Thanks for the explanation, I do hope you guys come up with something cool to do with them.
So instead of expanding the niche, CCP now just considers how to dig it deeper with ideas from the past. We don’t need avatars to do the same stuff we do with spaceships.
At this point, probably we don’t even need avatars at all. They would break from the always-the-sameness that’s grasping EVE Online.
At some point, it’s just time to hit the door.
Was a good idea. Could have been awesome. Should have been implementd better.
But now EVE is about selling fugly SKINs, spaceships as avatars and recasting old hits from the Apochrypha age. Abysmal sites are what WH were supposed to be… get in, kill or die to strong rats, get out with juicy loot. WH just went wrong and Abysmal sites have come when nullsec ratting is the alpha and omega of how many ISK should a player earn in highsec…
Poor old EVE. Old, old EVE.
I’ve only been playing since 2013, but to me spaceships always WERE the avatars in this game. But since pretty much 90% of other games have you playing a human or human-like alien as the avatar… I’m pretty good with that, I like “being” a spaceship.
Very happy to hear avatar play isn’t a dead idea. And also very happy to hear that you are looking for meaningful experience before proceeding.
There were lot’s of different ideas posted in various WiS threads so there’s no shortage of content. And I’m not talking about emote dancing in a bar or playing poker. Granted the technology at this time just isn’t capable to have multiple Avatars active in the same area but some of the ideas presented were also for solo gameplay content such as:
Elevator in the CQ takes the character down to station sub-level to a maze of hallways and dimly lit rooms with secure lockers and containers which must be hacked open for loot.
Elevator in the CQ takes the character to a secret hidden Laboratory where corpses can be operated on to extract damaged implants which can then be repaired and used or sold on the Market.
Elevator in the CQ takes the character to lower station level where Black Market Agents buy various contraband items as well as offer ‘Contraband Retrieval’ missions.
Hell, just adding some interactive items in the CQ would have created more interest in using it such as having animated animal pets that responded to various commands, plants that need to be watered and pruned, ability to decorate the interior with various items, Video/Conference Call to other characters allowing both to talk and view them in their own CQ, add option to zoom in on the video screen and watch Fanfest / AT / Live Events while drinking Quafe, etc.
Granted some of that is more Role Play but it would have made the CQ much more interactive without turning it into a large scale project of trying to get multiple characters to interact in the same location.
Anyway, I believe having a better version of the Captains Quarters implemented into the game can help attract and retain players, at this point in time it definitely can’t hurt.
From what I understand at this point CCP dont even have human resources to think about it. That is why there was no clear vision and it was abandoned. All teams working with avatar gameplay were dissolved years ago, people gone. There is only one(?) person who makes clothes I think.
Who decided to leave it in such a state?
The thing is i don’t think they need to make it that complicated, plus i don’t think it would take long to design if they used the Unreal Engine…
They need to update the Avator Interface, it could be some much better…
I know this has nothing to do with Eve but this guy who is designing Voyager using Unreal Engine proves what you can do…
Quoted the best part of that post.
I don’t know why this is still an issue at all. Avatar play is not a good idea in the 1st place (it it was, all of you would be playing Star Trek Online or someone space game with walking in it).
Even if it was, you should know by now that CCP just isn’t the company to deliver it. It’s kind of funny how you seem to understand CCP’s mistakes about PVE but at the very same time can[t come to the conclusion that CCP is incapable of delivering on what you want from WiS.
You (and all WiS fanatics) are just frustrating yourselves. WHY do that, why not just accept reality?
I think CCP could be capable, so I just express opinions about CCP development. Same as I and others provided ideas thru the years. CCP is just a company and can aquire people and resources, they can develop nice stuff under good direction. They need clear vision.
Why do you care so much about us expressing our opinions tho?
I don’t expect anything from CCP at this point. They can’t even get the essentials of PvE players. They will just keep EVE alive until it dies, and when that happens, not much of value will be lost to the average ex player.
After all, it’s just a videogame.
The problem with every single one of those ideas is that they would be better without avatar play.
Yeah, that’s a big thing that very few people seem to understand… ideas are cheap, easy, and most of them are bad. When combined with a healthy dose of Dunning Kruger thrown in, the ideas become outright carcinogenic.
It’s a simple cost/benefit. Avatar gameplay as envisioned by its proponents would have insane costs. The “better” the ideas, the more expensive to both implement and maintain. Considering the insane costs, there is virtually no chance of having a commensurate financial benefit. i.e. no matter what CCP puts out for avatar gameplay, there’s a near 100% chance of it failing and being gutted, an exact repeat of CQ.
That is why there would be a need for a person, a game director with clear vision to sit thru that all and apply it to rpg system, applying later to avatar gameplay, a core experience. Its like you would take a pen and paper roleplaying game and made it into an electronic version. CCP certainly dont have someone like that for EVE. They surenderred, its like a white flag would be above CCP headquarters and on it is written: We dont know how to do that stuff, leave us alone WIS people.
Its really sad to see it.
They have CCP Rattati for DUST as a Game Director. But NOVA seems to be just an FPS. Not role playing version of EVE with deep character development and storytelling.
Folks. Let’s try to avoid toxic comments with discouraging words. They do not improve the discussion in any way.
On to the topic.
Glad to hear that you guys are looking for some options here.
I got some ideas for Avatar Gameplay that can implemented in Project Nova, thus avoiding the difficult task of making Incarna features with the EVE engine.
Personally I believe that with Nova and Unreal Engine, there can be more options for making use of our avatars. Here is the blog post:
And I want to add one more thing. You guys at CCP, have made the best Character Creator ever! Keep it up and good luck on the development and planning for Avatar Gameplay and the rest of the game!
I do believe that one day, as the company improves, and as Nova development advances further, attracting more players, devs, together with players, will be able to deliver the things that we all want for Avatar Gameplay.
It is clear that it has been a tough journey on that particular front, but I am sure that we all can succeed in this.
I don’t see why people are glad about this statement - it’s the exact same one CCP has been giving since 2012 when they declared Incarna dead, less than a year from its release. Besides, there were several threadnaughts in the past with hundreds if not thousands of ideas how to advance Incarna - it’s not about if there’s ideas on how to add meaningful Avatar gameplay, it’s entirely about if they want to do it.
And they don’t, because for some reason they think WiS was the reason for the summer of rage, not the not-so-micro-transactions, not the possibility of “golden ammo”, not the poor optimization of the station interiors/character models (it broke GPU’s, at least for a few players) and certainly not the underdelivery of what was promised for Incarna when we had already seen a far more comprehensive prototype in 2008.
Incarna was one of the most anticipated additions to eve, since they had been promising it from since the beginning, along with planetary interaction and ability to make our own stargates etc. None of which have really happened yet as they envisioned it, either.
It was definetly top of the line in 2011. Today it is woefully behind newer MMO’s like Black Desert Online, which has way more sculpting options, including being able to define something as fundamental as character height - all EVE characters are the same height- IIRC BDO even allows asymmetric sculpting which is not possible in EVE.
I was awed by EVE’s CC way back when, but it still is buggy (various graphics bugs, clipping, clothing incompatibilty resulting in aforementioned bugs, randomly missing customization options to name some of the problems) and nobody apparently is fixing said bugs anymore since they have been there since day one.
As I miss the CQ, and wish my Avatar had something to do other than look pretty, first thing they’d need to do in order to facilitate any sort of human avatar gameplay would be to tear the whole thing down and make damn sure they don’t repeat the same mistakes, so either license a CC from somewhere else or build it from scratch but make sure it is modern, and optimized so that it won’t melt down GPU’s.
Indeed it has. And understand, I still am not beating on the devs that worked on the feature, I’m sure they did the best they could. CCP’s most glaring problem since time immemorial seems to have been extremely lackluster management that has no clear vision on anything or how to achieve said visions. Judging by what CCP Atlanta and various other sources have since said. Even if all of it is by bitter ex-employees, everyone citing poor management has to have some grain of truth in it.
Yes, Black Desert’s character creator looks more modern in that regard. But I am sure that it is inspired by EVE’s character creator, and then Black Desert devs improved upon it. In that case competition is good, cause it makes devs do better. Still, CCP are pioneers in creating a character creator that laid the foundation for really meaningful character sculpting and customization.
I don’t disagree on this. It is true. Poor management must have been the result from the lack of resources and devs that would work on the features. Back in the summer of rage, the players sent a clear message to the devs, they wanted ship gameplay improvements.
And yes. Incarna was not the main reason for the players rage and protest back then. I agree - most of us were actually excited about Incarna. But in the protests, the voices of Incarna supporters, were somehow muted by the more vocal players. I don’t know why it happened like this.
And fast forward to present day, people get enraged when someone mentions WiS, cause they feel the devs should be concentrated on improving the ship experience.
But when Nova starts, more players will join, which will give CCP the resources to improve the Avatar Gameplay part of the experience. I am hopeful and optimistic about that. Will see how it goes.
Heh, you’re way off base. That’s like saying these forums would be better without text replies.
Just because you don’t like the idea doesn’t mean it’s bad or won’t work.
Truest statement ever made! The best character creator ever! Skyrim and Fallout both pale in comparison.
Dont listen to all the naysayers CCP. As a returning player I have been having a blast and all I have seen since I came back are improvements all around. Everything has become better and more streamlined and perfect. PvE especially is brutal so dunno what these guys are talkin about lol.
And to be honest the cap quarters were cool but useless and didnt feel very EVE to me at all. I barely touched it back then. Was also pretty laggy.
As always keep up the good work! And have a nice day
I don’t think CCP, as a company, deserves a pat on the head on how hard they dropped the ball with the topical subject. (This to the above post, but for some reason the forum doesn’t always show who’s being replied to)
CCP, please hire this person to your Design Team.
if they could somehow recreate what star trek online did for their characters… STO is good, EVE is good, but EVE could be better. I got turned off of STO due to all the microtrans to buy better ships, or ships from shows.