Is there a reason that you wouldn’t allow any ship to fit it but only allow industrial ships and JFs to jump to it? I ask because the seeding of T1 haulers is quite tedious for those who do hauling for a career.
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So the low skill pvp players win again I see
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Mine too funnily enough, especially when there is no profit in it but just more work
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Actually it’s only worth about 9 now since the announcement of cyno changes. and no I’m not complaining about the cost of a T1 hauler.
As i said I don’t use commonly used routes for safety reasons, the likely hood of the systems i use being seeded with T1 haulers, at any price is very low.
Leaving me in a position I have to give up at least a third of my cargo hold every trip to carry replacement hulls. 6 jumps @ 20K m3 per jump is a lot of space to lose.,.
Losing 4 or 5 rookie ship cynos per trip meant stocking a few cynos and fuel at each waypoint - Now i need to have 20K m3 cyno ships ready at each point.
Ok, even if someone did seed them in the right places for me, at what price? years ago i used to sell cynos for 20 or 30 mil, and sold out every week. How much will a T1 hauler be in a system that see’s low traffic once or twice a week?
Smaller hulls wouldn’t have been enough of an inconvenience for JF pilots.
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Problem is nullsec started dropping titans on everything. I find that to be very oppressive to everyone else’s PvP.
It’s Eve, anything that can be exploited for advantage will be until it starts damaging the game and then everyone will get punished for it.
TBH I am not sure what the fix for cynos really is. But this sure as hell isn’t it. This will barely affect the people abusing the cyno mechanic the most, and seriously screw over the smaller corps and solo players.
The positive change I can see is that there are no more of the ‘every ship of worth has a cyno’. Tackling a shiny T3C, battleship, or cap will no longer be instantly met with bosons. That is a positive.
The negatives outweigh this a fair bit though. Basically cynos are now stuck on expensive hulls. Okay, at first glance this isn’t an issue. However, the intended effect will be neutralized by the larger blocs being able to just SRP the cyno ships. It will also mean that these hulls are going to become stupidly expensive, further pushing people away from them and putting them further out of reach for the average player.
The effect I can see is effectively “Unless you are in a large alliance with numerous people that have 5 cyno alts being kept isk positive by titan-ratting, your jumpdrive is disabled”
Perhaps a dedicated hull that cannot cloak at all, but can fit and light cynos, would work. It could even be made ‘role-friendly’ – cyno beacons take considerable specialized computational power to keep ‘lit’. So the ship would have reduced room for tank (or maybe the cap drain is so high that lighting the cyno drains the cap dry until it is done firing), and the computers cannot coexist with cloaking devices due to some hardware incompatibility.
Perhaps making the normal cyno module disable the ship from cloaking, and using other detrimental mechanics that makes them not useful as an ‘on-grid cyno alt’.
However, the current proposed change is going to completely screw the regular people over. Small corps that don’t have alts and ISK to piss away will now all have to use a Frog service. Solo players are just left without any assistance at all for moving normal caps or supers for that matter. So small corps are now having to invest a ton more effort and time to just… move a freakin’ ship.
So basically the changes as they are currently proposed would have the opposite effect than what is desired.
If the goal is to make capital ownership a royal pain in the ass by introducing a tonne of tedium and stupidity, then as-is it is. But if you’re trying to do what the stated goal is, then you’re going about it in the wrong way.
[edit]The more I think about it, I think the best method to ‘fix’ the cyno issue is to make the module only fittable on frigates or cruisers, and making the module fitting-exclusive to the cloaking modules. For instance, if you have a cloaking module on a ship, and attempt to fit a cyno, it will error, stating that the modules are incompatible.
RIP anyone who already injected their cyno alts.
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Lol yeah.
Lesson learned for them. Don’t freakin inject until after things are set.
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It isn’t just the cost. Now this might be less of a “standard” case that CCP is thinking about, but it is one that will suffer some “collateral Damage”. I used to JF haul for pushx. I was lucky that I had a fair number of cyno alts (5) at the time. However given the nature of contract hauling, the deliveries were literally all over New Eden. It simply wasn’t feasible to stock ships in “standard” cyno locations as people wanted there stuff delivered all over the place.
I could easily spend my days flying my cyno alts over 100-200 jumps to get them in place. It was bad enough in noobships, especially getting popped 20 jumps into a 30 jump route. I ended up training all my cynos to fly interceptors. That way at least I could carry fuel and a cyno, then dock up for a noobship when I got to where I needed to light.
Now doing all of those jumps all over in a T1 industrial? No thanks.
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Agreed. I posted a few up above an idea about either a dedicated cyno hull, frigate or cruiser sized, that might fit the bill, but in your case might not be an ideal fix.
I did have an alternate idea that instead of all of this nonsense, they could make changes to the cyno module itself – It would only be able to fit to frigates or cruisers, and make it drain the capacitor of the host ship dry and keep it there for the duration of the candle, and/or make the standard cyno incompatible with cloaking devices.
I’m sure some people can improve on this idea while keeping the cyno in-reach for all, but eliminate its usefulness as an on-grid titan bridge for blingy ships.
The longer this “Chaos Era” continue CCP Rise should consider how long it will be before his paychecks start bouncing.
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I don’t like this.
I’m invited to a cyno vigil in deep null. For sure I’m not going there in an industrial. Would just mean die meaninglessly and miss the vigil.
I’ll go there by usual means and hope they have a ship to provide… “Oh, sorry, we’re out of ships to hand out, you can’t light your cyno, sucks to be you.”
Solution was so easy. Keep your initial idea, add a new cyno you can’t jump to and can be fit to any ship and maybe even have it work in hisec too.
It’s for a vigil, why make it so annoying for everybody?
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Industrial cyno is adhoc response. need force recon to only move capital not fight?
I want cyno all capital can jump with time lag some minutes.
I guess I don’t see why these recent changes were even thought about. Bombers and assault frig gangs were killing rorqs and caps every day. I’ve been on both sides of these drops. Not always successful but still was fun. Selling my caps and moving out of null. 2 things I was eager to play in when I first started Eve now have lost their lustre. Love BNI and the peeps in Legacy wish them well
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Tech I industrials - some of the industrial are technically not tech I, like the Kryos or Iteron. Does that mean that they can’t be fitted with the cyno mod?
@CCP_Rise hope you’re still reading. everyone’s asking about the new module. you’ve opened up a new can of worms here and dare i say it didn’t need to be this complicated in the first place.
and fitting it to industrial seems like a huge limitation, i reckon original proposal far better
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Damn, that’s a shame… Covert cyno for jump freighters felt so nice!
Ok, so we still have cyno fleets with industrials, which is ok I guess, but since it only works on jump freighters it will still be crippling. And for jump freighters its still going to be a big pain in the ass - the only reasonable way for a jump freighter pilot to operate is to seed hundreds of T1 industrials along his routes, since nobody is going to use regular cynos for jump freighters really - too expensive. With covert cynos it would have been great - short cyno time, doesn’t show up on the overview and also is decent enough to travel around…
But I lold about the cyno vigils: “We understand that you want cyno vigils back, and we will give them to you! In the form of a slow moving T1 industrial…”
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@CCP_Rise the covert cyno option for freighters seems much more reasonable, this new change broadcasts to everyone that a juicy jump freighter is inbound whenever they see a t1 industrial with a cyno lit. Seems like having JFs have the option for either the freight cyno or covert cyno. I applaud trying to keep the cyno vigil alive but this seems like a really drastic swing (again).
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CCP - Your initial proposal caused a lot of discussions (both up and down comments). For a JF Pilot it definitely had merits. And of course , like a lot of other players, I started training / re-training my Alts in Cyno V. With you latest proposal this means that I wasted a lot of time and effort (ISK)
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Please stick to the original plan
a. Or give JF the ability to use both the Covert Cyno and the Industrial Cyno
b . Or also introduce a “light” industrial that can fit the industrial cyno and is max 2.5k m3 packaged (a suggestion was based on a Venture). so that we do not have to carry 3, 4, 5, x T1 haulers @ 20k m3 each!!! as spare cyno ships.
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You guys are so cool! Announce something and then change plans midway. Chaos - yeah! Because making plans should not be rewarding. Just undock and trash your ship. Leeeeroy!
I want to thank Hilmar for curing my EVE addiction - I barely log in these days. You made me buy Kerbal Space Program and I love it. It’s also much cheaper and healthier than EVE. Have you considered a position in the alcohol or tobacco industry?
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