Is EVE too complicated?

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Post another ChatGPT I dare you. :thinking:

:smirking_face:

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Depends if the complexity is sane or insane.

Low IQ people would love insane things like ESS where they can learn that little bit, and everyone who knows Eve as a whole is confused?

Can’t really reflect on that as ESS is out of the scope of my playstyles, never even remotely entertained the idea to get involved with that content so can’t really say anything related to it.

In general I was talking in general, low IQ people usually like simple things, but of course, as most cases, there are exceptions, hence the name.

Though even in such cases, if anything

  • I guess it might be about either being fascinated by the unfathomable (they still don’t understand it but it is like a mystery or artwork that they appreciate)
  • or it is something their brain can process (like how savant people can excel at one thing but under perform in most others) but that case is not really what low IQ means in this context as it means they actually can process it in opposition with many others (who out of being lazy or uncaring or it being too complex for them can not fathom it) so this latter case isn’t really that.

But what is the difference between training “faster targeting speed” or “more drones”?

Both are equally fun, I’d say. The only reason you seem to call one ‘fun’ and the other ‘not fun’ is because someone once made an arbitrary list of skills that included one but not the other and called it ‘the magic 14’.

They’re both basic skills.

I see no reason to remove this particular list of skills any more than removing other skills.

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Actually, yes I do.

Easy I m an industrialist.. I spend most of my time either with blue prints, mining, exploring, and some time NPC ratting.

I am as someone described as being a filthy arms dealer.. Which I am proud of as it amuses me to no end. Talk to a vewt that has been here for decades. They might have been a miner, pirate, or even live in a wormhole. They might remember how to outfit a miner. may even be able to advise you as to what ship modules and guns you might want to use. Knows everything about living in a wormhole, But knows nothing about how to haul cargo from Nullsec to Jita or Dodixie.

Likewise some that runs mission may have knowledge of what ship to and modules to have on board to do different missions. But has zero knowledge of what being a pirate is like.

This game is not just about what skills you have, but what experience you can bring to the table. That is what makes this game different from just any other space ship game. That complexity that you argue against is what makes this game fun and enjoyable for many people like myself.

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As a new player coming into the game. Getting my feet wet with Magic 14 allowed me the time to see which area I was trending towards. When i started I really had no idea of what I really wanted to do. It was a few months down the road.. The RL reason for that the wife and I were pulling up stakes and moving from the deep south where we lived. To across a few state lines. To the north midwest where my granddaughter lives.

But running the mission also help me get a little of an idea of what being shot at and shooting back might look like. I do agree after a year of playing. That the missions do need to be worked on. Though I would be hesitant about getting rid of the magic 14 at the same time.

But that is just my opinion as relatively newish player.

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Faster Targeting is just convenience. It doesn’t make your fit significantly weaker than others. Drones II vs Drones V absoutely does.

Yes but your argument is all a bit circular because wherever the problem lies…it has to be something one realises in order to fix it. There is by definition an ‘unknown unknown’ somewhere in the chain or there wouldn’t be a problem. Its not just cases where a person doesn’t know something…its where a person does not even know that there is something to be known. No-one’s going to search for something they don’t know even exists.

You’ve been looking at the problem of not knowing why one toon performs ‘x’ DPS while the other ‘y’ DPS with the exact same fit.

A ship can do that because of two things: skill and fitting.

The fitting is the same so it is skill. Isn’t it natural to check the skills of both chars, compare them and look up those which differ to see if they might have an effect on the ship and its fit?

There is no unknown unknowns here, just known unknowns.

:thinking:

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There are over a dozen skills that affect the missile DPS…on top of which each level of Caldari Offensive Systems adds 5% damage, 10% launcher rate of fire ( which in turn affects DPS ) and 10% velocity. Of course one knows that some skills determine the difference. But to know the exact effect of multiple iterations on a dozen skills would require a spreadsheet.

And its not simply a case of training A to the level of B in a situation where every A skill is less than that of B…because in some cases A already has more skills than B. That is what complicates it all.

Incidentally the DPS is still out by about 20 and the EHP is out by about 500. I simply can’t be bothered any more trying to work out why. And that’s the point…I have other things to train for.

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So you can do it just decided not to. That’s far from an unknown unknown. You know the reason thus a known unknown, just doesn’t worth your time to do it. :wink:

Got my fingers burned! :grimacing: :laughing:

As was recently pointed out to me. My killboard seems to mean nothing. :popcorn:

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2 things

  1. may want to look at the channel ‘Mikes Skill Plans’ I break the magic 14 into serviceable chunks AND add drones. I think the early skills are not about making the players better faster. They are about showing the player that this is something that you will invest time into. Not everything is a quick fix boom they dead.

  2. I have said before (during a summit with the Devs) that nobody knows/understands all of Eve. Anyone who says they do is lying or deluded. The devs agreed then one person in the room claimed they DID and were promptly laughed at by all others. That complexity is what brings some of us to the table and keeps us here.

m

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Training skills were removed.

(a lot others skills too I can’t list them all)

Now you want to remove the more fundamental stat skills.

Either leave the skills, or completely delete them from the game. There will always be skills that are more relevant first.

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Who cares, you still have your awesome personality :slightly_smiling_face:

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actualy is prety easy to understand

green number go up: very good
red number go down: very bad

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And when pretty fireworks happen. Hopefully it’s you that caused the pretty fireworks in the sky and you are not the pretty fireworks. Simple.

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I’m just trying to be the cable news spokesperson that we all hate. (insert your fav to hate) Spew anything to get an emotional response instead of a think 1st before responding. Much like old local! :laughing:

Face it people, whatever your game play/style, all it takes is a little effort. We all lose ships. Get used to it. If you want to make real isk instead of bot.

“The turtle only makes progress when it sticks its neck out”.

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