Security status effects tethering

[Ramona_McCandless]

Ah, so this change is at the behest of Null. Interesting.

And by interesting I of course mean unsurprising and cynical.

[Scipio_Artelius]

@Dracvlad

Most gankers no longer report their ganks to Zkill

That isn’t as true as it might seem.

It’s easy to check by comparing the kill dump from the MER against zkillboard statistics:

Ganking and PVP: Numbers in perspective

Just on this part, looking at commonly ganked ships quickly, whether zkillboard is a good source of data or not is something I’ve been interested in for a long time. For freighters (my main interest as part of keeping my own hauling safe), I’ve known for a while that the data is good, but always thought it might be less so for other ship classes. Surprisingly though, zkillboard has a very high percentage of losses for a number of ships: [stats_1] [stats_2] Aside from ventures at around 90…

Overall, zkillboard misses a lot of killmails, but the vast majority of those are losses to NPCs, particularly new players (which can also be crossed checked against the ESI to get a handle on numbers and it in the thousands per day).

For most gank targets, zkill gets a very high percentage of the killmails.

[Arya_Yeshe]

It is very worthy!

Because the kills that seems off on zkillboard are small kills with very few alts and solo kills.

This happens in all kinds of kills, including null and low sec.

There’s this outcry about gankers being overpowered when there’s a blob of catalysts at the tether, but those kills are just a few.

If a bunch of heroic solo gankers and small gankers with 2-3 alts only are capable of getting a kill with all the odds against them then they should be praised… those are the kills without the ganked tag that scare you so much

[Scipio_Artelius]

@Arya_Yeshe

It is very worthy!

If you just work off the Ganked list, you will miss a lot of ganks.

[Arya_Yeshe]

when missing the ganked tag it’s the tiny ganks, solo heroes in many cases

SHOULD AN ENTIRE STYLE OF GAMEPLAY DISAPEAR BECAUSE OF THOSE?

C’mon!

[Scipio_Artelius]

@Arya_Yeshe

it’s the tiny ganks, solo heroes in many cases

Got any analysis to show this?

[Raylan_Yutani]

@Syzygium

Ganking always has been concentrated around major routes and hubs, cutting these 1000 total systems down to maybe 50 or even less relevant ones where ganking has been an issue at all over the years.

So you’re saying there are 1040+ safe highsec systems? Ganking isn’t a problem then, eh. Just direct the risk averse players to those systems.

@Arya_Yeshe

I don’t know why this one is like this, I wasn’t on that grid.

Zkill doesn’t flag kills with fewer than 5 attackers as ‘Ganked’, as Drac said.

[Arya_Yeshe]

I have personal experience in that

Also, just open the Safety zkillboard, the great solo hero Snuggly Guy is the #1 at the momment, doing Bob’s work

Snuggly Guy

Are these the so called losses newbs can’t recover from?

What I am saying is this: the ganks that cause outcry are on zkillboard as GANKED

Let the solo heroes be, they are teaching EVE

[Scipio_Artelius]

@Arya_Yeshe

I have personal experience in that

Also, just open the Safety zkillboard

So basically, no analysis. You can’t tell from just looking at zkillboard. You need to pull thousands of kills.

I’ll go do it now and update with results.

[Altara_Zemara]

@Syzygium

oh no, the comparison to the highest possible, yet completely irrelevant number of “total highsec systems”. Ganking always has been concentrated around major routes and hubs, cutting these 1000 total systems down to maybe 50 or even less relevant ones where ganking has been an issue at all over the years.

It depends entirely on what the activity is. Haulers may need to go through major routes and hubs, but miners don’t. Thus a miner can mine all day in a single system and never have to leave it to sell the ore. In that context, arguing that there’s hordes of gankers on the trade routes is meaningless. There’s no end of highsec systems where miners can mine very safely.

Even in the context of hauling stuff, it depends entirely on what is being hauled. I’ve sneaked hundreds of millions worth of implants out of Jita right under the nose of gankers. There are fits and methods that make it simply not worth their while to attack me. And that’s the thing…being ganked is relatively easy to avoid. So ganking is relying far more on bad fittings and inadequate attention being paid than it is on the activity itself ‘flourishing’ in any meaningful sense.

[Zaera_Keena]

@Dracvlad

not me

Is that so @Lucas_Kell ?

@Altara_Zemara

I’ve sneaked hundreds of millions worth of implants out of Jita right under the nose of gankers.

Not exactly hard, paricularly for small items like implants. I’d just use an insta warp hecate with align time under a second.

[Vokan_Narkar]

So over night, someone, be it ganker alliance or a market speculator bought all clone tags. Now the cheapests starts at 30/50milion.

That makes the price of the each gank, when clone tags are being used to repair the loss, (60/2.5)*number of alts used for it.

For me that means that no longer will be able to field two gankers, I will have to perma farm tags on one acc just so I can gank with one toon with reasonable price. Because paying 2.4b for plex + 4b for tags each month to gank with 1 acc is nonsense.

If the nerfs really go live, tags needs to be changed. As I wrote multiple times before the nerf was even leaked.

[Defi_Natalie_NotAnAlt]

Isn’t it a good thing that people can engage with gankers through market PvP?

[Destiny_Corrupted]

When I did a manual count a few months ago, I noted something around 50 actual ganks per day, so yes, the kill board obviously doesn’t report everything. But the difference isn’t many orders of magnitude, it’s basically just around double, maybe slightly more, of what is reported.

@Defi_Natalie_NotAnAlt

Isn’t it a good thing that people can engage with gankers through market PvP?

The problem is that unlike every other good in the game, there’s actually a hard limit on the amount of tags that can be generated per hour across the universe. Unlike ore, or bounties, or PI, you can’t just add more accounts to create more stuff, so there’s the distinct possibility that the supply of tags won’t be able to keep up with the demand, which will place an artificial ceiling on the amount of ganking that can be done.

[Gix_Firebrand]

@Defi_Natalie_NotAnAlt

Isn’t it a good thing that people can engage with gankers through market PvP?

What would a noob know about market PvP

[Defi_Natalie_NotAnAlt]

So it’ll mean you have to rate limit your ganks and make sure you’re ganking more worthwhile targets rather than shooting people at random? Sounds great.

[stefnia_Freir]

@Destiny_Corrupted

Unlike ore, or bounties, or PI, you can’t just add more accounts to create more stuff,

That’s plainly false. PI and ore are generated in a limited quantity per day, though that quantity is way higher that what capsuleers can actually harvest.

bounties from anomalies are also generated in a limited quantity per day, only missions bounties are generated per demand - just like LP . Note that valuable drop is also generated in a limited quantity.

[Iceacid_Frostpacker]

I had read it as comparing to the number of tags farmed verse automated material.

/
What if there was a pi material that works up to a level 5 tier that can be then traded or turned in to repair the security status?

[Vokan_Narkar]

Lol. Seems like you know a lot about belt ratting and clone soldier tags. Please enlighten us how you multibox 20 tag farmers same way you multibox 20 miners and how many you can farm a day.

[stefnia_Freir]

@Iceacid_Frostpacker

I had read it as comparing to the number of tags farmed verse automated material.

That’s also how I read it. The thing is, the automated materials are also in limited quantity - it’s just way harder to reach the limit.

What is false, is that PI or bounties generation can be increased with more alts.