The CSM 13 Winter Summit Minutes are out

I see nothing in the hints from the minutes of the CSM meeting that interests me. I see no changes that impact me. I see no support for a casual vet player that pays a subscription ($$) to play. I don’t see anyone on the CSM or at CCP who give a darn about people who for years have paid to play because they only play 2-8 hours a week.

I get very bored running the same missions, the same anoms, and the same other casual play features. The new structures are nice, but they are not for the casual player in a small corp of similar minded folks.

So I may not renew next spring after several years in the game. Give me some new story line please. 1 new mining mission a year and a couple of new courier missions would be nice. New level 3 missions that appear in systems. Most of the content is going to player who are playing all the time in fancy headspace fit ships.

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One thing I noticed while reading was that fuel for cloaks was discussed but no comments on what was discussed or CCP’s views.
Personally I agree with this as I have seen corps lose valuable members due to afk campers hanging out for weeks at a time.

It would be good to see the NES available out of game and merchandise more visible.
But please can we get a mobile phone cover the looks like a plex!

for something completely different, do you watch NFL? If so, for whom you cheer on? Started this season, but have time for highlights only. Never thought it would be so fun game to watch.

Join the rest of the HS crowd. Problem has never been CCP’s ability to generate data to direct game development, rather they really can’t always interpret accurately what the data is indicating to correctly spend their developmental assets. Now that they have so deeply cut CCP’s ability to make major and timely changes in the base game mechanics due to the large cut in staff, they have finally woken up somewhat and realized that they have made some mistakes in dev decisions in the past and now find themselves without the assets to make fast/deep changes. This data has been out there for YEARS; the same in regards to complaints and possible solutions to the WD driving people away from the game. CCP has almost always answered with a version of “our data doesn’t show that”.

This year, CCP Guard gave us the old “our data doesn’t show that” in regards to the frequent requests for new missions/sites or any new PvE content along the lines of many peoples suggestions. He said that since people have been doing the same missions and sites for years, everyone must be happy as things currently are in the game. Ditto for the WH/dics mess they created. CCP takes almost any data they mine and tend to force it to say it indicates exactly what they think the game should be. Now they are going to be forced to play catch up with a large portion of the team already bled away in layoffs. Las Vegas is going to be REAL interesting this year. I wonder if they can establish odds of CCP doing any changes correctly in the future while they are in town?

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What layoffs.
You are confusing ccp staff with eve staff here.
Other than 3 community team members I believe all the lay offs were non eve teams. There has of course been turn over in the eve team as well.

As for data interpretation… That’s hardly a ccp only issue. And if they spent the time to do enough studies to be 100% sure what a given piece of data meant it would be 5 years down the track for that one change. You just take an educated guess and go with it doing the best you can.

But they gut the people giving them independent feedback from their customers. The feedback they have been getting with the largest impact on game direction is a small, hard core group of people in either NS or large corporations in HS (yes, there are plenty of exceptions, but generally speaking). Through cons,discord,twitter, whatever they use, they have tended to just generally ignore any complaints that they feel diminish their own view of what is supposed to be and the gamers they communicate with generally have no interest in other areas that don’t impact their playstyle. The devs have their own ideas on where they want to go, but those that play don’t do the same activities a large number of people (casuals) do; they tend to design the game for their own playstyle/concepts. If they want to continue to do development in that way, that is their business decision. However, running with the business model of making people pay their money so that they will be forced to do an activity they don’t want to do for another groups enjoyment is crazy. Doesn’t matter what direction CCP wants the game to go, if they make the terms too onerous for a large enough group, monthly subscriptions will have to rapidly increase to meet business expenses. CCP did cut the one department that allowed for them to get a better and more whole view of where EVE should go that is based on ALL of their customers expectations. Well, we’ll see someday what the numbers show and decide then on how tunnel visioned or myopic the devs were; at the very least, they cannot argue that they weren’t warned a long time ago.

The point I was making was it often times isn’t losing a ship in a war dec but rather their poor leadership reinforcing this behavior that we don’t want - logging off, staying docked up, and playing other games.

I totally accept responsibility that wars have a hand in this, but you have to blame player behavior as well. My point is that most corps are very unlikely to see their aggressors unless they go visit a trade hub, so what you have are basically corp leadership telling members to do this because of the boogeyman. I am not saying that they are particularly wrong, but reinforcing with all of you here that we need a system that allows players to effect the course of the war.

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You are forgetting how many new players are not set up to run for months without visiting a hub. They dont have neutral alts. They have constant need of new items as they expand and explore new things.
And a war deccer is going to shoot the 2 mil frig as happily as the 10 bil freighter.

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You’re absolutely right. I will say that most of who die in war decs are players from nullsec groups. We would much rather kill a fat slow battleship or a hauler than a frigate, but your point remains - if we can catch it most of the time we’ll kill it.

The wars we have are a mixture of protection contracts and client requested wars (such as structure bashing). The majority of our wars are “content” wars where we war dec mostly nullsec groups hoping to get someone in a Freighter or Jump Freighter. We aren’t targeting new players and would prefer not to kill them because they will have nothing of value. That and while we’re killing a player we didn’t know was an actual new player we might be letting a whale go through to another gate while we didn’t see.

I have the feeling of the “Last Unicorn” of my beginnertime…all members of my beginner corp , met gamerfriends or blues (i speak about 100 to 120 ppl) ending EVE by
a) wardec or b) as ganker victim
… so CCP/EVE loose new payment € or $ gamer (newbies) to make plexing gamer happy (watch the rising plex price the last 4 years), wichone use Bots to finance their “HS-business” by Alpha-VNI-Bots or Alpha-Gila-Bots (like the “coming out story” of the russian bot-guy told us on reddit^^) cheating iskies by bots and invest the money for a HS-pirate corp/ally => he screw honorable gamer 2 times…
change =>
a) HS => HIgh Security must be save by ganking and wardec… it namend High sec and newbies don´t understand , why it doens´t be save => or wrong status name for it.
b) change low sec status => wardec and ganking be possible there, but also concord stay there, same gamemachanic like HS now (ganker shot down, but wardec possible)
c) delete 0,5 HS moon mats mining , the ppl can stay in Low Sec for moon mats => more profit more risk
(ppl wichone can mining moon mats, are EVE-adult enough to know how eve runs)… if they don´t understand maybe change the game to WoW :rofl:

Make Wardecs consensual against Corps that do not have structures in space?

Simple, fast solution that is easily implemented.

I’m a Redskins fan, so I generally hate life around this time of the year.

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It is quick and dirty. Know a few hisec corps I am not sure it will fix it, but it gives them a definite option/decision, especially if they are just a mission running corp.

I know everyone ignores me, but I still think spatial might be an option. if you want to wardec a corp in all space it should cost you billions and billions. If you want to wardec a corp to remove a structure or two, very reasonable cost. You want to wardec hundreds of corps in Uedama, you better be prepared to pay 10 or 100’s of billions. Perhaps in a starter system you can’t wardec anyone. And when a corp get wardec’d they just move their miner to the next constellation or region and say: “finally some Concord who actually do their job.”

This still allows the structure mercs to do their job. It will allows hunting nullsec’rs in jita or Uedama. The costs might increase a bit for the high activity systems, but life goes on, and the real combat adverse people can just move.

And if they are asshats they can still be constantly hunted/dec’d, it will just takes ISK and time since as I said to wardec a corp in all space at once should cost you large. Not a few measly hundred mill ISK, real ISK, billions if not trillions.

And we get a bit more of a ISK sink.

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But I really need famine relief … I’m starving

Don’t forget to add the other side of the equation: Corps without structures in Hi-sec cannot declare wars on ones that do

What’s good for one should be good for the other - It’s only fair

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100% agree. Shouldn’t be an issue for an aggressive corp

Absolutely.

I miss him and his graphs

m

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I could dig that.

I think a big part of the problem is we have one war dec system when we should have at least 2.

On one hand, A consensual system where any two corps can go at it, perhaps where both sides need to put up some collateral (like but side put up 2 billion isk and at the end of the war period whoever has the most kills gets the pot).

0n the other hand, a nonconsensual war mechanic aimed at structures.

Just an idea, I’m not a game developer :grinning:

This sound’s like normal risk and reward. It sounds like pretty good game design with meaningful choices.

We are so different. Cant even begin to understand you’re dislike on this particular point.