Hi Sec

[Solonius_Rex]

@Paddehatten

They are now longer just support ships they are industrial command ships but they no longer have the same role as only the brother got the big mining bonus.

Except that not so long ago, the orca was used frequently, while the rorqual was not.

The big brother got the mining bonuses because it was severely underused in favor of the little brother, despite risking more. A lot more.

And yes, the orca got bonuses too. But the rorqual has more, because it is more. It costs more. It takes more skills to fly. It uses fuel. Everything about the rorqual is multitudes more than the orca.

@Dracvlad

Because they are the top end ship for hisec. However people do use them in lowsec and nullsec, and better yield would help them too.

Hahaha, what?

Why would you consider the orca a top end ship? You do realize that bigger isnt necessarily better? That a battleship can lose to a frigate?

Size, cost does not make one ship better, or higher than another. I would bet my money on a code agent flying a catalyst over you in a golem, any day.

[Dracvlad]

I don’t think he Rorqual mines.

---

I would like the Orca to be slightly better and this is why:

I just did a comparison of my Orca with T2 mining drones as compared to my Skiff which uses T2 mining drones and T1 Strip miners. I get 18.645 M3 a second on the Orca and 21.1275 M3 a second on the Skiff. However the Orca figure will be about 10% lower due to travelling and moving to the next roid.

I am not min/maxing obviously.

20% increase in base yield would be quite good.

[Paddehatten]

@Solonius_Rex

And yes, the orca got bonuses too. But the rorqual has more, because it is more. It costs more. It takes more skills to fly. It uses fuel. Everything about the rorqual is multitudes more than the orca.

And the Orca should to because as you say you’re self the about the Rorq, the Orca is more, it cost more, it takes more skill to fly then any of the barges/exumers everything about the Orca is multitudes more than barges/exumers/mining frigs.

[Dracvlad]

@Solonius_Rex

Except that not so long ago, the orca was used frequently, while the rorqual was not.

The big brother got the mining bonuses because it was severely underused in favor of the little brother, despite risking more. A lot more.

And yes, the orca got bonuses too. But the rorqual has more, because it is more. It costs more. It takes more skills to fly. It uses fuel. Everything about the rorqual is multitudes more than the orca.

I like the setup of the Rorqual and I think it is about right, the PANIC mode is needed and has give some fun fights, I have a few Rorquals on my killboard

The Rorqual is for lowsec and nullsec, I have discounted it being a hisec ships which the OP requested, I don’t agree with that.

My suggested is that I think the Orca can be slightly better.

@Solonius_Rex

Hahaha, what?

Why would you consider the orca a top end ship? You do realize that bigger isnt necessarily better? That a battleship can lose to a frigate?

Size, cost does not make one ship better, or higher than another. I would bet my money on a code agent flying a catalyst over you in a golem, any day.

You seem a bit uptight there. The Orca is the top end mining ship in hisec.

I don’t know what relevance a BS and a frigate PvP comparison has to this?

As for the Golem comparison

[Solonius_Rex]

@Paddehatten

Little brother and tiny brother for that matter should be good at mining to.

Oh sorry, missed this.

Yes they are good at mining. Very good. The orca outlines mining barges that are fit for tank.

Everything scales with cost. The rorqual costs 10 bill, and mines at the rate of 5 hulks. The orca cost 1 bill, and mines at the rate of 1 barge. So yes, perfectly balanced.

[Solonius_Rex]

@Paddehatten

And the Orca should to because as you say you’re self the about the Rorq, the Orca is more, it cost more, it takes more skill to fly then any of the barges/exumers everything about the Orca is multitudes more than barges/exumers/mining frigs.

Actually, you’re wrong about the skills, it takes around the same amount of time to fly exhumers than it does with orcas.

But again, it is. Compare the orca to what it was, and what it is now. Loads better, and outmines many barges while having considerable tank.

So here’s a question for you. How good should orcas be? Mine the same amount as 2 barges? Should the rorqual be buffed in the same amount too? 10 barges worth of mining from a single rorqual?

[Solonius_Rex]

@Dracvlad

You seem a bit uptight there. The Orca is the top end mining ship in hisec.

Well, so what do you mean by “top end”? If you’re alone, you would be better off in a skiff if you’re alone, and if youre in a fleet, you would be better off with one orca and 5 barges than 6 orcas.

[Dracvlad]

@Solonius_Rex

Well, so what do you mean by “top end”? If you’re alone, you would be better off in a skiff if you’re alone, and if youre in a fleet, you would be better off with one orca and 5 barges than 6 orcas.

I mine with two accounts so mining with a solo skiff is not what I would do and I certainly cannot mine 5 barges and an Orca…

[Solonius_Rex]

@Dracvlad

I mine with two accounts so mining with a solo skiff is not what I would do and I certainly cannot mine 5 barges and an Orca…

Which is why I asked what you mean by “top end”.

[Paddehatten]

@Solonius_Rex

So here’s a question for you. How good should orcas be? Mine the same amount as 2 barges?

Something like that yes 2-3 (excavater drones)
And 1 for the porpoise to.
Industrial mode would be cool to so they can’t mine good while moving, but only standing still like the Rorq.

Make them a little more alike.

[Solonius_Rex]

@Paddehatten

Something like that yes 2-3 (excavater drones)
And 1 for the porpoise to.

And the rorqual should be as good as 10 hulks? Yes?

@Paddehatten

Industrial mode would be cool to so they can’t mine good while moving, but only standing still like the Rorq.

Do you know why the industrial mode for rorqs is there? Do you understand the difference between being unable to move in nullsec or lowsec, and being unable to move in hisec?

[Paddehatten]

No I don’t want the Rorq to be buffed more.

Yes I do know the difference.

I’m getting tired of that stupid argument about high, low and nul sec.
Orca and porpoise can go to low and nul aswell as the Rorq can, and high sec is the most dangerous place to be.

Try mining in a Hulk ln Halaima lol I dare you

[Daichi_Yamato]

@Paddehatten

That’s the exact point I’m trying to make.
They are STILL just mining support ships
But the Rorq have become the best mining ship in game 5+ X better than a Hulk (dedicated mining ship) as you call them.
But that’s ok because you have a Rorq.

Doing that to rorqs was a huge mistake. Look what it did to the mineral market and capital proliferation.

The answer is not to make things worse by doing it to the orca too.

[Dracvlad]

@Daichi_Yamato

Doing that to rorqs was a huge mistake. Look what it did to the mineral market and capital proliferation.

The answer is not to make things worse by doing it to the orca too.

That cat is already out of the basket. Hisec in general needs a buff.

[Paddehatten]

B[quote=“Dracvlad, post:105, topic:140425”]
That cat is already out of the basket. Hisec in general needs a buff.
[/quote]

I agree

[Blade_Darth]

Don’t forget npc null and our l̶o̶w̶ ̶s̶e̶c̶ ̶g̶a̶t̶e̶ C2 wh static.

[Solonius_Rex]

@Paddehatten

No I don’t want the Rorq to be buffed more.

Why not?

@Paddehatten

Yes I do know the difference.

If you knew the difference, you wouldn’t have posted it.

@Paddehatten

I’m getting tired of that stupid argument about high, low and nul sec.
Orca and porpoise can go to low and nul aswell as the Rorq can, and high sec is the most dangerous place to be

You’re getting tired of that argument, because you have no valid response to it.

Here’s a big surprise. Any ship can go to null and lowsec. There is no restriction for any ship that prevents it from going to nullsec.

But there is a restriction to enter hisec, for some ships. The reason why, is because of how SAFE hisec is.

Being unable to move in hisec, does nothing. It takes 30 seconds to warp with an orca, which Is longer than Concord response time, so you’re not moving anywhere anyways.

Being unable to warp in nullsec or lowsec for 5 minutes, is huge. Wanna guess why? Because anyone can shoot you, for however long they wish. Without Concord interference. Yeah.

@Paddehatten

Try mining in a Hulk ln Halaima lol I dare you

And if orcas were restricted to mine in halaima, and halaima only, then maybe your argument would have some teeth.

By the way, fully ranked orca has more hp than a fully ranked hulk, in case you didnt know.

[Dracvlad]

@Solonius_Rex

But there is a restriction to enter hisec, for some ships. The reason why, is because of how SAFE hisec is.

Nope…, it is about game balance. Which is why I would not ask for Rorquals to be able to operate in hisec.

[Solonius_Rex]

@Dracvlad

Nope…, it is about game balance. Which is why I would not ask for Rorquals to be able to operate in hisec.

Yes, game balance, because it’s a lot safer in hisec. If I were in an npc Corp with a rorqual, I would be unkillable. Quite literally.

[Dracvlad]

@Solonius_Rex

Yes, game balance, because it’s a lot safer in hisec. If I were in an npc Corp with a rorqual, I would be unkillable. Quite literally.

Do you seriously think it is just about safety? Seriously mate…