If you’re really THAT worried about it, don’t jump into HS immediately after landing, but the places JFs are likely to come trundling in are already so stunningly obvious that it just seems like you’re looking for anything to wax hysterical about at this point. Anyone keeping eyes on the system for an “industrial cyno” could just as easily watch the obvious waypoint station (and anything in dscan range, for that matter).
Of course they “could” and there is what makes this change so much worse - Even if you take the precaution of not jumping to a commonly known station/structure - No-one need Dscan, they know a JF has just landed.
I’ve had the same JF for over 6 years, through luck and being over cautious - In the “old days” 
I’ve sat in Ignoiton (no longer a waypoint) for many hours when certain players I knew to be hunters saw me or were in Dscan range. It is part of the reason why i still have my original JF.
The new JF only Cyno removes that element of precaution, Anyone in system regardless of where can see the cyno and prepare.
I really don’t think i should have to dedicate even more time and energy to a fairly thankless task because CCP screwed up over and over again.
If they can’t come up with decent changes that don’t target already vulnerable groups, maybe PA needs to step in and find out why.,.
- Vulnerable groups = Any small/er group that resides in Sov Nul that relies on a few JF pilots for logistics.
TBH, it’s becoming increasingly obvious that what you care about, first and foremost, is having something to complain about because as someone running a character literally named HAULIE BERRY (the job’s right there in the name). this is honestly a new height of petty concerns.
You’ve had the same JF for 6 years because actually, jump freighters are ridiculously safe ships that spend most of their time in flight transitioning back and forth between “docked” and “session change invulnerable” states.
You are CCPs new Designer. Come up with a complete system that doesn’t advantage goons over the other groups.
The system must heavily restrict cyno use.
Why? Why is restricting cyno use a requirement, rather than using some other method to achieve the same goal as the cyno changes?
Because I don’t feel like the 50000000000000 what if questions about leaving it entirely open, so I’m theming along the already CCP established lines to see what Ocker can come up with as a proposal.
That’s pretty much why, it’s not like CCP are going to adopt a totally wild proposal at this stage anyway.
CCP aren’t going to adopt any altered proposal at this point. And they’re not going to adopt any proposal that actually does anything to address any of the problems.
Once again, it’s all about twisting a few knobs, making some small tweaks, and hoping that it will create a massive change in the fundamental systems of the game. It won’t.
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Welp looks like we are down another 5000 bots playing this week.
No it certainly must not, if anything it should remove jump fatigue and increase jump ranges - Put big toys at risk. Allow players to define how they want to play the game.
Supers have always been a problem that was compounded by the introduction of jump fatigue, nerfed ranges, invulnerable sov, structures that take a week to kill (even if undefended), etc, etc.,.
By all means restrict Cynos to certain ships but for BOB’s sake let us fuking use our Supers and put them at risk.,.
I’ll form up with anyone to go invade Delve, I’ll put everything I have on the line IF CCP will give us the ability to do it “right” - I won’t spend a month moving my Supers into staging which also lets Delve and CO know we are coming.
The biggest and best fights in this game happen by chance - There is NO chance when the “enemy” knows your every move.,.
This relates to SO many topics on the forums right now and CCP are too blind or narrow minded to see it.
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As we are already in the beginning of September, is this solution the final decision?
Can we have a official announcement or something?
This change will influence null sec industry work because the previously used cyno alts are going to have to train for something, and get those specific cyno ship ready.
The first version of the rebalance looked great. But…
The current option - no pragmatic logic. More Cyno for God of Alts.
As an option:
- Cyno for carriers.
- Cyno for dreads.
- Cyno for matar/ammar/galente/caldari supercarriers
- etc
Without easy Cyno’s for JF’s, you’re going to restrict the flow of goods and crush growth, exact opposite of what your trying to accomplish. JF Movement is essential for resupply and growth, it should be easier/safer, not harder.
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@CCP_Rise @CCP_Falcon - You took feedback from the original idea and changed it to this. Now you’ve received more feedback (mostly negative) about the revised change and I haven’t seen or heard any update.
Can you give us an update to if our feedback even matters at this point? Please see my earlier post in this thread if you haven’t, that points out the flaws in this revision, along with simple alternatives that would satisfy the majority of the complaints people have with this revision.
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Sorry but according to CCP Rise - You are posting in the wrong place.
Try posting on Reddit, you just might see a Dev or GM or someone there. You won’t here, rarely do.,.
CCP don’t “interact” with their own forums but LOVE to on Reddit.
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You’re not fixing anything. You’re not even putting a bandage on a wound.
You’re making a wound so you can put a bandage on it.
Most capital brawls are impromptu where a cyno interceptor is flown in and lights the initial cyno. This means when the situations arise, one can quickly race to the scene. This has often led to really great escalations because a response can be assembled quickly.
The odds of getting a slow-aligning ship within range in a timely manner are pretty slim. So, I can only assume you want to solidify the blocs, and you want to lessen the number of 3rd party romps.
Your claim is that you don’t like the lack of risk for the cyno ships themselves… Here’s an idea:
- Leave Cynosaural Field I fitting alone
- Don’t create an Industrial version
- Make it so that Cynosaural Field I can only be used at a dockable structure/station
- Create a new Cynosaural Field II that can be used anywhere
- Cyno Field II requires a warmup (15 seconds? 30 seconds?)
This allows moving capitals (and JFs) outside of battlefields, while still allowing disruption as the cyno field appears on overview for X seconds before it can be jumped to.
Your current solution is… knee-jerk.
In the interest of adding to the overwhelming wave of feedback, I have a couple comments:
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This is a nerf to the capital umbrella, but without actually addressing the issue. While it wouldn’t be absurd to limit the cyno to ship classes, I dont believe anyone here wants there to be situations where capital fight opportunities are missed due to these changes.
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Wouldn’t it be better to limit the cyno ships that are seen as a problem? Meaning no cynos on capital ships, T1 frigs, industrial/mining ships. ect…….
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Wouldn’t it be better to add a spool up time to the cyno as well as lower the cost and size of cyno inhibs? The idea being you should be at least contesting a grid before being able to call caps on the grid that the fight is currently taking place.
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If the idea is to limit a super capital fleet being dropped on every gang that comes into the space, maybe you should address how effective those ships are instead of just making logistics harder. It’s in every alliances best interest to eliminate roamers as quickly as possible from their space. Game mechanics make the most effective way being to use capitals/supers to do this, making the cyno more expensive is just going to make it easier for the richest alliances to adapt.
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Capitals used to always have a specific role to play. I came back after a long hiatus to see there were HAWs, Titans have multiple dooms days, super caps can now fit plates(with a massive bonus), Titans can effectively use its guns, dealing twice the direct damage of a dread and capital cap boosters are now a mod, eliminating the one biggest weakness of capitals. Also, you can now dock in a station and use a super as any other ship, which was the biggest deterrent for people looking to own one. These ships were always meant to be the biggest and the baddest, but they were never meant to be cost effective, which they currently are. The only effective counter is more of your own supers, as dreadbombs are not cost effective against anything less than 20x1 and carriers are specifically meant to be anti subcap. These things being able to hotdrop with impunity is the problem that needs to be addressed, limiting their ability to move easily out of combat isn’t fair to anyone.
Additional comments, unrelated to the actual cyno “change” but in line with the spirit of the changes:
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The idea should always to be to make eve less painful to play, but also no less punishing and no less hard. This is a niche game, it will never be mainstream, but theres plenty of people interested in the niche if its handled correctly.
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Just wanted to throw this out there, making rorqs actively able to mine then giving them an invulnerability shield probably wasn’t the best idea. Sometimes you shouldn’t give the community everything they want.
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Resource scarcity please. You want people to fight for space give them something to fight over. you have an alliance of 30k that not only almost exclusively lives in one region, but out produces almost the entirety of the game. The issue isn’t so much symmetric resource distribution like its been said repeatedly, its just the shear volume of resources you can upgrade your space to. If you can pull over 10 trillion a month out of any region, why fight? There’s plenty of regions. Speaking from experience, fighting just for the good fight isn’t actually as fun as fighting for a goal.
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Jump bridge networks- You want things to blow up more? make these off grid from stations and have them paid for to keep online as a sov upgrade not liquid ozone fuel , then allow any alliance regardless of standing to use them as if they were just a player created gate. Things are entirely too safe nowadays and being able to use a private defended stargate is lame, but so is flying 40 jumps if you live deep in nullsec. The game shouldn’t be painfully time consuming, but it should be hard and punishing. I’m aware this will never happen, but I just want to throw it out there.
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Look, man, there’s no room for that kind of talk in a thread like this. All that ‘making sense’ and ‘being basically right’. What’re you thinking?? 
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Yes. Changing cyno isn’t in anyway going after this root problem.
But assuming this is a done deal, what’s the plan for adding the new BPO???
There is no new BPO. The module will exist, but be completely unavailable. That way nobody can ever complain about losing a ship fitted with one.
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