Solo Reactions, why not?

Industry Gameplay Center Science & Industry
21

entitled? You have no idea what you are talking about. STFU

I have read the replies and processed them. Some I agree, some I dont, as is my prerogative. Thats not entitlement, thats called having free will and thinking for yourself.

I am not asking to change your precious group balance. But there are many activities in EVE that are solo oriented.
Trading, Hauling, running missions, exploration, just to name a few. People have also set up multi-boxing situations to get around your group balance.
And even though I am talking about this game specifically, I will try to repond to your comment about other mmo’s. True, you cannot do raid content solo, unless you are Asmongold, but there are plenty of activities to do outside of raid content, like questing. Whether or not I choose to do that raid content is my business. But if I enjoy the way I play it, then what does the company care if they still get my subscription.

Does solo play hurt anyone else who prefers to play in a group? NO
Does my solo play hurt the game in anyway? NO
Does CCP care if I pay my subscription and play solo? YES, they want to get paid.
Does CCP care if I lose interest and stop paying? YES.

Next correction for you is on the word whining. The definition is all about sound, or tone of voice. If you hear whining, then its all in your own head. I am not whining. I am making a request. I also try to explain my position to others who dont seem to get it. In your case, my expectations are low for your understanding.

22

Thank you for the response. I understand all the things you have explained. And yet, this has not deterred me from my request. I see no reason why something could not be added to allow players like me who want to tinker around.
Safeguards could be put in place to protect the market.
It could be made so that its short term, or single use, so that is does not disrupt the billionaires who have invested in their manufacturing process. (even though they are the ones who control the markets)

In the end, I have figured out a way to build the ship that I want to. Yes, its more expensive, and yes its totally inefficient. Do I care? Nope.
I just want to figure it out and experience it. That is my sandbox, the way I want to play. But if that remains to be a difficult obstacle, I will likely go some where else, some other game.
So as far as “business decisions” go, this sounds like a lost opportunity for CCP.
I know they have been trying to funnel people into the pvp side for many years, and still there are many players who would prefer to have more of a pve experience. But I am not asking for a change of the game. I am asking for a small little addition.

Potential benefits?
Recruitment:
Tinker around a bit and build some stuff, and maybe that player decides he likes it. Then goes to join a GROUP to do full scale industry. (and no, building a frigate from simple minerals does not have this affect)
Education/training:
Allowing solo to tinker around trains them on the complexities of building things. It educates them on the process and the financial side of things.

So, I fail to see why an addition like this would be anything but positive for the gameplay, and its business.

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23

Thank you Asshin,
The additional constraint is that I am building in a location where I have to ship through either null-sec or low-sec. The problem is the volume space that the components or reaction products take up. I can make my own fuel blocks in location, and those add a lot of volume in the process.
So I can make one trip in a Blockade Runner with the raw materials, and then do my own reactions.
If I were to ship all the products, or even just the components, it would take several trips in a full size hauler (not freighter). Each trip increases the risk and the odds that a shipment will be lost.

Thats what I did, I shipped the raw materials myself in a Blockade Runner. Then when I got into location, thats when I found out that you cant do the reactions in high-sec. There is nothing in game that teaches you this, or perhaps I would not have tried.
That is the day that I found out that you build everything else needed to assemble a T2 ship in high sec, except for the reactions.
And that does not make sense to me.

Thanks for the reply.

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24

Your words say one thing but your response undermines it.

Sure, just as it’s everyone else’s prerogative to see you use your free will to whine and complain and call you out for it like they see it. Please take off your double standard blinders.

The company doesn’t care about YOUR subscription. They care about making THE MOST of what they have, regardless of YOUR feelings and can exclude YOUR money.

If you don’t want to sound whiny and entitled, stop writing and thinking this :poop:. You’re literally writing about how important YOU are to CCP games.

You can’t gaslight everyone on this forum.

Good job posting in the completely incorrect section of the forum and phrasing it as a „WHY“ question, and getting mad when people explain the why, and then you fail the Chestersons Fence test.

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25

„More players“ is a consistently poor reason given for every proposal. It’s pure speculation for one, and two everyone claims their idea is better than the status quo. There is no proof.

Reactions are an advanced part of the supply chain. And reaction products are readily available at market. To the benefit of all players solo and grouped.

It only makes sense in the context of a group because moon mining is a group activity (requiring a structure) in the first place. Moon mining and reactions ARE the advanced step industrialists should strive for when seeking like minded players — and mercs to help guard the ISK printers.

So contrary to your point, the status quo of today actually satisfies your point: when knowledgeable industrialists are ready to do advanced industry, they step up and GROUP up into moon mining and reaction operations. If they don’t they can stick to the mineral economy.

This has been repeatedly explained to you and I’ve just explained it again above. Moon mining and reactions require GROUP infrastructure by design as they are the advanced industry. That’s a positive.

Failing to see this, again, and repeatedly, is failing the Chestersons Fence test, and everyone wonders if you’re ignoring this point out of ignorance, convenience, willingness, or if it’s a deeper problem,

This is not a problem, this is a part of industry and logistics and the fact that other people can do it better in groups should be an incentive and reward for group play.

Removing those incentives in an MMO is not beneficial to the game.

A frustrating incident for sure. But the lesson should be „I need to prepare better next time“ not „I am fine it is the game that is wrong“.

We can tell you only so many times but we can only take a horse to water.

If you don’t get it, then you don’t get it.

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26

“Those who say it can’t be done shouldn’t interrupt the man doing it.”

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27

Well, I applaud you for actually responding. Alot of people drop 1 post and never come back.

Everything has been explained so far and @Io_Koval rehashed all the points well. I have 2 more thing that stood out to me.

Why is this bad? CCP is nudging us together with group ownership of citadels and Orca compression with mining ops. PVP is simply a byproduct that keeps industry going. It’s all one big ecosystem with the PVPers and the PVErs and the builders.

There is completely nothing wrong with this. I myself made a bunch of my own gear out of the fun of producing it with 1 character. Many people produce their own gear because it’s fun and gives the sense of ownership! I hope you didn’t get the sense that is bad throughout our explanations. It’s the realization there are titans of industry out there that make you really appreciate the complexity of EVE online. It humbles me in RL and in the game.

28

Oh, cmon man, you can’t build one ship? realy? And here am I thinking about my mass reactions and how I can get them lol. Find upwell structure, delivier items, run reactions, get items back. Done. What so hard? Ah, forgot, calculate risks, coz you can loose everything even in highsec in millions hp huller.

29

I think you are misunderstanding the concept of industry. Industry is not about building a whole T2 ship from nothing. It’s about focusing one one or a few parts of the supply chain and doing just that in large quantities. You buy everything you need and don’t produce your self, and you sell what you produce and any surplus of input materials.

If you still want to build a T2 ship entirely from scratch “for the satisfaction”, then you have taken on a challenge (which is not impossible). So stop whining and do it. How can it be possibly be satisfying if it is easy? Don’t like challenges? Then do what everyone else does, or find a corp.

If it’s just one ship, then you can take the risk of using someone else’s citadel (that might be abandoned or run out of fuel at any time) for the reaction. That’s not the hardest part. If you really want to do everything yourself, then you also have to get the raw moon materials by yourself, which probably means you may have to either ninja-mine or steal it. Still up for the challenge? Then good luck!

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30

CCP believes there is value in… not… providing… value.

Literally nothing in the game has a positive reward. At best it’s 95% and that’s only if you have a dozen alts and are using ‘banned’ 3rd party software. Or you are forced into one of the bloated oversized null corps where stores of resources are in the tens of trillions… Just like real life, the 99% support the 1% in what is essentially slavery 2.0.

31

I don’t understand why you are still here when you hate everything about it. Isn’t there something you would enjoy more you should be doing?

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32

How about you stop being a dick? The guy has a very valid point regarding solo play.

You absolutely do not have to group up to play this game, that’s what most of you are brainwashed into thinking.

BTW, I’ve never done 30 man raid content in other games either, in the games I play I am solo. It’s why I’m in the corp I’m in now, I don’t have to do a thing on behalf of the corp. But most of the time I’m in my own corp doing my own thing and just chilling.

It might look odd that I’m in another corp, I agree, it was on a whim and there’s no benefit whatsoever for being in there.

I quit for a couple of years because of the POS changes and the introduction of Citadels because it lead to the ruin of my industry career as I point blank refused to be tied to even the smallest of citadels to try and make some isk without turning making fuel into a full time job.

So yeah CCP have hammered and hammered solo play to force players into groups, but there’s still a lot that don’t want that and won’t comply and turn into a lemming/bot/f1 monkey etc.

Enjoy your slavery to the cause.

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33

You first? No? Ok, glad we are on the same page.

I agree: there exists SOME content of Eve that is relatively effortless to do WITHOUT grouping up.

However, lowsec reactions is on the very high effort end WITHOUT grouping up and involves paying the local fiefdom their racket rent payment so they don’t kick your door down and teeth into the back of your skull.

We’ve already established this way upthread without hostilities. OP just complained that they wanted more for zero effort. That’s not how Eve works. Everyone else who plays the game can accept these sorts of nuanced facts, you and OP are just mad and want The God Of New Eden CCP Games to bestow upon you your special protagonist plot-armor status and carve out your desires for you, with zero effort because you’re weak in-game and can’t make your solo reaction gameplay happen.

No, that’s just how the game of Eve is. If you can’t enforce your desires (“owning a reactor in lowsec solo”) because of other players (“groups willing to field billions of ISK in supers to own lowsec in their area”) that’s emergent gameplay so find ways to play the game instead of whining on the forums (or calling people “dicks” for giving tough love advice).

It is trivial to look up and see I’m not a f1 monkey, so none of this makes sense as a “heh I showed him” insult. Quit acting like a :poop: because you got triggered.

FREE HINT: Put up your reactor in a low-class Wormhole, it’ll eventually be destroyed but you can plan accordingly, and run reactions solo to your heart’s content.

34

Ah a solo player purist. At least you still follow EVE social media if you are here. Elite Dangerous is a great MMO with literally a single player option built in :joy:

You will come back. Curious about how things have changed since POS times. EVE will be here. Waiting. You may not admit it, but you will install again. They all do (unless you bio massed)

I blame @Rocket_Hellfire for replying to a thread 29 days later. :sweat_smile: :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

35

Been back a while now, and subbed.

Just chilling between here and there with no personal interest in reactions, not even bothering with industry anymore, that route was taken away from my playstyle some time ago now. Don’t get me wrong. I did try in a few citadels where I now have materials still in there, just rotting away.

You see group play isn’t all it’s cracked up to be when you can just be screwed over at the whim of the owner/ceo/whoever.

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36

Yup!! I totally agree before CCP started moving minerals from HS into LS/Null I used to build stuff from battlecrusiers to frigates. I have my own personal fleet now because of my diligent hording. :joy:

Sometimes I do dream of owning my own arkanor/dark orshe moon again. I do miss when I first mined arkanor in a WH.

I take the good with the bad. If we all stop playing together because one CEO scammed a corp we would all just be alone wondering what more is there to EVE and life.

Don’t let one bad experience sour future decisions. If I let every bad Dota 2 game get to me, I would have quit at hour 10 :joy: If I let a gank influence me not to play EVE anymore I would be long gone. If I let what CCP did to my indy gameplay in 2018-2019 I would be gone again too!

Anyways this thread has taken its course. Some people have to reply 29 DAYS later… (You know who you are.) I hate adding to the snowball.

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37

You’re welcome to set up and run all your industry solo.
It’s doable. Difficult and absolutely uneconomical, but it’s doable.
Find yourself an uninhabited, uninviting wormhole system, set up your refinery in there.
Bazzing, done.
Note, your refinery may well get asploded but you’ll have some notice to get as much of your materials as possible into a hauler to try and exfiltrate after the structure goes pop and the aggressors have left.
I’d strongly suggest training up one of the extra character slots on your account as a basic Astero prober and log it off in your wormhole so you can find your chain in and out without needing to coffin your main in there for the duration.
I don’t see what your complaining about. What you wish to do is doable. It just requires additional effort.

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38

They will lose me and my ISK and $ contributions to their community coffers.
I am tired of being “content” for their other more sadistic customers, who think it great fun to kill a hard- worked for - 26M ISK Endurance and an 8 M ISK load of My First Ever Kernite Ore. They do cater to the elite industrialist as that is their choice, (my perception).
I have mine to make too and have played 8 - 12 hours a day for almost 2 months (retired now) and I have enjoyed parts of it but dislike the intolerable… ‘Joy of killing’ aspect of the game.
I don’t like spending my most valued resource TIME - Human Time, we all have to account for, on being foder for someone else’s pleasure. What is the point?
In Closing, I will say it is a marvel of complexity and creativity.
But My Time is worth far more than spending it on something that appears to hate me - Out of the gate, treats me as content or makes me wait so long to train for a given skill to gain a fraction of benefit (thought we didn’t notice?) I will find other games that won’t treat me as though I am a sadistic, self loathing kind of person… That likes to be game content.
Whatever your answer: My name is Timeware (should have been Timewear) and my Corporation is called ‘Just Don’t Care’. So don’t spend too much time defending the game. It is what it is - and I am making a choice, to not play or pay for the privilege of getting (or is it taking) it in the butt all the time.
Life is short after 60 and I am switching gears to something with FUN as a main concept.
Not, watching the paint dry - excitement of waiting for the next skill set to mature (POW training was far easier).
Challenging is good… Being slow brewed content, Not So Much. o7.

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39

I agree with your point of view on this entire article, you have been calm and reasonable and you helped me clarify a choice I have to make.
Stay or go. Latter (earlier?) in the thread I posted this:
Whatever your answer: My name is Timeware (should have been Timewear) and my Corporation is called ‘Just Don’t Care’. So don’t spend too much time defending the game. It is what it is - and I am making a choice, to not play or pay for the privilege of getting (or is the taking) it in the butt all the time.
Life is short after 60 and I am switching gears to something with FUN as a main concept.
Not, watching the paint dry - excitement of waiting for the next skill set to mature (POW training was far easier).
Challenging is good… Being slow brewed content, Not So Much. o7.
I wanted to thank you for your smart and clear posting of what many of us think, but are not as articulate as you have been.
Thank You!

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40

You have wrapped it up in one Very Good illustration… I am the girl building the sand castle.