Eh they are more obsessed with old style freighter ganks than their original raison d’etre, sadly. I supported what they used to do but when they lost their drive and shiny coats I just went right back to doing myself lol.
I mean, I even auto freighters from time to time. Gankers arent as careful about scanning as they used to be.
PIs interface just frys my brain. Ill be the first to admit Im not the shiniest penny myself, but it always seemed needlessly non-ergonomic to me, if thats a term. Maybe Ill give it another look.
There is a lot of ISK in freighter ganking, and as I was told so many times by people like Australian Excellence that they do it to make ISK and to boast how much bigger their balls are based on how many times he called himself an alpha male, LMAO.
Which is the main reason why the Orca is not ganked, because there is no profit unless it is being used as a freighter. That is why multi-boxed ice mining AFK Orca’s are an issue.
The interface is fine. What is a pain is working back the production chain in terms of what is needed and the volumes needed for the chain, there were two very good websites that enabled me to do it easily, but they no longer exist.
And TBH that is honestly fine, in order to fill up an entire ore hold on an Orca efficiently takes about 2-3~ hours with T2 drones and this is parking it on the rocks and actually trying to optimally mine and that is only around 18 million ISK uncompressed and maybe around 22 million after compressing.
Travel time at max distance will take around 100 seconds (from rock to Orca and then Orca to rock) meaning almost two cycles will be lost (60 seconds per cycle). You would be increasing the time to fill the hold by roughly 1.8 hours which would reduce the ISK/hour to around 128k and possibly even less since you’ll likely not be around to cycle rocks since you most likely don’t have a scanner to pick good rocks.
It’s not like Orca’s are raking in ISK in Hi-sec; Lvl3’s give roughly 2-10 million ISK depending on mission and have lengths of 5-30 minutes so you would really just be better off investing into a HAC and avoiding the risk of your Orca getting popped by a FOB from a Pirate group and just playing the game for less than an hour.
However as said… at such low yields; you do you at least you are undocked. I just never realized people would underutilize the ship in such a way.
This whole conversation essentially just boils down to “I am upset because a player is undocked in an asteroid field” because at this point they aren’t negatively impacting the game in any other way.
I just pick the biggest ones I see. Scanners are a waste of a mid slot to me
But Im glad there’s no hard feelings. Totally get Im doing it at very low efficiency, but I just had to make the point that to some people efficiency isnt the be all and end all of playing Mining.
I have some pretty thick skin so I wouldn’t worry about that and on-top of it as I said before even if it’s not optimal you are at least logged in and undocked and considering the state of Eve Online… that’s all I can really ask for at this time of the community.
Bigger fish to fry compared to an AFK’ing Orca in Hi-sec.
I don’t think the Porpoise needs a better tank, what makes you say that?
When comparing ships fit for EHP (shield rigs, Damage control, shield modules in the mids), the Porpoise is in the same league as the Skiff and Procurer, the most survivable of barges. To be precise, the EHP is right behind the Skiff and just above the Procurer.
In a mining fleet ready for combat consisting of Skiffs, Procurers and Porpoises, if the enemies are going for the most expensive ships first they pick a Skiff and if they’re going for the easiest kills they’ll pick a Procurer.
I would say the tank of the Porpoise is in the right spot.
Tank not enough to do what? Tank not enough compared to what? Does it die to rats? Suicide gankers? Null hunters?
I feel like I’m missing context.
Edit:
Thanks for the edited context!
Level of Mackinaw you said?
I can get a ‘tanky’ Mackinaw fit to 35k EHP.
My T2 Porpoise fit is 98k EHP, 115k with shield boosts turned on
Procurer is about 82k EHP (with T1 rigs)
Skiff: 110k
The Porpoise is far beyond Mackinaw levels of EHP. What was your fit?
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Mining Foreman Burst II, Mining Laser Optimization Charge
Shield Command Burst II, Shield Extension Charge
Medium Asymmetric Enduring Remote Shield Booster (+1 utility high, cloak, tractor beam, salvager, extra command burst…)
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II
Ice Harvesting Drone I x1
Ice Harvesting Drone II x1
Mining Drone II x5
I admit I cheated a bit with the number 115k with both shield boosts turned on, as a Porpoise would be there to at least give 1 mining boost which means losing 1 rig if it uses 1 mining burst and 2 shield bursts. The fit above gets 108k EHP.
The T2 rigs are a bit pricey, but with the hull price of the Porpoise I would say they are worth it. With T1 the fit gets just below 100k EHP, still far beyond Mackinaw levels.
Explains it, that is pretty much all tank, though why the drone damage amp?
My fit was 67k with an Alpha toons skills, sure it would be higher. It was setup to be close to my Orca fit with more utility, it was not tanky enough for me and your fit does not have the utility I was after, so I stuck with the Orca, though it does not have the survey scanner fitted.
[Porpoise, Simulated Porpoise Fitting]
Reinforced Bulkheads II
Damage Control II
10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Large Shield Extender II
Survey Scanner II
Mining Foreman Burst II
Mining Foreman Burst II
Small Tractor Beam II
Salvager I
Medium Transverse Bulkhead II
Medium Drone Mining Augmentor II
Medium Drone Mining Augmentor II
Hobgoblin II x5
Mining Drone II x5
Ice Harvesting Drone I x1
Hornet EC-300 x5
My Skiff fit has one mining lasar upgrade but is all tank apart from that. Explains the discrepancy then, I had the Mackinaw at about 50k for some reason in my head as a benchmark, not sure why as I don’t use them because I think the tank is too poor.
My benchmark is that it has to have a tank to deal with 7 Catalysts and not lose utility.
I wanted to see if I could replace my Orca’s with something cheaper.
Thanks for the fit and the reply, I still think that the Porpoise needs a better tank though.
Yep, if you’re looking for a good EHP numbers on your ship you shouldn’t fit things like scanners.
The drone damage amp is optional. I like being able to deal with null rats as quick as possible, as I cannot use mining drones or use a cloak when they are around. Alternatives for me are intertial stabs to align fast or CPU upgrade in case I’m using drone mining rigs and run out of CPU.
I don’t like the choice of a bulkhead as it makes the ship less agile and the bulk (hehe) of the hitpoints are in shield, not in hull. I’d sooner fit a nanofiber than a bulkhead.
But then again I’m not looking for max EHP to survive ganks, as I’m not using this ship in high sec. In high sec the rats are weaker and every extra bit of EHP helps, so a bulkhead is a good choice there.
Couldn’t the issue be fixed if they change it so the Orca simply can’t field mining drones? I love my Orca but I don’t use it for mining, I using it for boosting my miners.
Feels like an easy fix to me if AFKing is a real problem, the ship wasn’t meant to be a mining ship so remove its capabilities to mine, period.
I really believe that the over usage of the Orca is the low interaction. I don’t think the AFK gameplay is a real problem, but rather the extreme multiboxing that it unlocks. I am sure that what most people see is not 20 guys sitting AFK, but rather 1 guy with 20 accounts being fairly active.
The same ore hold reduction idea would limit this as well, since you would need to interact more often which means you could manage fewer miners. And this could be applied to all mining ships while still leaving the long field time role of the Mack and the fleet hauler of the Industrial Command ships in tack.
It would also allow for the Industrial Command ships to still be able to mine without having an insane number of accounts.
