Why would it seem radical? Capsuleers do that every day, and CONCORD doesn’t care one whit. CONCORD’s permissiveness, as you put it, is what undermines national sovereignty in this case, not the capsuleers who act within its limits. One of CONCORD’s duties—indeed, their primary one, existing before the advent of the independent capsuleer—is to resolve exactly these kinds of disputes between the empires, and within the domain of international affairs, there’s a case to be made that CONCORD supercedes national sovereignty.
At the very least, CONCORD sure seems to think they do.
Because the only course specifically sanctioned by Colonel Drust was cooperation with the DED.
There was no endorsement of either interested party, no condemnation, nor indeed attempt to supersede either core empire; presumably to avoid damage to CONCORD’S ability to perform their primary role.
If the approach to law you were taught is that a lack of specific prohibition is sanction for an action, the conduct of the Republic and those of it, begin to make far more sense.
If the approach to law that you were taught is that you need specific permission to do a thing, then please show me the Amarr statute pertaining to metabolic activity.
Has anyone said metabolic activity has been sanctioned? You claimed CONCORD sanctioned activity superseded national law, I claim that sanction of an action cannot simply be omission of prohibition.
So your position is that by default, the Amarr Empire does not consent or authorize its subjects to conduct metabolic activity?
And yes, I’m being ridiculous. I’m being ridiculous on purpose to highlight just how ridiculous you’re being. Tacit approval and authorization is still sanction, even if it’s not explicit. In this case, CONCORD—the superceding authority in international affairs, whether they come out and say so or not in any given statement—made it clear that turning it in to either empire’s representative was fine. So EM went to make sure it got turned in.
My position is that the Amarr Empire has no legal position on metabolic activity. Much as CONCORD declined to take a legal position on the core empires’ interests in this matter.
CONCORD washing their hands of a matter is rather too vague to supersede specific national laws; or would you argue that the destruction of their headquarters was similarly sanctioned?
Furthermore, providing a third option without condemning the previous ones is not making it clear that either or both were fine, it is declining to give a judgement
So is metabolic activity legal in the Empire, or does everyone have to up and die? It’s a binary proposition. X behavior is not explicitly made legal or illegal. So which is it? Your position on EM’s activities, and more, your position on the legality of acts that “a lack of specific prohibition” indicates you need to tell your cells to stop all that unsanctioned sugar-burning immediately.
I’d argue CONCORD has prohibitions against attacking CONCORD assets, and they shoot back at you to prove it.
Sure. And nobody’s said the Empire didn’t have a problem with whichever pilot it was they shot at coming into their space… just that CONCORD’s position seems to amount to ‘ignore that, it’s ok’.
Your position has every appearance of being that anything CONCORD declines to take a stance upon is legal, which is a position I have every confidence is shared by none of the core empires.
My position is that CONCORD declining to take a position means the empires’ position has force, but in this case, CONCORD weighing in and saying ‘either one is fine’ means they’re not declining to take a position.
The escort mission was undertaken in order to secure encrypted manifests/logs that concern the actions of disavowed, rogue actors with affiliation to the Brutor Vanguard. BRUVA is a paramilitary organization, but it’s own attachments to the Republic are self-evident.
The assault on Tanoo II is a galactic tragedy, and the situation has escalated severely in its wake. Electus Matari were entirely justified in securing these logs. They contain information which will allow the Republic to conduct our own investigation; an investigation which will allow us to better combat and prevent any similar incidents.
The interjection of the Imperial Navy in our affairs, which were well advertised and heavily telegraphed in the days leading up to the operation, is highly suspect. Yes, they have a duty to patrol their borders. No, they do not have a duty to establish what is effectively a blockade along our projected route.
Do I believe that the Imperial Navy wished to prevent Electus Matari from recovering these logs? No. I would like to believe this was a major SNAFU on our mutual parts; but attempting to paint this as an act of AGGRESSION is ridiculous.
The Minmatar Republic is the arm and assembly of the Tribes. Where the Brutor are concerned, our own sovereignty - and responsibility - should be respected. If Matari suicide squadrons are plummeting through space on missions of murder, then Matari courts and Matari judges should be expected to put the orchestrators (if any exist) to justice.
It was an attack on the Ammatar Mandate, within the territory thereof; the Republic’s only possible involvement is as the aggressor, which is hardly a convincing basis for their right to evidence.
Being as defending the Empire’s borders against hostile forces is very much the Imperial Navy’s affair, it was your interjection.
Pick one, your incursion crossed that border.
I am not certain you understand either term, Republic sovereignty does not extend over the Mandate, and thus far you seem more interested in denying responsibility than respecting it.
Electus Matari working with an independent capsuleer to secure details pertinent to the prosecution of Matari criminals is not by any stretch of the imagination an “incursion by hostile forces”. Republic sovereignty extends over it’s people, and BRUVA’s former agents fall firmly under the Republic’s jurisdiction.
It’s amazing to me how our political opponents will hawk on and on, demanding disavowals and justice for this tragedy, and then turn around to actively hamper our pursuit of the aforementioned.
It is my sincere hope that perhaps, when the Republic metes out due punishment to Matari war criminals, that the Empire may reciprocate. I don’t profess a lot of faith in the inverse.
The crime was committed within the Mandate against the Mandate, interfering with the investigation is at odds with Imperial sovereignty; when avowed enemies of the Empire seek to degrade its sovereignty, it is the duty of the Imperial Navy to obstruct them. When the Empire’s foes overcome its border militarily, that is by definition an incursion by hostile forces.
Your Republic would spend every single life in its fleet before accepting Imperial jurisdiction in their borders, that is roughly how enamoured we would be to accept Republic jurisdiction within the Empire.
No such demands have been made of the Republic, they disavow too promptly for anyone to be afforded the opportunity to demand, and the Elder Fleet taught us how much faith to place in their justice.
None was meted out for that, I expect no more for this.
Enough has been said here already about EM’s involvement. Everyone reading this knows or can easily check what the facts of the matter are: where we crossed the border, with what, where did we dock, to do what, and where the incident happened, and who opened fire first.
Interpretations can be made and motivations assigned, but where such argument does not happen in good faith for understanding but for to win a war before it has even started, there is no point in repeating them over and over again.
The audience of the IGS might not be the wisest in the cluster, but everyone here that we need to care about knows the one who repeats his interpretations the loudest and longest is not necessarily the one who is in the right.