Loot is pretty random - maybe 5%-ish drop decent faction stuff? I’ve run 20+ missions and gotten next to nothing. I’ve also run missions (Serpentis Base) which have dropped 500m. Every mission eventually drops something so do take the time to look - a faction DCU, drone damage amplifier or a nice blueprint can really make your day.
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yeah but by the time you got your 500M loot, the mission nets you 500M in bounty +1B in LP.
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agree with the above on loot, also a bunch of it isn’t worth much like the faction resistance platings, but when you get a faction damage mod, web, tracking comp, or other like drop it’s pretty nice. I don’t really count drops in my income so if anything I’m understating it, but also it’s random enough that overall it’s not a huge effect.
What is important is that some missions have a high delay to loot (eg blood and serpentis burners have 30s to loot) with very low potential reward(<1M/=burner) . That means looting them is a choice for 120M/h, so actually reduces your income. On the opposite, agent angel/sansha/guristas and base serpentis always have almost 0 time to loot (only first talos is far but anyhow the time is low compared to total completion), so even if they have bad items you should loot them anyhow.
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Pretty sure that I am one of very few people to use a kiting Worm with ECM for Team Burner missions (good for surviving bad connections). But, for the benefit of any other weirdos who do the same, I just tested the October Release ECM changes on Singularity and am happy to report that the method still works - with the only difference being that the Burner targeting brackets don’t go away (they don’t fire at the drones so its all good).
Anyone else use an ECM fit that might be affected?
Also: Bump
how is it better than a polarized garmur ?
It’s not - I’ve just never bothered to change since I’ve been using Worms for years and have several of them. Maybe I’ll make the switch.
Also, that comment was an excuse to bump the thread before it got locked next week.
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Hey all -
I’ve been putting myself on the clock lately, and really scrutinizing my income levels, factoring in bounties, loot, mission ISK rewards, and LP value. I’m consistently coming out between 200 and 220. (Yay!!!)
So here’s a couple of questions:
I’ve now got a fit and some comfort with the Blood Base burner. But it doesn’t feel like it increases my income level at all. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think I’m losing much if I drop this one from my repetoire?
Now, Serpentis base. Tried it a long time ago on SiSi, absolutely sucked at it. I need to do a lot of runs to get this under my belt.
Am I correct in guessing that, due to the potential for high-value loot in the Serpentis Base burner, I should go ahead and invest the time into learning it, and ISK into a good ship to run it? Are there cap-stable fits still possible with this mission?
Thanks all. Fly safe.
gain/h = (base reward + bonus reward + lp*iskplp +loot +bounty- consumable-repair)/total time to undock/killrat/redock/repair.
for most burners, loot = <1M
also lp*iskjplp is around 20M.
base +bonus reward is around 4-5M
consumable + repair is almost 0, it can be ± equal to the loot.
in the end, gain/h = (bounty+25M)/time
for standard burner, bounty =5M(guristas is less, but well…); for serp base, it’s 21M; for base angel it’s 22M; for base blood I think it’s 15M ?
for basic burner (let’s say 2j away) it’s average 6min per burner so 300M/h
any additional minute required to do the burner should translate in 5 more M isk to be worth doing.
The base blood nets 10 more M so can be accepted to be done in 2 more minute.
The base angel nets 15M more so can be accepted in 3 more minute. Actually it takes almost same time to do it (6min), and can happend to provide better loot than other agents.
base serpentis nets a very small more loot (let’s say 4M more at max) so around 25M total, that is +4 minutes to do the mission. I usually do it in 10minutes(again, including everything and 2j away), so in that case it is okayish.
No with different fits/implants/skills you may have different results. Find what is worth, for you, and prune the missions to remove useless ones.
I personally think that base blood is better in term of isk/hour than agent blood, but also more risky so I do the agent and not the base.
So I’ve been doing the old Blitz n’ Burner thing in Lanngisi for a few months. My Isk and LP payouts have, of course, been great. But the drops of good faction loot has dried up to practically nothing. I thought maybe CCP adjusted the loot drops for Burner missions or something and so resigned myself to losing that income.
And then I ran low on ammo. I’m kind of a tight-wad with buying ammo, so I sent a Burner-capable alt to do missions around Waskisen for a couple days in order to build up some of that sweet, sweet missile-buying LP - mostly (but not exclusively) with Corporate Police Force. After 3 sessions over 2 days (and not declining missions that would hurt standings like I do in Lanngisi - just moving on to another agent), I’ve made about 500 mil Isk from mission payouts, 450K in LP and almost 700 MIL in faction loot. That’s more faction loot then I’ve made in at least the last 2 months in Lanngisi.
Normally, I would chalk this up to just bad luck, but the difference was just so striking. I was back to getting decent drops every 5-6 missions. So the question is: why? Does lots of people running missions from the same agent affect drops? It doesn’t seem like it should, but I’ve never really thought about it. Does my lower standing hurt somehow? That doesn’t sound right either. Or has it really just been bad luck in Lanngisi?
Any insight someone might have about how Burner drops are determined in cases like this would be most appreciated.
No. It is a plot. CCP does not like you personally, but did not expect you will game them by moving elsewhere…
RNG will RNG. Is there a hidden loot algorithm, maybe but no one outside of CCP is going to know. I remember getting pretty equal loot everywhere but I never tracked it to any statistical standard. And of course almost all of that would likely be useless due to stealth chages
no, he is 100% percent right, I have several spots to farm burners and those crowded with people have a very low faction dop, so low that I stopped noting the loot because I should also take note of the system it dropped in.
eg doing freatlidur I had 4 times more drop that in hek or jita, average, per agent.
It happened a LOT when I change spot, to feel like CCP changed the loot.
of course sometimes I also have good loot in hekk or jita, but it’s once every 100 h our of gameplay, so that I consider the net worth of loot is 0 for most systems.
That’s why going to backwater systems is nice. No gank, better isk/LP, you can easily run more alts because the trips are longer, and you drop cynabal bpc from base angel, or shadow DC from thaloses, or caldari navy invul from team hawk, or fed/rf web/point/scram from team gal/matar, or dd bpc from agent serpentis, etc. here and there, which is nice. the only sad thing is that I cant correlate it to available data, so I have to set this loot value to 0 
.
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When I’m not doing WH stuff, incursioning, doing events, or running abyss sites (I’d say those are my 4 main PVE activities over the past year), I run a mix of regular L4s (in a pair of any of the 4 marauders or else 3 Rattlesnakes or 3 Leshaks most of the time), so I’m not doing burners all the time when I mish… but I occasionally hit up some team burners (with garmur(s)) and base burners, too.
I do the Serpentis Bases with 3 cap stable 100MN AB Deimoses in ~4 mins tops with no overheat, 3-3.5 mins with some AB overheat and blaster overheating, but then I gotta go tether at a citadel afterwards. 
Just did 2 for the first time in a couple months last week, still works fine.
Interesting. When I’m in the mood for angel base or serpentis base, I do have a little map around Domain/Tash-Murkon/Kador of 32 agents I can pull L4s from, and I do the little circuit with all 3 of my toons in leopards or ceptors or hecates real fast and mass pull lots of mishes… I have had decent luck with serpentis talos loot drops, including Shadow Serp DCs as you say, and plenty of magstabs, prop mods, reppers, etc. as well…
I have yet to get a single good drop from an angel base from those same agents, however. I have, however, only done about 20 to 25 of the angels vs. 125+ of the serps, so sample size is a bit off… still. I get good faction drops within way fewer than 20-25 serp base burners. Hearing from you you can get a cynabal BPC from angel base gives me hope. any good faction mods to go with those BPCs?
I don’t think much. BTW the good loot is in the dramiels, not the transporter.
A possibility is that the angel loot table is shared with other angel anoms, that means in matar space the loot is reduced, but actually I had more loots in backwater matar (again, no loot near jita, same for serpentis).
The truth is, I stopped noting the loot because it reduces my isk/h a lot, and instead went to bash writing, that is write isk/LP at start, write the missions names with ctr c ctrl V, drop the loot in a specific can, then write the total LP and isk 20 min after the lst mission is done, that gives a total isk/h and loot, which is much more than when I take the time to write everything (something like 300->500M/h per toon), basically because writing things require to be careful about more things and killing burners needs much brain activity (taking boosters, repping, resupply, using alt to bring /take items, plus active missions like agent sansha, agent guristas or worst the bases).
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Ah, gotcha. I wouldn’t have known, since I haven’t gotten any good loot from EITHER wreck type. 
Yeah, I’ve looted all 4 Drams and the transporter all two dozen Angel Bases I’ve run. nothing but ammo, random mods. maybe a bit of faction ammo, at least.
Good stuff.
use this fit for one-shot-blap 2 times per mission.
[Tornado, *Tornado for Scarlet]
Damage Control II
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Medium Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Caldari Navy Thermal Dissipation Field
10MN Afterburner II
Gist X-Type EM Ward Field
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Auxiliary Thrusters II
Republic Fleet EMP L x7808
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why not 50mn ?
not enough power grid. -7.3 with CA- imp set.
Thanks for the fit. I went ahead and checked this out on Singularity. The MWD PG problem is easily solved by just upgrading to a Medium Ancillary Current Router II as there’s enough of excess calibration space. The (slightly) more difficult problem was CPU, which was about 5.5 short for my character. This could be solved by either upgrading a Gyrostabilizer to faction or downgrading the shield to Tech I - which would then allow you to fit the Compact 50MN. Others might have to do both (and/or upgrade multiple Gyros) if they don’t have the CA set, but I didn’t test that.
In any event, the ship worked great. Immediately alpha Scarlet after first 2 gates - before you even move - and you’re done. After killing her 2 times mission is set as complete and she doesn’t even show up in final area so you don’t have to bother going there. Shortening the mission plus doubling the bounty = good stuff.
Don’t know if I’ll bother to do this on Tranquility, since it would take a while to pay for itself, but I am going to think about it.
Thanks again.
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