon activities such as demading isk for mining permits.
What is grief really? Is it server lag just as TiDi?
TiDi is the only grief there is in New Eden.
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Griefing, to me, is when someone is motivated to act by the expected payoff of the emotional turmoil they can inflict on someone.
Shooting a spaceship can plausibly be motivated by any number of things. Protection of one’s space and its resources, teaching the dangers of being in space, wanting to improve your killboard, wanting to test your skill, wanting to test a fit or a theory, boredom and wanting to do something a little spicy, just felt like it because it was there, the list goes on and on. Griefing is on that list, but it’s just one item on a long list.
On the flip side, telling someone you hope they and their whole family die of cancer is difficult to justify as being motivated by anything other than trying to make someone feel grief because you’re angry and otherwise powerless to face them in game.
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We leave those sort of emotions at the launcher log in.
The reason why we get affended is when we place value on pixels.
At the end of the day it doesn’t mean all was lost when we can’t complete the goals set out for the gaming session as if a Capsuleer allows their free time to be affected to the point that they feel it is to be considered or labeled as grief to them.
The ability to move with the flow and change on a whims notice is how I try to maintain my focus in New Eden.
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I believe this is in reference to CCP’s stated position that while killing for profit is “just part of the game”, killing without profit is more likely to be treated as ‘griefing’. A ban would be the result of CCP applying their policies, not something Nujenif is recommending.
They’re also simply responding to another nonsense post of Destiny’s, so really there’s nothing of value being referred to.
I’m also not sure what this is referring to? Aiko’s average kill target is in the billions of ISK. Generally accompanied by a sizeable group of other gankers. It’s major business, it’s got nothing to do with new players or cheap ships.
Gankers and extortion-groups like Safety. or BlackFlag aren’t targeting newbies. They’re targeting high-isk targets for pure profit potential because the EVE rules are tilted in their profit/favor for doing so. It’s because EVE was developed by some guys who thought ganking rich characters on their way to the bank was the height of “good game design”.
I’m not sure where your point is wandering to, here? Not that I’m complaining, you’re a great poster. But HS “combat” isn’t limited to cheap ships, unless you’re confining your definition to a ganker’s side of the equation. 25 4-million ISK Cats for a total of 100 million ISK taking out a 4 billion ISK target isn’t cheap by the definitions of any player I deal with - except in relative terms of ganker outlay vs. target loss, I guess.
This particular post seems a bit tricky to link to the current discussion of bounties and their pros and cons and possible implementations though.
I believe people in a game like EVE should develop their own skills to accomplish their own ends. I believe CCP has designed EVE to make it very difficult for anyone except the historical “nomad raiders on horseback” to do so in most parts of the game (Nullsec excluded).
I don’t think bounties will help people learn to “protect themselves better”, although they can contribute to more interesting gameplay. If properly implemented, they could also potentially contribute to a viable playstyle/career that makes player self-defense a little more achievable.
Mostly, bounties are a part of game design that gives people more tools to encourage conflict. They just need to be implemented better.
Perhaps I should have just said you shouldn’t feel grief over a loss, but I feel pretty sure I’ve seen Aiko and Safety sponsoring venture killing contests, so I feel it’s reasonable to assume they will shoot them with some frequency, though I admit that I do not check to confirm this. I invoke Aiko because Safety is the only group I know of likely to engage in this sort of behavior that people recognize. If they don’t, then my bad.
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Destiny said her greatest input here (I assume meaning this thread) is suggesting Aiko needs to be banned.
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The person replied saying Aiko should be banned only if specifically targeting new players for no financial gain, only to grief.
And so I am on the subject of the theoretical situation that Aiko targets and shoots new players for no financial gain, and I’m trying to say there’s lots of reasons to shoot people and new players are not so helpless that they need protection pity.
By ‘cheap ships’ I mean the ships involved in highsec are unlikely to be ships out of their own reach, at least in the near future. Whatever people bring to bear against them is likely to be more comparable in power as opposed to an encounter in low or null where the aggressor will get to keep their ship after the encounter. I concede that the total dollar value of the entire fleet is not confined to the realm of being cheap.
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That is one big aspect that interets me and keeps me playing, one never know what will happen. I could be on a mission and find a good site ( combat, exploration, mining, wharever ) and switch ship and playstyle in two minutes. Or go through 5 or 6 jumps to pick up an item and get ganked on the way there. It hasn’t happened yet but I’m mentally and emotionally ready to get wrecked at some point. It’s going to leave an impression for sure 
But I will already have the exact same ship waiting at hangar.
At the end of the day, who doesn’t expect to get attacked in a Player versus Player game?
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Had you ever gone afk at a gate just to feel the excited too? I am currenty trying the lowsec gates but too much of a let down of late.
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just do it in a barge or a hualr you know can tank a lot
It’s all much ado about nothing. A gaussian laser fitted Venture can cover its cost ( 300K ISK ) in a single trip to the asteroid belts. A barge can cover its cost in a few hours. The quantum core on a Raitaru is a mere 800m ISK. Yes…mere. What the heck is anyone doing setting up a station if their corp is penniless after doing so ?
At every step of the game, the cost of loss is actually relatively inconsequential next to the player’s ISK and income and means of replacing that loss. And if it isn’t, then the player is jumping ahead too soon and they have only themselves to blame.
Personally, I follow a policy of always having enough ISK to replace every one of my ships…so the cost of all my ships is never more than half my total worth.
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