Triglavian Diplomacy

Considering recent development and previous theory it feel like to me that we “passed” part of the test we are undergoing with the triglavian.

But speculation aside what interest about this event is that we can learn a few things:

  1. first, we learn they CAN destroy our entire economy with little efforts.
  2. they choose not to. For me it’s the first obvious step toward peaceful diplomacy.
  3. drifters must use either better defensive mesure against such attacks or a altogether different way of communication than us.

So! Back to the speculative part.
I think the collective is indeed seeking allies in their fight against drifter. How did they operate in this endeavour?
My guess is that the triglavian used such attack to “corrupt” the drifters and send a message in a black box to “whoever could read it”.
That’s why the first to give us actual information on the collective was… the drifter themselves in their “death balls”.

It is then possible that the death ball itself was not of their doing but of the virus/worm attack.

The goal was to disturb the drifter operations AND send a “bottle to the sea”. Hoping that someone also at war with the drifter would catch their message (increasing the chances by making the deathballs which can only give the impression of a massive attack/danger).

Since that time, the drifter must have increased their security measure, but the message was passed not to one but two potential allies: the drones and the capsuleers.

My guess here is that the drones were already looking on ways to go to the abyssal deadspace, even possibly already having found a way to dive without filament, to look for isogen-10 that we know they are looking for.

Each hive being more or less independents of the others (while the majority of them are hostile, we can run across some rogue drones that are not) and they probably reacted differently toward the collective. That would explain WHY the collective is divided about them.

And also why they gave us the filaments.

By being proactive in giving us a way to dive into the abyss, they can control where we arrive and how we are treated. It also prevent us to make research on other ways to go there.

what do you think?

PS:: I will update the triglavian fact list later when I had the possibility to try those “upgraded” filaments


Well what do you know. Turns out meme worms do exist.

Also I strenuously deny having anything to do with releasing this, or any other, worm.

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Well … the idea that we’re unwelcome invaders in Abyssal deadspace keeps seeming less and less accurate. Whether we’re being baited in for some purpose seems like a better question, though.

I’ll be really interested to see how this ends up working from our end. Most of the designs I’ve seen seem like running into even one instance of even a not-so-uncommon hostile type would likely have one frigate going down, leading quickly to a total loss. The Damavik’s cross-repping seems like an obvious solution, but I’ve been told With Great Authority in a go-away-stop-talking-about-it-it’s-not-viable-and-that’s-final kind of way that their range and damage isn’t sufficient to the task.

I still wonder about that, though. I can’t really see even assault frigates standing up very well against a nullifier/webifier/Karbydis squad, and the Damavik’s cross-rep support potential’s pretty strong.


They have already said as much. Its in the Augmented foreign Narodnya data stream excerpt. Talks about capsuleers being a suitable candidate group for proving. That is how Triglavians work generally. They take an idea and then test to see if it fits, profitably with their world view, by proving. We are being tested, so it could lead somewhere. It is interesting that they used a worm to infiltrate the filaments, I had a conversation about backdoors into our networks just recently.

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Sir, I think do clearly don’t have the data necessary to state this kind of things. We simply don’t know yet if the drones and us got a special treatment or not.

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Well-- sure; I more meant to imply “some awful/destructive/profoundly-unhealthy-for-humanity-generally purpose.”

I don’t mind having my piloting skill or our overall technological level assessed, hopefully leading to other kinds of exchanges and maybe even-- dare I even hope-- trade? I’d mind a lot more if the whole thing ended with the Triglavians going, “Okay, that’s enough; we are now satisfied we can crack your defenses like an eggshell,” and proceeding to explode out of Abyssal deadspace pockets all over the cluster and do just that.


Aria Jenneth >
While I agree, the data seem to go against it. And the recent worm is clearly a sign of “we could destroy everything without breaking a sweat but choose not to”.

that’s what I said in the OP. If their intention were hostile, the worm would have destroyed the SCC hubs and in one swift attack, all the economy is damaged, communications broken etc

Moreover we still don’t know their capability to come into our space without harm.

It’s my theory that they simply can’t live in our space without heavy medical aid.


It inherent in every piece of data we have on them. They record everything and store it in the Cladeflow, which seems like a culture-wide intranet, although at an infomorphic level. Every decision they make is subject to looking through past experiences,‘reverse time-sense’, and then subjected to proving. It’s very rare that something isn’t proven, and that gets discussed as well. The whole sense of it is that they have a game plan, a route to some kind of utopian ideal existence, and anything new has to be worked into it, or got rid of.
I don’t think its just skills and tech they are assessing, its how we approach things too.


Annisir kaugan >
I agree, but it’s still a speculation, we know nothing else that they CHOSE to show us. Therefore the info we get is to be taken with cautious.

For exemple, if the situation was reversed, capsuleers were to choose what to show to some kind of foreigner coming in our space, we could choose to show that we are unified, even by showing ACTUAL FACTS yet in reality capsuleers are all but united.

((EDIT:: I don’t know why, but the forum don’t show who I’m responding to :confused: so I edited the msg to show it)


I don’t think they have any actual problems entering or surviving in our space. It may be that, if they are as, as we think likely, a Jovian offshoot, then their population is low. That could make them cautious in exposing themselves to ‘the Ancient Enemy’. I’m not going off the details in the data we get, that’s largely immaterial, but the sense. I’ve spent so much time poring over it, I can read stuff without thinking about, and I don’t need to spend hours trying to spend hours working out the etymology of a particular word.
This isn’t about New Eden as a whole, if they can access our networks they know how divisive we can be. It’s about how individuals respond in the Abyss.

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Annisir Kaugan > did you read my previous reply ? ^^" I never said that they didn’t knew we were divided. Only that IF the situation was reversed (aka WE chose what to show to the TC) we COULD show a unified front when the reality is not.

It was an illustration about the fact we should take with cautious what the TC show us.

Your skills in reading the concord’s translation were not in question, sir.

I still must post my study of the mutaplasmids on the IGS, but my early results show that they are so specialized that they is a high probability that they can’t survive much time outside of the specific environment of the abyss.
A bit in the same way that WE can’t survive more than 20 min in those gravitational maelstrom.

On the note of population, I disagree, but it’s not the subject here.

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They do not live in the Abyss.

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Because nobody lives there. I don’t need to prove it. There are no settlements, or livable structures. You need to prove they do.

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so, first, it’s not because we didn’t found something that it’s false. Unless we have absolute proof in a way or another, we simply don’t know…

second, what say that the structures we meet in the abyss aren’t liveable? they have a docking port after all…

Third, if my hypothesis is correct and they are an near-pure infomorph society, then they could have billions inside a single tower.

Fourth, the very fact there is mutaplasmid residue in their environmental suits, is a clue about them living in the abyss…

Fith, all their references about space is specified inside the “flow” which we know by the same textes that is their word for the abyss… While I agree it’s subject to the cautious I advised about the veracity of such information, it’s still information.

I agree that we don’t have an absolute proof, but there is more evidence that they do live inside the abyss than the contrary…


Would it be reasonable to suspect that any and all technology connected to gal-net, including this forum is now compromised by this Triglavian worm ?

Are our clones at risk ? Our cyberimplants ?


If you make a definite claim like that, the onus is on you. We don’t know if anyone or anything can live in Abyssal space. Sure, you haven’t seen any settlements and you haven’t seen any livable structures, but nor have you seen much of anything. The pockets of Abyssal Space available to us capsuleers are significantly limited and could hide all manner of infrastructure we don’t know yet.

How do you know nothing lives in the Abyss?

Now, hypothesizing that this is the case is another thing entirely. Abyssal space does to me smack of an intermediary location, each pocket temporary in nature, rather than a permanent living space but we don’t yet know.


Valerie Valate >
it is possible for the forum, but for the clones and implants, I don’t think so.

Mizhara Del’thul >
thanks, I must make the precision tho that the time limit we have in the abyss is made by the interaction between the filament (a supposed mutaplasmid) and your warp core. Not the pocket itself.

That mean the collective could very possibly have permanent structures.

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Very interesting, and plausible, hypothesis. I’ll be watching this very closely


We have yet to find any structures, so at the moment nobody lives in the Abyss. All the Abyssal pockets are listed as Exclaves, Jove from their history live in Enclaves, its in all the body of knowledge we have about them. An Exclave is a pocket in alien territory, by definition. What we see in the Abyss are caches, small ships, and drilling rigs. They don’t live there, they farm resources there. I am surprised that we don’t see any forward operating bases, of any description, no refining facilities either. So in all probability they take stuff elsewhere to use it. I suspect even the Triglavians would have issues maintaining any kind of structure in the Abyss, no means of anchoring it that we know of.
I do not know where you get the idea the ‘flow’ is the Abyss. Nonsense.
“With this scribing is the working of the flow revealed as law”
The flow is their path to a utopian society, nothing more. The Cladeflow is the body of knowledge, rules and laws that they use to guide themselves.
They work in the Abyss, of course they have residue in their suits.

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