Its not a claim, its just a fact.
Games do not have any inherent ethical quandry to them.
Thanks for my birthday present , Iāll mount in in our offices as a reminder why we fight .
The unknown miner
Will be its name.
I totally disagree. Even if one is only roleplaying a part, one is still roleplaying a character that either has ethics or doesnāt. Zero ethics would make the entire game pointlessā¦as it would imply zero motivation, and motivation is the very core of ethics. So its impossible to argue that any game has zero inherent ethics. The minute there is a āneedā to play it, that in itself introduces the motivation that brings ethics along with it.
Itās unethical to mine without a mining permit.
Itās a crime in real-life. Itās a crime in EVE Online.
So how would you quantify the community Aiko has built then? They certainly enjoy the game. They play it and build community. How is it different from the nullbears?
So, which ethical framework applies to Eve online? If ethics does apply within the game, surely the ethics we should consider are those that are in-game, not RW ethics (at least insofar as they apply to how to play). Within-game ethics in Eve seems to be deontologically based, where anything that does not contradict the rules (both programmed or within the EULA) is ethical, and anything that does in unethical. So, High-sec ganking is ethical, anti-ganking is ethical, not ganking is ethical; but RW money trading is unethical, as is griefing, as are racially motivated insults in chat or via email.
We can argue about whether the rules/framework are themselves ethical, based on RW frameworks, if we accept the rules as applicable to the in-game universe, then Eve has ethics. If we want to consider Eve gameplay from a RW ethical perspective, then which ethical framework should we apply?
Thatās also not considering that different groups/corps in Eve might have their own particular shared ethical values/positions ie.
Itās unethical to mine without a mining permit
(sorry, Iām not sure how to attribute quotes to usernames yet)
People can play ethically (by their internal to the game code of ethics) while being in flagrant contradiction of another groupās ethics/ethical framework, especially in a make-believe game with made-up rules and a wide variety of potential gameplays.
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How would you define griefing in such a manner that it did not include highsec suicide ganking for lulz ?
My understanding is that James 315 promoted the whole ganking thing as a counter to AFK miners in Orcas. In my view a worthy cause. Then thereās ganking for big ISK amountsā¦again Iāve no issue with that. In fact Iām all for it. The Eve version of The Italian Job is precisely what Eve is all about.
But ganking just because one ācanā do and its hilarious watching some noob weep over his lost Venture, with zero reward for the ganker other than a pointless ākillā where the 5 ships lost in the excercise never get subtracted from that. Hmmā¦thatās about as close to griefing as it gets.
The problem isnāt ganking itself. The problem is that of people using the same justifications for the worthwhile cases to justify the pointless ones.
Can you link your lossmail?
Is it possible you could actually make a point that you back up with a fact, like, ever?
You disagree but bring no supporting facts to back it up.
No it isnt.
A playing piece is not a person therefore if I destroy your piece and it is within the rules to do so there is no question of unethical behavour.
The only unethical behaviour in a game is cheating, and we arent remotely talking about that.
Im starting to think you dont know what ethical actually means.
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Isnāt the point we can bring our own ethics into eve and if you want fight for them , thatās the great thing about RPG you can be and do anything you like , Iām sure some canāt sway far from their real selves why others can let go and turn into homicidal space pirates or black hearted Unforgiven mercenaries . Why others just want to chill out and mine. Poor ccp having to police this I say.
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Well I got there first and thought you donāt grasp that not having any ethics IS an ethic. Itās commonly called ā I donāt give a ( expletive )'.
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Let me know when you see a playing piece move of its own accord. I just gotta see this poltergeist activity.
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In my view CCP should scrap Concord and all security statuses should depend on what local police force people can muster up. Just as thereās people happy to be bored mining all day, Iām sure thereād be people happy to police asteroid belts all day. And so on. A proactive police force ( who could also be open to bribes, corruption, etc, etc ) would make the whole game far more fun.
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How did you come to the conclusion that was a response that made any sense?
Love the sound of that
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Would you like to purchase a mining permit?
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In the context of Eve and hi-sec, griefing would be repeated, deliberate and targetted (all 3 in combination) harassment of a player. Ganking someone in high-sec, in and of itself is not griefing. Ganking someone multiple times in the normal course of trying to find people to gank (in other words, not searching exclusively for them and ignoring other equally available targets) is also not griefing because it is not targetted.
As to your ranking of motive, why do you get to judge what is a worthy motive or not in others? Eve online isnāt a civilisation, itās an Attenborough nature documentary. The Nile Crocodile lying in wait for the fat wildebeest to cross the river isnāt questioned on its ethics, nor is the cheetah for targetting the youngest and slowest gazelle because itās easier to catch even though it doesnāt provide as much sustenance. Itās entirely possible that the thrill of the hunt and chase is the motive for gankers - the planning, the successful execution, the heart-thumping adrenaline rush, the uncertainty of outcome. That is their sustenance, not the end result.
(Full disclosure - Iāve only been playing this game for 4 months and never been killed in High-sec, so never been ganked. Nor have I ganked. Iāve died plenty - gatecamps, ambushes, afk stupidity, been hunted, went to fight someone and lost in FW space, but that was all in low-sec and wormholes, so canāt be considered ganking. Iāve even been killed multiple times by the same person who one-shotted me to oblivion each time. But it wasnāt griefing, it was just in the normal course of them visiting their hunting spots at the same time I was visiting for ratting purposes. Iāve even had a go at trying to catch my own prey a few times - mostly I suck, but even from that limited experience I can see why people would want to do it, regardless of ISK-based rewards/losses)
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This person gets it
And verily the EVE gods do reward the faithful. This, this perspective IS EVE Online.
I managed to get a venture/gila last night in low and then listened to my instincts and noped out afterwards, avoided the gate camp just as it was being set up 
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But thatās my whole point. A PvP police force could be a bunch of saintsā¦or be totally corrupt. Beats having a bunch of indestructible unthinking NPCs.