In regard of Imperial slave raids and public uproar, call to Capsuleer Forces!

Fiction Portal Intergalactic Summit
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I see quite a lot of people began making an issue of Imperial policy, even trying to blame them in a violation of law. As far as I am aware, Imperial enslaving policy allows enslaving only criminals and prisoners of war, and considering the raid will be taking place in the territory of the enemy, it’s quite obvious their targets are those who attack Empire. And thus to all these “petitioners” I would like to say one thing: if you don’t want to be enslaved, don’t attack the Empire!

It’s understandable when Imperials discuss their internal politics, but in these threads I also saw such terrible people as traitors who ran to Federation tuning in. A lot of people look to be outraged by Lord Sarum’s intentions. But where were these people when Gallente are torturing Caldari prisoners of war, starve and beat them? What is going on, if Amarr take prisoners of war and force them to labor, it causes them to cry out loud and plead to CONCORD, but when Gallente torture prisoners of war, they just close their eyes on that? How much did the Federation pay to these terrible people so they consider force labor worse than rape, starvation and tortures?..

SHAME TO THESE PEOPLE! Shame! Shame for their disgrace, inhuman cruelty and hypocrisy! Shame!

With that, I would like to publically emphasize SUPPORT to Lord Sarum’s actions, unless these orders will be cancelled by a higher authority either in Empire, State or CONCORD.

But until that happens, I call every capable pilot to SUPPORT Amarr Empire and its official position and protect it from Minmatar invaders!

Glory to the State!

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Commander Kim.

Your understanding of Internal Imperial politicking is…rudimentary at best. You do a great disservice to the actual issues at hand by such simplification.

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I would like to emphasize that my earlier remarks were not intended in any way to disrespect the honorable Lord Sarum. I merely sought open clarification as to the DED position on legality, so as to hopefully avoid any unfortunate mishaps as to the posture of State Protectorate forces- Many of whom may wish to aid our Imperial allies in carrying out Lord Sarum’s orders.

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Not worth the trouble of responding.

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If I may:

We didn’t attack first. All of these things began when they met us.

First off, they were not publicaly made aware of the Federations atrocities. They weren’t, quite literally started via a public decree. How can you logically draw comparisons between a shadow op that wasn’t publicaly announced on any political scale to a public decree exactly?

Yes, shame on all of us. Shames a rather pointless concept compared to survival. We are under attack, remember that.

Yes, feel free to come and stop us from invading… ourselves? Wait until we actually start a counter strike before deeming us invaders.

As darkness seems to be poised to fall upon our kin,
Never another long night.

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The State-drones’ head is thicker than battleship classed Fernite Carbide Composite armor plate, I don’t understand why you even bother trying to argue with her.

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As funny as this may sound, I actually do hold her with some respect. I don’t believe she is as dence as many seem to believe. I’ve honestly had many decent conversations with her.

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I am talking about the current situation and current war, not a war that happened a thousand years ago. It’s almost a myth now, nobody lived back then is alive now.
And in the current war it’s Minmatar who were aggressors. These two wars are separated by hundreds of years of peace.

Yet they were going for quite long ago and I myself brought attention of public and CONCORD to them as well long ago. Moreover, I have provided information how to retrieve information - and yes, Lord Sarum’s decree was made public, but so far it’s only decree, while Gallente atrocities are facts that happened and still happen as we speak.

Except it… doesn’t look so. If you don’t attack the Empire, then you shouldn’t be afraid of being enslaved. Those who will be, simply deserve that. And if you care about the survival, you shouldn’t attack neighbors because you disagree with their internal policies (e.g. slavery).

That’s most certainly not what I have meant.

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Key word “You,” not the president of the Federation, this decree was made by a Lord, the person pulling the trigger on this. The actions of my kin and myself have only been said as well, why are you advocating for an invasion on us yet find it shameful that we do the same? For clarity, I’m referring to advocation, not action. The fact that those atrocities we’re committed, like how we met the empire, is irrelevant to the discussion.

The people on that planet didn’t attack the empire, why are they being enslaved exactly?

You called us Invaders, yet we have yet to invade. Say what you mean then.

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You are wrong Commander. It is the same war that our Ancestor fought. it is a war for our Survival.

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Commander, a few points.

First:

This is not the case.
Floseswin is in Amarr hands, and has been for six months. This means it is not enemy territory, and in fact the original order is:

Emphasis added. They are not raiding enemy territory. They are attacking civilian populations within Empire-controlled systems. This is no different than the Federation taking systems, and rounding up the Caldari citizens in those systems to be sent off the Black Eagle prisons for torture and inquisition. Would you consider that ‘internal Federal politics’? Would you have no objection to that?

Second, ‘Forced labor’ is a broad category, Commander. The breeding facilities the Amarr use, where Minmatar slaves are systematically and repeatedly raped so that they will produce more slaves, are technically ‘labor camps’. And ‘forced labor’ offers no surety of being fed, nor of being treated in a way that is not torturous. Certainly, generations of actual experience has shown that both torture and starvation occur while ‘laboring’ for the Amarr—consider our dicussion on whipping slaves, as an example.

Finally, while I agree with you that it is shameful for people to keep their silence on any Federal abuses of PoWs, I have to question whether or not you really understand that you are supporting exactly the same thing with this statement.

Please reconsider.

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Nobody was threatening your survival for hundreds of years since the previous war.

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Everything I’ve seen of her indicates she excels in combat but is otherwise lacking in the areas of politics, diplomacy, tact. She is straightforward, guileless, and possesses a rigid view of the universe that allows for little beyond an “us vs. them” mentality, with any laws or customs she disagrees with getting shuffled into the latter category.

She also completely misses how airing those atrocities widely and publically in the Federation would do wonders for the Caldari war effort. The political turmoil and polarization that would result from incontrovertible evidence the war crimes she’s talking about would result in blows to morale and public support that are not easily recovered from.

She also misses how the Republic and the State have a common motivation: the right to live as they choose without oppression from a foreign power. While an Amarr victory would be unquestionably worse than a Gallente one, both would result in the defeated having their way of life destroyed.

It probably depends on the topic of your conversation. She can sound like an entirely reasonable person right up until you hear her say that the Gallente aren’t actually people and realize she wholeheartedly believes that.

You appear to have forgotten our conversation about the Amarr slavers I found operating in Federation space. When an act is forbidden by law that doesn’t make it impossible to commit that act, and whichever holder sent those raiders into Federation space clearly didn’t give a tinker’s damn about the Empire’s own laws forbidding it!

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The irony in this statement is palpable. In fact, it is so great that if I hit you over the head with a lead pipe and dragged you off, I could mine you. Entire armies could be constructed from your ferrous carcass, a sea of metal stretching out to cover the entire horizon. Nations would clash over possession of you, thousands of men brought to their ends for the sole purpose of laying claim to your body and the fifty billion tons of pure, highest-quality iron it contains.

You’re not just a woman, Diana. You’re a strategic resource. And that is no mean feat.

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That was the worst long-form pun I’ve seen in a while.

I’m starting to like you now.

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Kimmy, ■■■■ off.

There are no words in any language ever uttered by mankind to tell you just how little of a damn anyone gives about your opinion on this matter. And entropy will claim us all before we find the right combination of words to make you understand just how off base you are with your assertions.

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Again, Commander, I’m forced to disagree.

The Empire openly maintains as a divine mandate the conversion of all other cultures and peoples to their own. They are an existential threat, and will remain so as long as that mandate persists. Moreover, they continue to not only hold our people enslaved for no justifiable reason, but continue to send raiding parties to attack civilian settlements—settlements outside the warzone.

If, as you maintained earlier, slaves taken in such actions are prisoners of war, then that can only mean that the Amarr have been waging war upon us for all these centuries, even as they shamefully and cowardly lie about whether they are doing so.

Do you still maintain your support for this decree, despite being shown how it is no different than the abuses the Federation renders upon Caldari citizens?

Do you still insist that an Empire that never ceased its attacks on our population was not at war with us?

We have spoken at length about what liars the Amarr are, Commander. You saw it yourself with Ibrahim Tash-Murkon. You know that I do not lie, even to my enemies.

Will you rethink your position, or will you call me a liar?

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Grr , though I appreciate the sentiment and the intent ,

Gee , it might be kinda nice if you did not adopt a Minmatar narrative and a Minmatar premise ?

You seem here to imply that what Amarr is offering is worse than what they are offering .

( hint , hint , hint ; It isn’t worse . Not by a damn long shot. )

Should I hold my breath , then , waiting for you to write a better informed , more eloquent , attack ?

You’re so smart that you don’t seem to know that no war was ever won on defense , in all aspects , including narrative.

^ A sincere and genuine example of Minmatar morality.

( except maybe your own language , for example . )

^ another sincere and genuine example of Minmatar morality.

How they treat the one , and how they proceed in small things , gives you the clue as to how they would treat the many , and how they would proceed in great things.

The survival of your tyranny that is.

Grr , don’t defend damn it ! Are you the defendant ??

presumably your heart bleeds with love for the Empire and its laws ? Otherwise , what rubbish are you on about barrack - room lawyer ?

No , a war for YOUR survival.

I am quite certain you would no more give up your place to a Minmatar with the wrong tattoo , than you would give up your place to an Ammatar with the best tattoo.

It’s always , " our " , " our " , " our " , in your kinds rhetoric , but never in reality , never in practice .

:stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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No, how I treat Kim gives you a clue as to how I treat Kim.

A sincere and genuine example of my morality. So ■■■■ off.

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Seeing as him, a Brutor, and I, a Sebiestor, as well as many others from other tribes are in agreement, our would be correct. If your going to go for semantics at least make them valid.