@Solstice_Projekt won’t shut up about why the mining while aligned strat is the best strat, and why miners should use it.
Love how OP flat out declares that it doesn’t work though.
These topics are great entertainment. A person writes a long-winded rant demonstrating that they don’t really understand the game. Half a dozen people try to give helpful suggestions. The OP strikes them all down stating that nothing will work.
The OP could have kept it simple:
“I want to watch Netflix and mine in a maximum-yield fit hulk near Jita.”
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C’mon you’re blowing smoke up everybody’s dress. Let’s start from a place of equals and work backwards rather than defend the indefensible with a bunch of rhetoric. Begin with a fleet of gankers riding in and dropping on a target that is their equal. Not just a pretend Eve forum mining ship that ganker pig lipstick dresses as an equal.
The catalysts would receive the same damage they dealt. Those are equals.
Now tell us how much you want to hobble the mining ship so you’ll win? Feel free to do a steam of conscience. This whole conversation is pathetic. The accepted norm is that the mining ship should lose. From having no hi slot offensive weapons to CCP constantly folding to ganker cancel culture.
Y’all got what you wanted and you’re too ashamed to admit it.
This.
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Why do you need to fly a Hulk? There are other options that can be very difficult to gank.
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I don’t fly Hulks. They are gank magnates.
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As they should be. Highsec mining is stealing.
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LOL. Here I thought you were genuinely concerned about my safety.
X, may I call you X?
If it were not for Highsec mining, you would be flying bologna sandwiches.
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Every player in Eve is perfectly capable of mining their own stuff. It just so happens that highsec is packed wall-to-wall with lazy, bloated, semi-conscious clouds of mining barges. These “players” have brought the cost of minerals down to the point that it is completely pointless to bother with mining.
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I agree. Let’s all go to Pochven and die.
There is so much you can do. What makes me sigh is the misinfo you and your ilk spread. The absolute victimhood. There are literally so many counters.
Its not sound. High sec means high sec, not total sec. Undocking is dangerous. He didn’t know how to EVE and apparently you don’t either
Post with your main or recant. Cause if you’ve truly been playing since 09 and are this bad uh.
Wut. What are you even basing these numbers on? You literally have a unfailing system wide radar ROFL.
Uh if that hulk is tanked you need more than one cata ROFL.
So you acknowledge they fail at the game and deserve death. Got it.
Wut. Why should mining ships be able to fight the same time as mining? If that’s the case, then we should literally just have one hull per ship class that literally has all the bonuses ROFL.
It isn’t that the mining ship should always lose, its that most miners are terribad at the game because they are lost in the delusion of victimhood.
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So, you’re saying that a ship that specializes in mining should be just as good at dealing damage as a combat ship that is fit for maximum damage… and that would be fair.
Anyway, for anyone who cares, ganking is asymmetric game play. It’s like those horror games where one player is monster who hunts a bunch of normies. The normies get various advantages like alarms, traps, or the ability to hide, but are generally ■■■■■■ if they get caught. Well, same thing for Eve. There is actually a ton of stuff that you can do in order to reduce your chances of being ganked to damn near zero. However, if things progress to a point where a ganker actually attacks you, you’re pretty much done for. You’ve already failed to use most of the tools at your disposal (but not all), and it is relatively easy for a ganker to assess whether or not he can succeed at the gank -which brings up another interesting point worth addressing.
So, PvP’ers of all types will try to assess whether or not they can win an engagement before taking it. However, the nature of ganking makes it considerably easier to make quick and accurate calls. You don’t have to factor in a ton of variables, or try to weigh the importance of incomparables. Instead, you basically have two simple formulas. One determines whether or not you can succeed at the gank, and the other determines whether or not the gank is expected to be profitable.
So, yeah, it’s super easy to assess whether or not you can gank someone, which can give the impression that it’s easy to gank. But what you’re really seeing is a selection bias. Most targets are either too hard to gank, and/or not profitable enough to gank. And so gankers watch them fly on by, while they wait for a suitable target. Funny, how nerf gankers seem to ignore everyone who doesn’t get ganked.
Believe it or not, it’s actually pretty easy to effectively neutralize the threat of ganking. But if that’s the case, then why do so many people think otherwise. Well, some people just don’t know any better. I try to point them to guides, such as the how not to be ganker bait section of this thread. Some people are blame shifters, who blame anything and everything but themselves for their failures (including balance and mechanics), some people just don’t want PvP, or “non-consensual PvP” in Eve, and some people just want to lower their risk or increase afk-ability. And so they do thinks like argue from a position of ignorance, do all sorts of funky mental gymnastics in order to try to support their position, and/or just straight up argue in bad faith.
I have done an absolute but ton of hauling and PvE in HS, yet, I have gone about 6 years since the last time I was ganked. So, when people come here claiming that ganking needs to be nerfed, or that they need to be buffed, they’re really saying something completely different from what they think they’re saying -they’re saying I don’t know what I’m doing, and rather than try to learn and grow as a player, I’d rather ask for me to be buffed and/or my enemies to be nerfed.
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With the new changes, this won’t be as easy as now.
Alignment times have been increased, yes there’s a slight boost to hp, but with midslot and lowslot limitations it’s hard to have a good tank, better escape options while maintaining any sort of mining benefits.
With 2 or 3 midslots miners are extremely limited for tank/drone/propulsion options, basically you can only full tank, or limited multi-benefit.
Then add the same limitations to lowslot you add to those three mining options.
Sure the ship skill lvl bonuses and role bonuses might help, but that’s not live and questionable, even for maximum magic 14 skilled players, poor newbie players will be screwed over by these limitations and lack of skill benefits.
You know what will work… don’t mine where the gankers are.
Here is a plot for the last 24 hours of highsec systems that have any loss (caused by NPCs or other players):
The orange line is the number of highsec systems (1192) and the blue line is the number of systems in each hour period that have any sort of loss of a player ship or pod.
In any hour of the day, more than 80% (and in many cases, more than 90%) of highsec systems don’t have any loss at all, let alone, loss caused by gankers.
There are always some systems that will have loss (eg. Jita, Amarr, Uedama, career agent systems, SOE mission systems).
But outside those frequent systems, the practical risk of being ganked is 0 for days on end, for many systems.
The risk will never be a theoretical zero, but practically it is in many systems.
Just mine in a quiet system (and they are also easy to identify) and it doesn’t matter what ship you mine in, you won’t be ganked.
The perceived risk of ganking is way higher than the practical risk, simply because there aren’t many gankers but there are a lot of highsec systems.
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What will work: mine in a procurer in low and NPC null sec.
You avoid the “hi sec miner ganking” problem – the title of thread – by simply moving out of hi sec.
Also, while pithy, this is not a troll post – I did precisely this myself.
I read the whole thread carefully because there is so much useful info in here (at least, for a newbie). So what would you recommend for a solo miner like myself? I don’t mine for profit - as @Xeux said “players have brought the cost of minerals down to the point that it is completely pointless to bother with mining” - but rather for ‘insurance’ to be able to replace my lost ships. Would a cloak on my Venture help?
P.S. To be fair, no one bothered to gank my Venture so far - just once a ganker corp scared me off so I wouldn’t mine in their system 
Later they gave advices and some isk for upgrades Ah, adventures like these makes the Eve experience incredible - a true Scifi story 
That
Like, not undocking, or sitting cloaked in a T3? 
C’mon, it’s EVE - you yourself said it’s balanced towards asymmetry
I remember, your Nerf Ganking Megathread was one of the first things I read and memorized when I started my journey in the Eden - thank you very much for it!
One of the points I would suggesting adding to the list from my experience - trying to talk to guys before anything and asking if it’s ok to mine here (while keeping all safety checks, of course). More often than not the ‘bad’ guys are real nice people. Otherwise, talking after loosing your ship could be very useful and informative too. I only once met a person who ganked me and blocked communications instantly. So all in all, socializing might be not only ‘life saver’ but it’s also a very pleasing activity in Eve 
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Best thing for a venture is to fit a prop mod, and orbit a rock while mining. It will not only make it harder for people to gank you, but also signal to gankers that you’re not a complete idiot. Thus, they’re probably better off looking for easier targets.
Anyway, I’m not quite sure what you mean with your third section. But, my strategy for avoiding ganks basically boils down to 1) being hard to gank, 2) being unprofitable to gank, and 3) avoiding situations with a high risk of ganking (i.e. maybe don’t fly a freighter during Uedama when a large gank fleet is active).
Yes, this does slightly reduce my isk efficiency, and it does make hauling take longer than it otherwise would, but it also means that I haven’t lost a ship to ganking since I was couple months old (and that was 6 years ago). I mean, honestly, my biggest fear right now isn’t players, or even rats, it’s DC’s. And I think there might be something wrong that. My biggest fear in a PvP-centric game shouldn’t be hardware hiccups.
Anyway, I have crap I need to take care. If you have any more questions (or I failed to adequately address your previous ones), feel free to ask.
Later dude.
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I feel like a broken record when it comes to this as I seem to be having this exact same conversation in multiple threads. Yet again im going to take the bait because bad information is just something that annoys me.
this is just categorically false. Any engagement starts way before anyone is locked up. And when it comes to miners mining safely the engagement (or lack of engagement) starts in deciding where you are going to mine.
Last time i outlined this snippet of information i was accussed of lying by someone with the same viewpoint of “its impossible” to do anything. Hopefully you will be more open minded. The other night i was having the exact same conversation as this and i was sitting in a ship in 0.8 system at the end of a pipe (no through traffic), 10ish jumps from a trade hub, 6 belts in system and guess what………? I was the only person in local.
Now contrast that with a system 4 jumps from Jita with 20 people in local. These are totally different risk profiles for a miner. But the 4 jumps form Jita option is easy and requires very little effort ………players just take the risk……get ganked and say ganking is a problem.
Whereas finding a quiet end of pipe system like i outlined above takes so much of the risk away. And these systems are not as rare as you think and once you find a few in range of home you can rotate between them. The benefits of this appraoch are as follows:
1 Gankers cant gank you if they cant find you. Now occassioanlly you will get the occassional roamer out and about for a look. But generally gankers gank where they gank. Its not like they are short of targets in this busyt systems. There is no need for them to travel when there supply is there. And remember gankers are looking for a target………they arnt looking for you.
2 These quiet systems are never totally empty all the time. But you will get to know who comes and goes. You will recognise names. And often from experience you will know what ship the person is in before you even dscan.
3 A quiet local means dscan can be used effectively. You can easily see all the ships and probes in space in the window that just isnt as easy in a busy system. If you are alone or only 2 or 3 people are in system then as soon as a name you dont know appears on local you can spam dscan. If dscan shows a new venture then you are probably safe. if dscan shows a new praxis then you are probably safe cause who is going to suicide you in that? most likley a mission runner. But if you see a catalyst. just start moving. be docked up before they even find you.
4 Suspicious activity i.e. scouts are easier to spot. Someone pops into local for a couple of minutes and leaves then be careful when anyone else shows up. check them on zkill. if your spidey senses are tingling dock up for a bit.
The one act of being sensible about where you mine can be so effective that you dont even need to start getting into being aligned, or being properly tanked. Losing a ship will become a rare occurance.
The person i was discussing this with the other day tried to undermine my position by bringing up my zkill as a way to shame me into backing down. You know the usual “omg you have 23 loses and no kills and i used to mine and build all this stuff. why should we listen to you”. Which actaully made me realise my zkill is actually a perfect illustration of the issue.
I stared in the game May 2020 and really enjoyed mining. so persued that ahead of all else. And you will see from my killboard i wasnt very good at it. As my friend from the other day pointed out i lost a mackinaw and a retreiver (even a skiff which is the most embarrassing thing on their. totally my fault as a result of a really bad decision to use it to shortcut haul through lowsec.). All those loses were around summer/autumn 2020.
I moved to quieter space in the winter of 2020/2021 (11ish months ago). I still mine regularly. Usually 3 evenings a week. sometimes less sometimes more. Yet im not seeing my killboard litered with mining ship ganking loses. i think the last one was the skiff and that was a gatecamp not a gank.
However the above advice comes with one large disclaimer. If all you want to do is click a few times and watch netflix then your risk goes up………signifcantly.
Mine in quiet space. find it. try it. live it. love it.
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Any specific prop mod? Because I anyway don’t fly ANY ship without some (well, with one exception when I fitted a cruiser for DPS and tank for PVE mission).
ISK efficiency is lost when one looses a nicely fitted ship
I don’t think it’s their hardware - it could be the international cables / connection. Or satellites - I don’t know what they are using. I think the servers are in one location and they are in Iceland (please correct me if I am wrong)
BUT - when that happens in-flight, after re-connecting your ships warps out of somewhere back to the original location?
Thank you very much for your advices! Fly safe!
The servers are not in Iceland.
You can see what happens after you disconnect when you force it yourself. Just don’t do it in Abyssal space.