Female Player Base of Eve

Council Of Stellar Management Assembly Hall
61

This entire thread is an obvious demonstration of the fact that an organized harassment campaign exists. Multiple posts by multiple people on the same subject immediately one after the other? That does not happen organically.

I referred to a discord server, not a person. I don’t think there is any kind of apology I can formulate that you or others here won’t criticize, so I’m not going to attempt to make one.

Again, if you are offended by my word choice, but have nothing to say about coordinated harassment campaigns against other players, that is unfortunate.

Every CSM member is entitled to their opinions. If they have a concern with something I’ve said, they’re obligated to bring it to me in private, and we can address it there, and I will do the same thing for them, as I’m required to do under the Code of Conduct.

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62

I don’t know you from anyone. I know what I saw and I came here of my own volition to speak up. I am not an abuser or someone who is sitting here plotting against you, and to be completely fair, that stings immensely, but I know what I’m not. I’m sorry you feel that way. I don’t sit here and plot how to destroy someone because I’ve been at the receiving end of harassment before, and I agree it is not nice.

However, I ask you consider your language use and consider the effect it has on the player base you claim so wholly to support, and I ask for an apology in this instance for your belittling of that player base, whether meant or not.

We all have opportunities to bow our heads and say, “Hey, I made a mistake. My bad, I’ll do better.” I think this is one of them.

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63

You’re asking me to say something that I don’t believe, and I am trying to respect you enough not to say something I don’t believe or to lie to you. I’m sorry that I can’t say what you want me to say.

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66

No one has asked anyone to bend their legitimate opinions in any way to be ‘acceptable’. What has been asked by the OP was an apology for the tone and use of words by a CSM Representative that she personally found offensive and belittling. I refer once again to my post outlining that CCP itself doesn’t condone sexist comments.

Certainly there’s debate whether the intention behind Brisc’s post was attacking gender or not, and we can spin yarn about that all day, but it’s clear at the very least it struck a nerve unintentionally of someone who’s not been out ‘to get him’ and very rarely gets stuck into non-roleplay related forum posting here. Once again, I also point out the comments made had been moderated, lending weight that what was posted fell foul of community guidelines, guidelines set by CCP and enforced by their moderators.

It’s an MMO, absolutely, but that doesn’t mean anything and everything is fair game and if people don’t like that they should leave, and it’s disingenuous to pretend otherwise.

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72

The comments were removed because they were off-topic. I did not post anything insulting to anybody.

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73

Are you sure about that? How about threatening?
The implication, and in your case it wasn’t implied, you flat out stated you were doing it, of being able to extract private conversations from another private server goes a little beyond insulting.

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75

The post was telling the person who had been attacking me over and over in that thread that I did not want her doing that anymore, that I was aware that she was part of a coordinated harassment campaign against me in the private discord server that I referenced and I asked her politely not to contact me again.

People seem extremely upset by how I characterized that private discord server, while falling all over themselves to ignore why I referenced it in the first place. I find that extremely unfortunate, and wish that those people would be as outraged at this kind of behavior happening to an elected community rep as they were because they didn’t appreciate my reference of that discord.

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84

I read the whole thing and she wasn’t attacking you, she was out arguing you and there’s a difference. I think you were being backed into a corner and didn’t like it. I also think that you started making mistakes when that happened and should have shut up while you were ahead, but you didn’t. You implicated yourself instead.

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88

This is an interesting way of looking at it. Do you agree with her contention that I, as a CSM member, should never share my personal opinion about things CCP does and that if I do that I am trolling?

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89

I think you do troll yes, but I don’t usually see that as a big deal. There’s trolling going on right now in this thread, mostly good natured I think, but that’s what it looks like to me.

93

First of all, I am opposed to toxicity of any kind, including the way how many male players can make females players feel uncomfortable and/or unwelcomed. Moreover, I know that many guys will engage in such behavior to this day. And if anyone thinks otherwise, they should watch some of the compilation videos that have been made of male toxicity on comms in various games.

That being said, what you’ve presented so far seems to be more of an uncharitable reading of what Brisc said, rather than a clear indication of inappropriate behavior. For example,

this is not universal. While I’m sure that “girls” can be used in a patronizing way, it is not used exclusively to patronize. How it is used can and will vary between cultures, subcultures, and individuals. Case in point, DMC once chastized me for calling another forum user “dog”. However, I was not using it as an insult, but instead using it in the same way that people would use “bro”, “man,” or “dude”. I didn’t even consider that some might read it as insult until he said something. More to the point, I frequently call girls “girls” myself, and I assure that I do not do it in order to be patronizing. In fact, it wasn’t until you said something I became aware that some women were reading it as such.

And yes, I am aware that certain words are frequently used, or almost exclusively used, in a derogatory manner within certain cultures -“girl” is not one of them. And even when it comes to words that are more universally recognized as being derogatory, you still have to consider the culture that the person came from. For example, the c-word is not acceptable in the states, but is elsewhere.

So, did he say something else that was clearly inappropriate? Or are we going to condemn him for the least charitable reading of his comments that we could make?

@Brisc_Rubal
I recommend thinking carefully before you post. In fact, you might want to sleep on any replies before you send them (and realize that you do not have to respond to everything). People with pitchforks seem to find ways to read posts/tweets in the most negative way possible.

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98

62 posts removed.

1. Specifically restricted conduct.

The purpose of the EVE Online forums is to provide a platform for exchange of ideas, and a venue for the discussion of EVE Online. Occasionally there will be conflicts that arise when people voice opinions. Forum users are expected to courteous when disagreeing with others.

In order to maintain an environment where everyone is welcome and discussion flows freely, certain types of conduct are prohibited on the EVE Online forums. These are:

Trolling
Flaming
Ranting
Personal Attacks
Harassment
Doxxing
Racism & Discrimination
Hate Speech
Sexism
Spamming
Bumping
Off-Topic Posting
Pyramid Quoting
Rumor Mongering
New Player Bashing
Impersonation
Advertising

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100

Hi all, posting my $.02. Normally, I wouldn’t post on forums, I’ve rarely done it before but I felt to need to share more context for folks and show that this is a systemic issue, not a one-off or some emotionally driven posting on the forums.

I created the women’s only Discord in 2018 for an in-game event. There was also a men’s only one and we had a little 3 match competition on stream. After the event, the men all left their discord but the women’s continued. At the time of the event, we had men in there as well since they wanted to participate as their in-game characters who were women. None of us had issues. After the event they left on their own.

[removed cause wew lack of context, sorry]

For more history, the individual in question and I have a pretty long past. There was the instance in 2020 of which includes him calling me a “■■■■■■■ c-word” on his Twitch platform for an EVE talk show, then doubling down when called out by his fellow hosts and chat. Since then I’ve had him blocked on social media.

I expect more from my fellow players and I definitely expect better from a CSM representative. The subject that OP is talking about is definitely disappointing to see in this community.

P.S. Thank you ISD.

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102

I appreciate ISD’s moderation.

I don’t know what this coordinated harassment campaign is as I have had pretty much no contact with the CSM in question before now. I’m sure he could attest to that as well.

I think perhaps this should be left to CCP to deal with.

@ISD_Buldath I request this thread be locked, but not removed, please.

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