A Proposal to CODE

That’s not correct, at least not in my experience.

Some participants there don’t like to be told when they make wrong assumptions or are not understanding what EVE is about, yes. I’ve had bounties placed on me for that reason even. But AFAIK neither the HSM nor the AG community as a whole consider me an enemy by any stretch of the word. Actually, I’ve made very good friends there.

Well, I see how you posting with an alt might be too clear that it was an alt biased towards ganking. You should try with an alt that has actually done some AG before posting… :wink:

:thinking: :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: :smile:

Nevermind then. vOv

That video is cute but I don’t quite get what you’re trying to tell me with it, if anything…

EDIT: @Solstice_Projekt removed the vid from the post I replied to and this reply of mine may not make any sense now…

You are not the first …
… you will not be the last …
… and they will never stop bitching, crying and whining.

You make them stop …
… and new ones will come.

Always.

Inevitably.

Until they win.

vOv

via Imgflip Meme Generator

Let me teach you to prevent you from Dunning-Kruegering accidentially. There are a lot of people who know a lot about the whole topic, and as someone who spent, and occasionally still spends, a lot of time with this, I will allow myself to condense it all into one post.

It has never been about understanding the game, or about learning the mechanics. It has never been about “good vs. evil”, and never been about “being able to hunt them and shoot them”. These were all facades. Reasons they gave about one particular thing their hate channeled through. An attack vector.

In the past, they found something they disliked and got loud about it. Eventually CCP gave in and changed, or nerfed, the game play they have objected to. Then, within only a few months, a new generation came and repeated the process. Unbeknown to the past changes did they ask for changes, because the old changes were not good enough. A problem of perception, where those who join in later perceive the status quo as “the norm” and deem it as “bad”, or “wrong” for reasons.

Any complaints have never been about the reasons. They also have never been about the in game activity. These are all just what they manage to express on the surface.

The true reason, which all these people share, is that they object to the idea of self responsibility and the fact that there are people who are better than them … in what way ever. They treat the game as an extension to their real life, because it affects their feelings.

They live in a world where they were told that they are special, a hero, have greatness. They believe in authority and protection. They believe that their words are of importance and they believe they are entitled to what they want.

You will find shades of the above spread around everywhere, in different concentrations. Most afk cloaky threads have examples of them. Bumping and freighter ganking threads are also overrun with them. War declarations, too, are where they reside and keep up a discussion about an issue only they actually have … while succeeding in making it look bigger than it is by constantly baiting weak minds into talking with them.

On the forums, as in the game, you will find people who seem to be your friend at first …
… but will show their ugly faces once you start disagreeing with them in certain topics.

Usually these center around “self responsibility”, “new players”, and “survival”.

It all boils to this:

If it actually was a connected group of like minded individuals, we would call it a conspiracy … but it is not. They are not actually a connected group, yet they are like minded individuals. They share the (passive) aggressiveness and the insults. They share the abuse of definitions and meaning. They move goal posts, keep finding new reasons again and again, they “think of the children”, they outright lie just to get you to agree with them.

They abuse other peoples’ willingness for discussion to make it look like it is actually a serious topic worth conversing about, yet no actually serious discussion every actually takes place.

They share the hate for those who are better than them. They share the hate for those who confront people with their inferiority. They share the hate for those who wish for new players to grow up learning how to survive, instead of being protected by an omnipotent Big Brother / God / CONCORD / whatever.

They are weak, overly sensible and disconnected from reality. Too sheltered, too spoiled, too self entitled. They have been raised into believing that they are important, special, that they matter, that their opinions matter, that they will be successful, that they deserve it, etc. etc. etc. In such realities one does not end up as a self responsible adult, no. You end up as a spoiled, immature brat who is used to hiding behind someone while screaming his lungs out about how bad the others are.

All of the above or some of the above. Some more than others, some less than others. Yet, on a base level, they are all alike. MindShare. (© @Sibyyl )

That is why there is a thread asking for ships to kill gankers;
That is why people ask for a change of bumping mechanics;
It is why there are a handful of people making a lot of noise about afk cloaking (fuck RMTing renter trash);
Why you will always find topics centering around “self responsibility” without ever actually touching the subject directly.

And it is why we have the status quo.

And what is left in the empty pot, after boiling it all down, is that for them it is personal. It is an ideology. They both demand and require that others agree with them, and when you do not, then you are a bad person. They also will never stop, simply because there are already so ■■■■■■■ many of them, that it is simply not stoppable anymore.

Go find and talk to these people who want to fight “bad guys”.
Go create a group.
Go try and fight the gankers, war deccers and or bumpers.

You will learn that there is a huge amount of incompetence hiding behind egos unwilling to accept that they are being bested. Every single day. As soon as you have found successful tactics, and as soon as you have managed to actually get people to listen to you and do as you say (good luck with that), more and more people who want to “fight back” will join in.

And on the forefront, soon enough, there will be those who take it all very, very personally.

I am too tired to go proof reading again, so I apologize if I mixed up paragraphs. Soon it is midnight and after investing a good 15-25 minutes into this post … quite fun … I am calling it a day.

o7

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If you don’t want your freighter ganked, don’t fly a freighter. Duh!

Funny how this thread has evolved from the unreadable garbage that originated it… :laughing:

This is all interesting stuff and I appreciate it, but I think you may be worrying too much about me. :smile:

I have the feeling you missed something I said in a previous post, which I will paraphrase to better fit the context of your post:

Unless the offender shows signs of rational analysis and behaviour, the reason to argue in a public forum with someone that eludes self responsibility is not to try to make him/her understand. It’s to provide whatever relevant information others reading it and actually willing to understand may need for that…

Also, I don’t agree with everything you said. You’re generalising too much IMO, feels a bit like those that say everyone that has fun ganking in game has to be a bully in RL.

BTW, not sure which aspect of the Dunning-Kruger effect is the one you’re worried I might accidentally run into… :rofl:

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Wow people take this game far too seriously after reading through some of these posts and some on the forum in general.
Stuff like “setting someone free” reminds me of what a evil regime over 70 years ago said.
Some people seem to live in a constant state of disillusion inside some roleplay they’ve become one with inside their heads.

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What is more likely, someone actually believes they are on a righteous crusade “setting someone free” from resource collection in a video game, or, that same person brought some of that playful roleplay to the forums in a completely intentional and self-aware manner?

People says things that aren’t true all the time for many reasons. Further, most of them are completely capable of separating their real-world persona from the roleplay that can go on around things like Eve Online.

I therefore urge you to re-read your comment and consider who is the one lacking self-awareness and deluding themselves as to the importance of this video game and what is real and what is not.

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Or, maybe… just maybe… it is you who takes it to seriously :grin: think about it. They are not even really mining you know, it’s a game

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Sure, I probably missed some stuff.

In any case, what you think are the reasons for public discourse is quite irrelevant. I am talking about what is happening, and not how it is supposed to be. You agreeing or not, too, does not matter, because I only ever talk about what is happening, as evidenced by the forum.

You seem to be amusing yourself, and maybe you are actually one of those I was talking about anyway. vOv

I am not convinced that most miners are not actually sitting in their sweat in front of the computer. Not because of actual work, but because breathing through their noses takes a lot of energy…

No, it’s not. You seem to be basically saying there is no point in posting because that’s not going to make a difference anyway and I must be in some kind of illusory and reality denial state posting for self amusement only.

What on earth are you doing spending all that time posting here then? Are you trying to tell me your posts are the only ones that can make a difference or what?

Remmoved a meme gen link. Dont use these.

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Well, if that is what you are reading there, then I can be sure that you think mostly the same as most others, achieving nothing in the process. Hey, keep believing you know better despite all the evidence against you and every single one in current and former times.

Carry on. vOv

Removed*

: - )

No, that’s not what I’m reading. I’m asking because it doesn’t make sense to me that you seem to discourage others from posting (or me at least, haven’t seen you do this with anyone else, actually), but are posting yourself, so just wondering what motivates you to do that…

I don’t pretend to know better than you, it’s pretty obvious that it’s you who pretends to know better than me…

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Looking at your name maybe it is a case of “nomen est omen”. :wink:

Well, my name makes no claims as to how much I know, but rather that I’m always eager to know more than I do… :smile: