Upcoming Siege Green patch impact on small organizations in C1 - C3s


I have concerns that this change will adversely affect WH life in the extreme. This literally makes life for small organizations exceptionally hard as now you have only one true timer for all medium structures. Yes, yes I know " Don’t be a poor…anchor a Fort, azbel, or tat" albeit while I’m very sure that will make Pearl Abyss happy in the extreme with the increased expenditure of isk/plex it is unnecessary in many cases for small organizations in the lower level holes. Indeed, and correct me if I am wrong, where in the past a raitaru and/or astrahaus would be in many cases ignored so long as it was appropriately fueled and fit correctly now it can be as easy a person with just two - three characters reinforcing a raitaru on a Friday and killing it on Sunday. God forbid anyone ever take even a single weekend off of “Eve - Online” as you’ll lose your structures. Forgive my rant, but I am asking you, all of the WH subject matter experts, after the initial round of explosions that will reverberate throughout all J-space will this actually help in any way? Again, I may be wrong, however the depopulation for C1 - C3 has gotten worse and worse over the past few years and I cannot help but seeing this as the final nail in the coffin in many ways.


The community representants are the will of blue donut null itself, and small corps are an eyesore to the blue donut. Especially small wormhole groups.

Other superalliances would come and ref a structure, then come again for a not-so-rarely pre-arranged “fight” with the defenders, unless the defender didn’t pre-arrange not to form a defense fleet. But a small group… it ignores the structures it can’t take down anyways, and instead goes to roam for the afk ishtar swarms, kills the crabs, and does all other kinds of uncalculatable damage that sabotages the income flow. The small groups and their small fleets are what “eve players” hate the most, and need to get rid of most.


Devs keep making changes that hurt small groups and help bloody nullsec blobs.

Wormhole space used to be a very specific niche, where small groups could live enjoying industrial bonuses of nullsec/WH while having good logistics through random connections to highsec. After disabling filaments, this “change” is final nail into coffin of WH-space.

As groups of newer players are being bashed again and again, community slowly decays. But CSM is happy. All these bloodsucking nullsec fatmen applaud this concept “join our blob or stay poor in highsec to eventually leave EVE”.


The dev’s have explicitly asked for feedback. When you look at the feedback, it is looked at for the WH space, I am very sure that changes will be made. What they will look like is of course speculation. My guess is that everything will remain as it is in J-Space, or what I think is more likely, 1 timer after about 3 days.


@Sophia_Mileghere its seems that CCP has an idea, partially develops it, throws it out in a patch and then spends years revoking the very content they give us, in example WH’s of course, faction warfare, and of course the famous Rorqual buff…followed by like 6 nerfs after they got everyone to make alts, sub them, buy skill injectors for them. I’ve played since 2005 and recently I feel more and more like that clown meme as I see how Pearl Abyss/CCP are manipulating us.

I agree with you. Some ideas seem really half-baked or are not pursued to the end (e.g. the introduction of the upwell structures or EVE Portal). What I also find really unfortunate is that CCP is giving away so much potential in EVE.

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Sadly they no longer have plenipotentiary powers in their own company. I’m pretty sure there is a Pearl Abyss representative (watch dog) sitting in their corporate headquarters that is “consulting” on every aspect of the business so as to monetize everything to the max like their own main game Black Desert online. I agree with you wholeheartedly about all the wasted potential, its almost now that the “executives” of CCP have extracted their own investment via the sale to Pearl Abyss, they really no longer give a fu**.

I’m an outsider, so correct me if I’m wrong, but it would seem that wormholers have enough people to ensure at least one seat on the CSM. However, they rarely get a seat because of bad blood leading to many guys not being willing to vote for guys from other groups (according to rumors). Now, I don’t know if this is true or not, but if it is, you guys are screwing yourselves. I mean, what’s worse for wormholers, having a guy from a group or class of wormholes you don’t like be on the CSM, or having absolutely no representation on the CSM. I don’t man, but it seems like the latter option hasn’t been panning out too well for you guys.

Let me be clear, I sympathize with wormholers and the small groups out there. However, I think it’s a serious stretch to consider all of this as part of some grand conspiracy to increase monetization. The biggest reason wormholers get screwed over so much is simply because the concerns and values of the sov null play style dominates player feedback by dominating the CSM and reddit. Of course, we can argue that CCP should do more to seek out feedback from other play styles (which they do do to some degree through things like email surveys, focus groups, and official dev threads), but the simple fact of the matter is that a lot of the changes that they make aren’t somehow designed to drive plex sales, but are instead designed to cater to players with different values and concerns than you.

Odin’s Call and other large WH entities will benefit from this change, just like the blue donut nullers will. The large WH alliances will profit even more then the nullers in fact, as they can feed on the k-spacers that are reffing each others’ structures for the lolz, and they can kick off small sized corps from j-spaces they’re interested in alot easier then nowadays, too. Null seccers on the other hand don’t have a history of venturing into j-space to do attack infrastructure

So if WH space would form a cartel like donut null has, and would get their representation in the CSM, that representants would be supporting the changes, as all major WH corps will benefit from it.

Due to a seat becoming available they now have a wh rep on the csm. @Arsia_Elkin

I doubt many people consider me a “wormhole rep.”

I use them a lot when small ganging for travel. I have wormholer friends. I’m not opposed to showing up in a wormhole for a defense for those friends. But I’ve never been in a primarily wormhole-focused group livin’ the wormhole-focused life.


Just a quick intel check on zKB and EvE Who

Puhh …if you represent the accumulated experience of the CSM in J-Sapce, then I can be very happy that I quitted EvE.
Sorry, but the line "I doubt many people consider me a “wormhole rep.” is ridiculous.

I was a member of and for a short time CEO of a C4 WH Corp. We were pretty active with 1-2 people online almost 24/7. We could form a defense fleet of 20-30 players with 24 hours notice. If we bat phoned we could probably have resisted a focused eviction.

We would still probably have lost our smaller structures if attacked.

Small wormhole corps have zero chance of saving structures. Keep things the same or give smaller structures in J space some form of asset safety. If another structure exists, assets move there, otherwise they go to k space or something. Maybe even a hanger container only openable by the owner that can’t be destroyed. Corp assets can drop, but let’s not rob the players.

When you are somewhat new and your entire life is crammed into an Astra having it all drop in a loot pinatia for some already space rich large Corp basher is enough to make people rage quit. This is not consistent with the “new player experience”.

I love bashing structures; especially big blingy Fortizars. I don’t enjoy driving new or small corps out of J space. It is already hard enough to find groups to brawl with.


Odin’s Call and other large WH entities will benefit from this change

LOL, no. Cause small groups will leave WH-space and Odin’s Call will have virtually nobody to hunt on. Your thinking resembles that of CCP. “If we increase price on capitals, players will value them more” - sure they do value capitals more, they simply don’t fly capitals at all.

I am just pointing out that listening to CSM on questions, that are beyond game experience of CSM members, is generally bad idea. Listening them on ideas that could potentially make null blobs even blobier is not just bad idea, that is awful idea.

Eve Online these days just like any MMORPG old enough is in crisis caused by conflict of interests of audience. Casual players or hardcore? Newbies or veterans? Small groups of blobs? Any imbalance leads to decay.

CSM was supposed to bring balance to Eve Online, not leave it in darkness.

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Odin’s Call (and the other j-space aliances) are hunting in j-space? Or are they just rolling holes until they get a hole to an interesting k-space?

Yesterday, Saturday 23th, they produced 4 pages of zkill entries, so it can’t be said they weren’t being active. About half of the killmails were sent/received in k-space, another half in the abyss. J-space? Not a single ship lost or killed.

You yourself implied

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