Anomic Missions STEALTH Buffed without any warning!

(guigui lechat) #152

You are insulting devs because they don’t want to obey you.

They told there was a bug they just fixed and you think so highly of yourself that you can talk about something you don’t know (how ccp devs work). You are calling the devs lazy, incompetent, and liars. That is plain insults - just because they don’t obey your little selfish mind.

It’s not about being a fanboy. it’s about not talking crap about something you have no idea about.
Your are pissing me off with your constant flow of insults.

And if you hate the game so much that you can’t talk without insulting the devs : just leave. we won’t miss you.

(Persephanie Mae) #153

The bug they fixed has been there since burners were first introduced dude.

The frig agents have been the same for over 3 years.

They said they were never at “the intended development level” and were “chance-based repairing” for ■■■■■■■ THREE YEARS.

They then tried to fix it, made them invincible for a week or 2, then toned it down very very little.

There are literally only 3 ways they could have let this bug go for OVER 3 YEARS that the anomic agent frigates were under-repairing.

  1. Lazy - they admited they were at QUOTE from dev/GMs " unintended development level" for 3 freaking years dude. Over 3 years.

  2. Incompetent - I would assume some time in the 3 year period they would have tried to fix the under-repair bug but just couldnt figure i out.

  3. Liars - (this is what i think) - they just decided to nerf burners. Period. They made them repair faster for the very first time in over 3 years. End of story.

There is no other reason that the burners could be under-repairing for over 3 years and at an “unintended development level” for over 3 years.


(guigui lechat) #154


(Persephanie Mae) #155

Dude the burners were the same repair rate for over 3 years.

They just made them repair quicker and for more.

They said this was an unintended development level and a bug for over 3 years.

Again, what possible excuse could there even be for that dude?

Seriously, stop fighting with me and just try to think how the Anomic Agent misisons could have been bugged for over 3 years?

(guigui lechat) #156

There is no “excuse” for this, just facts. Devs don’t owe you any excuse.

Deal with it. I’m fighting with you because you keep being rude just because the world does not turn the way you want it to.

So YES they said it was unintended development. This does not allows you to call them liar, incompetent, or whatever.
You are just rude for the sake of being rude. But insulting them won’t make you understand the complexity(or difficulty) of their work, and on the opposite will prevent any form of discussion.

(Kaya Allier) #157

this is the opinion of most of the players I know

(guigui lechat) #158

No, this is what they say. Because there is always someone to insult but nobody to congrat, so in the end pointing someone becomes the habit. It does not make the people you know any better.

(Zarek Kree) #159

I think the devs generally do an extraordinary job with an incredibly complex game. They certainly aren’t perfect, but neither am I or anybody else complaining. If it was easy, we’d be overrun with comparable games that were run better and more efficiently that we’d all be playing instead.

That said, I think the frustration over this issue is understandable. When something is “bugged” for three years, it can rightly be regarded as a “feature.” It’s not a “fix” at this point, it’s a mod or a rebalance and the devs should have treated it as such in their communications. I wholeheartedly agree with what they did with regard to modifying burner repair cycles - just not in how they communicated it to the community.

But under no circumstances do I think it’s fair to say this makes them “lazy, incompetent and liars.” That takes a legitimate gripe and makes a ridiculous conclusion out of it.

(Glosamer Varr) #160

Well, I definitely think that the code of the game which has been developed for so many years (and probably… I dont know… in different arms of coders) should and must be very complicated. And that if you redesign one part of it, you may never know what happens to the other part. Okay, that in my humble view is obvious. But what is making people angry is the handling of this issue. I too don’t see transparency nor any clear official view on this and feel myself cheated. I think the technical issue and the PR handling of this issue are two different things. And for instance Persephanie Mae is speaking of the second, while guigui lechat speaks of the first - so please lets not get personal. And I believe, that the community has the right to be informed of what has happened and what is going on.
As for the current state of things, I understand that I and others running those missions should brace ourselves and look for other fits/ ways to entertain ourselves and no changes are coming in, eh.

(Zarek Kree) #161

I’m not a particularly high SP player and the impact of the changes has been minimal for me. The only mission that I could no longer run with my existing fit was Angel Base (I was using an SB Cyclone).

(guigui lechat) #162

You would not consider so if it was at your advantage.
A bug is a bug, a misconception is a misconception, and a fix … a fix, even for an old bug.

I totally agree with you and that the real issue is the bad communication. Though CCP did, AFAIK, reimburse the pilot who lost ships, the sudden change in gameplay, with no discussion, explanation, justification from CCP, can dig the trust eve playerbase can have for CCP.

However I don’t think this is related to the devs. One dev took a ticket, which said “burners don’t rep correctly” and made them rep correctly. this was a 3yo ticket, so a 3yo bug 's fix. The dev just made his job. The issue is more about the team communication which resulted in catastrophic issues for some players - though other player have barely noticed a difference in time to kill.

(Zarek Kree) #163

I would argue that I DO receive an advantage by this correction. It hasn’t impacted me appreciably and it tends to raise the isk/LP because it reduces the supply of LP purchased items on the market. I’m pretty happy with the outcome on numerous levels. My concerns are presented entirely in good faith.

Whether the rep rate was a bug or a feature is certainly debatable and I think both points of view are valid. To some extent, how it’s labeled is academic at this point, but I would suggest that CCP’s poor communication was a direct result of considering it a bug that they finally got around to fixing as opposed to a modification or a rebalance. Their communication pattern reflected the former view. Had it been the latter, they would have presented a more thorough explanation to the community as they do with all other rebalances. Therefore, this isn’t an entirely academic discussion.

To CCP it was viewed (correctly) as a bug that they fixed, but to the players it was viewed (correctly) as an unannounced rebalance. I would recommend that players cut CCP some slack and recognize that it WAS a bug as far as they were concerned. But I would also recommend that CCP recognize that if you let broken systems linger, it effectively becomes a feature and can no longer be treated as a bug in your communications with players. There’s plenty of room for both views to be correct.

(guigui lechat) #164

FFS a FEATURE is something you add for a reason, there is no reason to call a bug a feature.

A bug does NOT become a feature with its old age.

(Zarek Kree) #165

Maybe not to the devs, but to the players (most of whom didn’t know it wasn’t working as intended) it does. It’s a matter of perspective.

When my dog started jumping on the couch as a puppy, I didn’t really intend for her to make a habit of it, but I also didn’t correct her. After 3 years of her jumping up on the couch without a correction, she naturally assumed that it was what I wanted. I can’t just suddenly forbid her to get on the couch now without her being really confused. It might continue to be a bug to me but it’s a feature to her after all these years without correction.

But we can simply agree to disagree. It’s a minor point. Regardless, I think we all agree that CCP could have handled the communication better.

Hidden L4 Changes?
(Rosov Aulmais) #166

I remembered that the CCP in another Warzone Extraction thread, in which they described “As much as we have some really technically amazing tools to work with, some of the content tools are extremely primitive.” Yeah, they were making mistakes, some of which even made it into Tranquility. Bugs and unintended changes that aren’t in the patch notes are common as I pointed out in one previous post.
And they just move on when the thread is cold. The public reaction depends on how much they lose. I personally just invested about 200m on a bombing cyclone, and several Hawks. But I am still able to do most of the burners so I think that is fine.

(guigui lechat) #167

No, it’s called education, not “bug and feature”. Don’t try to make comparisons on things that are not related.

Even if players are used to (abusing) a bug, it does not make it a feature nonetheless.
Dreads AI was glitchable in null sec, so one could prevent a dread from repping and have an easy time killing it.
When ccp corrected the yeards-old bug(a few months ago) , nobody screamed because they removed a feature.

So NO, bugs DON’T (usually) become a feature as time passes.
Here the only difference is that it was not perceived as a bug by the player base, because the effect was minor. Still the burners were not behaving like ccp intended, and this had to be corrected.

(SiRSp0T AloT) #168

They did not do anything to it for over 3 years cause they fuked it up, and u say it’s not fail at all, someday u will get it, I am sure xD made my day.

(Muffinmixer) #169

Honestly, this whole thing is just a symptom of CCP not giving a single flying ■■■■ about PVE mission content in this game. They do NOT CARE.

So what if it was a bug and the original intent all along was for these Anomic Agents to be only complete-able by like 1-2 specifically fitted ships with very high skill levels?

That’s still bad design: It doesn’t emulate the huge variety of stuff you will encounter and use to counter stuff in PVP at all, and it just increases the entry barrier for people who want to run anomic missions.

But CCP does not care.

It was a bug, so they fixed it. The question of “Should we fix this? Would it be good or bad for the game?” probably never even crossed their minds. They even forgot to highlight it in the patch where they fixed it.

Why are we even complaining about this when they clearly don’t care?

(Rosov Aulmais) #170

Because the average time another guy comes to rant in this thread is less than 3 months. It is already pointless as it is clear that CCP won’t go back.

Now regarding the Burner Mission. Like other ISK/LP faucets they are just ISK/LP faucets no matter how fancy you make it. If it is too hard then nobody will do it (for example, the Guristas Anomic Base). As I pointed out in another post people gradually become more keen on doing burners. And EVE’s nature isn’t gonna support too high risk in PVE because there are always other choices.

(Nana Skalski) #171

Well, they seem to have a very slow reactions to every bug or exploit that doesnt affect their ability to make more money. I remember the SKIN “bug” that allowed everyone to apply every SKIN to every ship, it was fixed very quickly.