@CCP_Falcon Changes have been made to ECM now, but where’s the “small” ship buffs for affected ships like the Widow?
Its lke you would get away STUN from ability and replace it with TAUNT. Its really a very big nerf. Withour rebalance it is just soulcrushing for those who use it and love flying as support or solo in those hulls.
Why CCP did not rebalance hulls?
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They are working on this and have been asking for feedback on ideas to rebalance the hulls if anybody has some. I’ve been asking for the last couple days.
I would like more speed, agility and lower signature radius. Also a bit more shield. That would mean more range dictation like in kiting and would even make it more solo viable. Those shis should also get bay for a few more drones because ECM drones are a bit like old ECM for solo, but can be dispatched rather quickly and for good.
Here’s the news: there are more than one 0.0-sec region! Shocking!!!
@Malcom_Duke can you post you idea in suggestion-for-ecm-fix?
Trying to get all the suggested solutions in one location.
I have seen that you have been asking for feedback on how to buff the Caldari EWAR ships, but I think that this feedback should actually come from people who plan to use those ships in an EWAR role.
Personally, under the current ECM iteration, as a solo player I do not plan to fly the Caldari EWAR ships in an EWAR role as they provide no value whatsoever for me in that role.
I briefly reviewed the Caldari EWAR ships, and when discarding the ECM, most of the Caldari EWAR ships essentially (mostly) become non-bonused ships. For the most part ships of other classes are better at filling in roles that Caldari EWAR ships could be used for outside EWAR. Besides so very special non-ECM fits, the only ship that I might use when looking at the Caldari EWAR ships in non-ECM role is the Rook since it has the feature of being undetectable on d-scan. But overall, I think I can also find better ships than the Rook. So overall, with the current ECM iteration Caldari EWAR ships have more or less become not worth flying.
CCP is of course in their right to sacrifice ECM for solo players in order to solve the issue that some people have “bad feelings” about ECM, I do not deny that. I just think that it is possible to find a more balanced solution which does not break the ECM for solo players while at the same time addressing the “bad feelings”. Actually, I would not be surprised if CCP will have a difficult time balancing the ECM hulls (without them getting unbalanced elsewhere) and have to spend quite some time doing the balancing. However, CCP have made their choice and now they will have to deal with it.
On a side note, I think it was quite predictable that the feedback that most of the feedback presented in various threads would revolve around changing the ECM change rather than focusing on adjusting the ships. There was plenty of criticism of the ECM change before the patch, and just expecting that to change because the ECM change has been implemented is naive.
Personally, I am not going to quit over this. One of my characters can pretty much fly any sub-cap so I will just do other stuff, but until ECM solo play is fixed, I do not see any reason to use ECM or to fly Caldari EWAR ships.
While we certainly do not agree on the ECM issue, I do appreciate the time you have spent in the threads. I have always aimed at keeping the discussion civil and discuss the issue rather than the person so I think that we will just have to agree that we disagree on the ECM issue.
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Asking for feedback, is asking about the changes, but is also asking for feedback if it could be done better, is there good/bad changes or it there things that need to be amended.
Saying “asking only about the balance changes” only provides two replies is saying youre only looking for “yes” or “no” feedback. If this is what @CCP_Falcon wanted he should have just said “these are the changes we’re doing, are you happy with it. Yes/No?”
As what has been provided by the community is true feedback, what you’re saying is no ccp only wants a yes/no answer, and not interested in constructive feedback about what was proposed.
“Roll it back” is not what the devs want. The other feedback thread, they want to know what peoples ideas are to buff up the ships, that had the ecm bonus. A lot of those posts went round and round. You made your thread so you can feel important (reminds me of salvos). @Brisc_Rubal has stated multiple times, more than he should have. They want ideas to fix the ships, not ecm. How hard is that a concept to understand?
Yes that is a good point, ECM was a counter to other OP things nerfing ECM makes other problems worse.
My player experience has been ruined by the recent change to ECM, as I’ve always been a Caldari ECM pilot. It’s not because of the change to the ECM mechanic, I actually like the idea of introducing a taunt to Eve. The part where I find fault with the recent change was that something was taken away, and nothing was given with the change. You’ve essentially made ECM ships into a “Tank” role in other MMO’s, but without the ability to tank properly.
Now that you’ve made ECM ships completely worthless to fly (RIP Griffin & Widow), how do you expect to gather data on how to rebalance these ships? Are you just going to go off the reports of everyone whelping their ECM ships?
If you’re looking for ideas on how to make things better, increase all defenses (Shield, Armor, Hull) on all EWAR ships by 10%. Give them an additional low + 2 mids.
Alternatively, change the ECM mechanic to deactivate offensive modules + remote mods (like remote shields, armor, etc…), while maintaining a target lock.
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I’ve seen people complain that the only counter to ECM was in the fitting screen but the only power of ECM was also in the fitting screen. Players complaining about being perma jammed are usually flying the same predictable comp that they always fly and got ECM’ed because I couldn’t be bothered to fight it.
Also watch the sale of Jackals and Grails swan drive.
What about if the jam only lasts for 10 seconds even though the cycle time is 20 ?
While I actually planned not to provide any feedback in relation to the ECM ships because I think the ECM change is just badly conceived, here are a few ideas which may or may not be useful.
Overall, I think is bad that there are essentially no costs related to the jammed ship attacking the jamming ship – all requirement for reducing any retaliation effect from the jammed ship is essentially put on the jamming ship which I think is ridiculous given that the jammed ship is in fact jammed.
Therefore, the following ideas will generally focus on improving the possibilities for the jamming ship to defend itself and crippling the jammed ship while still allowing the jammed ship to fight back in some form.
Defense:
- Improved tank in some way.
- X% resistance to enemy electronic and cap warfare.
- Increased warp core strength (to make it difficult to pin down the ECM ship).
Attack:
- Increased drone bay/bandwidth to carry/launch more drones (I have ECM drones in mind).
- Bonuses for ECM drones (HP, speed, jamming strength/distance).
- Keep ECM as mid/long range attack.
Secondary effects on the jammed ship that will add “costs of attack”:
- Lock-breaking – re-introduce the jamming’s lock breaking ability, but allow the jammed ship to re-lock the target. Maybe a sensor booster with ECCM script will allow faster locking.
- Let jammers fry the jammed ship’s system. The idea is that active modules will be set in overheated state while jammed. Therefore, when activated the active modules should start overheating at an accelerated rate (compared to ordinary overheat) which could be based on effective jamming strength. If used on drones/fighters it could cause damage? Countered by nanite paste.
- The jamming ship’s signature radius is significantly reduced (could be coupled with re-introduced lock-breaking ability) which should help to reduce damage. Countered by target painters.
- Reduced weapon range by X%. Countered by moving closer or use long range ammo.
- Weapon cycle disruption and cooldown. Disable the auto-cycling ability on active modules and enforce a cooldown of X seconds after each cycle before the module can be reactivated. The player better stay alert and reactive those modules.
Some of the above effects could be combined. It may well be that some of the above abilities may be too overpowered, but as I said they are just ideas. Obviously, being immune to jamming would also mean that you are immune to these effects, e.g. the bastion module on a marauder.
As I mentioned in a previous post I think it will difficult to balance the ECM ships without infringing on the roles of some of the other ships such as combat ships.
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I’m guessing you’re talking about the suggestion topic for ecm fix ideas?
Nothing to do with me feeling important, instead its for every idea on how to better the ecm in eve. If you had read it you’d know that.
The whole issue was started because there was no 100% defence against ECM once you were in range, it was all down to luck on both sides. But there are no limits to it, any 1 strength ECM module or drone has a chance to jam any ship no matter what its sensor strength is, and thats just a poorly designed system. Many have taken advantage off that to they benefit.
As many have said here and in the other topic it needs to be reviewed and changed, no-one has asked for an instant fix or kneejerk fix, far from it.
If you think that suggestion topic was make to me feel important, keep thinking that, no skin off my back.
As for @Brisc_Rubal he says a lot, but others don’t believe him, and wonder why CCP haven’t said a word in this topic after such a huge amount of response, instead they make a second topic.
As i understand it @Kushinade_Saru the burst ECM modules act like smartbombs in their effect (ive never had any success with them yet, due to range of AOE and low skills at the time). But instead of damage it does 2 str ECM AOE blast. And not it doesn’t jam targets, it resets target locks of ALL ships within attack radius if it successed with its ECM roll. I may be wrong on that last part.
But sadly with an 2 strength in ECM and the % chance it not the best, and add the limited range of 7.5km.
If this has a slightly bigger radius so it could catch ECM Jammer ships it’d make for an ideal counter jam weapon. Buf sadly its near completely useless due to its range and % chances.
EVE Vegas is a week away. The CCP folks are working.
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ECM Burst is an instantaneous Jam like a target breaker only really much use for escape. They are high strength stronger than normal ecm
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You ever use the target breaker?
And if so any success with it?
No, but I has fought things with it fitted, it jams and so long as he is aligned he then warps before you can relock thus bumping can prevent him aligning
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so it does work then, never had any luck myself