Well, you’re talking like a new pilot. As someone who has been here since 2004, it’s pretty clear. The time invested is not being bypassed. The time invested is being sold in BOTH cases. Time is invested in injectors. Time is invested in a character. They are BOTH being sold for real life cash to a player who just came to the game. They are both capable of producing a cap pilot on day 1 of installing the game for everyone.
This HAS always existed in this game. Longer than you have played the game.
It would be different is one of these methods was illegal or didn’t require time invested from a character. But, both require time invested in a character and both have been legal for players to do via CCP rules.
I thought DeMichael_Crimson had been here a bit longer than 2008. So I’m guessing you didn’t used to read the forums much as you would have known that.
Anyway I think you’re referring to the forum character bazaar when you’re talking about character time investment which was one of the justification for PLEX. I don’t know much about the character bazaar as I never really looked at it in detail.
Although iirc PLEX originally was just a means for players to have another way to pay for their subs using isk. Later it was decided to allow them to be purchased and sold via the in-game market in part probably to combat illegal external sales of isk.
Going back to the character bazaar originally I thought you could only buy them with isk (maybe someone can clarify that) in which case DeMichael_Crimson would be essentially correct, unless you bring into the mix isk purchased from an illegal external site.
And you’re talking like someone who started to play this game a long time ago, then went AWOL for an even longer time and has just now recently returned.
Game time cards were starting to be phased out when I started playing in June 2008. Nobody references GTC’s anymore, now it’s just PLEX being used for pretty much everything.
Anyway, I just plain flat out disagree with the rest of your reply. In my opinion CCP never should have implemented Skill Extractors / Injectors as a Trade Commodity. I already gave my reasons for that earlier.
Don’t really care to know why you’re acting like you started here on Beta when your character was cloned on 08/11/2009 @ 07:36 Eve Time. Please don’t say you’re a forum alt because then I’ll just have to say ‘Post With Your Main’.
An isk trillionaire (via now-banned gambling sites) live-streamed the training up of a new character to max skills, quite a stunt. He may have paid-to-win, but - the skillpoints came from other characters. More points and other player’s time were extracted than were (are) applied, due to diminishing returns built into skill injectors.
This isn’t bad, but it gets “bad” or at least diverges from what we were originally promised, when skillpoints are gifted / sold / created directly by CCP to Omega characters.
At the time, players seemed to protest more about not wanting “pay-to-win” game mechanics, such as “gold ammo.”
In my opinion the actual combination of Blackout and nearly no risk for PvPers is the problem. IF for PVP you would have to risk nearly the same amounts of ISK like for a mining/carebear ship risk/reward would be fair.
Who cares to lose a 40m PVP ship? But a 700m mining / carebear ship mattes for everyone.
There are PvP ships that go into the billions and there are mining ships that cost like 400k. What you put on the table is your own responsibility. No one forces you to mine in a 700mil mining ship.
The fact that you even bring this up just shows that there was no need to even think about such a trade-off in null and proves without a doubt that the blackout is completely justified to bring back some danger to null.
Thats exactly the point: to be effective as a miner or a carebear in 0.0 you have to use such ships. As a PvPer it is completely enough to use cheap ships. So where is the risk for PVPers?
I for myself don’t rly care as I don’t mine/rat in 0.0, but in my logic, in this situation 0.0 is a paradise for PVPers missing real risks…
No you don’t anymore. Maybe that used to be the case when there was no danger and no risk, so you could use a blinged out setup to mine. Now there is more danger and more risk and you have to finally account for that. There are many options for mining ships that are super cheap.
I haven’t seen you specifically, but I have seen dozens upon dozens of my alliance mattes mining in Procures, and Retrievers, ratting in VNIs (they’re still fine for ratting) and cheap Myrmidons (that are around 79-80m) all of which are significantlyccheaper than your claim of 700m ships.
Real life cash isn’t being transferred from one person to another. So this statement is incorrect. The only RL Cash is the fee that goes to CCP for transferring from one account to another. The only “cash” that is transferred is isk from in game, which when we are talking about a newb wanting to buy a character with over 70 mil SP, thats close to or more than 65 Bil isk. Unless the newb floods the game with PLEX for isk, he’s already spent more than what was needed to buy a character that the seller transferred for $20.
judging by your comments, there’s no way i would believe you been here from 2004.
The statement refers to the fact that both characters and skill injectors are being purchased at some point by real life cash. Again, buying time cards to exchange for in-game currency to purchase in-game assets such as a character you want is no different than buying PLEX to exchange for in-game currency to purchase in-game assets such as skill injectors to make the character you want.
The end result is a character you did not spend time training has the training you need. The only difference is again, you can be more precise with the training of one method versus the other. But, in both cases, if you want a 30m SP pilot, you get that in both methods with the usage of spending real life cash to attain it.
This is not an opinion, this is not an assumption, this is fact. You have always been able to purchase in-game assets way before skill injectors such as characters, ships, modules, skills, whatever you like with real life cash through the purchase of time cards traded for ISK. If you removed skill injectors from the game tomorrow, you could still get a capital pilot on day one from the character bizarre through the method of purchasing PLEX and selling it for ISK.
Yes, that was my trader alt. Here is my main. No one is hiding.
You can disagree with it all you want. You are wrong. As my alt post above, you have always been able to exchange real life cash to purchase a character you want. This has been here since time cards, has been here way before skill injectors, and was still here after the phasing out of time cards with the introduction of PLEX, which you can purchase for real life cash in exchange for guess what, ISK.
GTC
real life cash → game time → exchange for ISK → 30m SP pilot
PLEX
real life cash → PLEX → exchange for ISK → 30m SP pilot
SKILL INJECTORS
real life cash → PLEX → exchange for ISK → exchange for SKILL INJECTOR → 30m SP pilot
So, you get rid of SKILL INJECTORS. Guess what? I still can purchase whatever I want with my hard earned paycheck through the path of purchasing PLEX.
Honestly, I don’t like the purchase of anything for RL cash. I never liked the idea of GTC for ISK and never liked PLEX for ISK. Outside of skill injectors or purchasing characters, the mere fact players can get huge lumps of ISK for real life cash means they can go out there and just purchase whatever they like for as deep as their pockets are. This results in people throwing ships away in PvP without a real care in the world. It diminishes the quality of PvP IMHO.
I’m fine with skill injectors for as long as you didn’t have to pay for PLEX to acquire it. I don’t mind if there are ways for pilots to catch up to my already over 100M pilot. They will never ever be able to compete with my SP without it. I’m just not okies with people doing that through the means of using RL cash to do it. I would rather the only method of acquiring SKILL INJECTORS or other characters was through playing the game for ISK.
