noooo if you give him real numbers the game is up i’v had him going for so long q.q
how am i going to convince people i’m just some HS carebear who knows nothing about eve at this rate
Oi
that was 900 dps mr
850 with heat, using augmented hammerheads (t2 is 760ish) unless ofc youve got a fit to show? Otherwise its just words with no meaning.
… how did you go from a post where you admitted 900 was possible to now demanding proof?
i mean do you really think i’m that invested in convincing you or this argument? don’t you think if i was i would have pointed out most BBs cant even get 1k dps? many of the ones who can only manage it with heat and all the ones that do are applying far less of that DPS than a HAC with 650 on most of the targets in eve. and this is even with light support and the HAC being solo.
i have no issue with the poor application. hell i would be fine with the application being made worse with the raw numbers going up to truly reward bringing these in a well organized and compiled fleet.
or simply lowering the numbers of ships smaller than the battleships.
I’ve already touched on both scenarios in my previous post, re-read it if you must.
Either you exceed the cost of t1 BS and thus lose any argument about people not flying them due to cost. Or youre dropping the DCU for a 3rd DDA, which at that point youre not at 100k EHP, but 87k with t2 LSEs or 94k with RF(links/implants not included as well as heat since its not sustainable).
sigh.
a cruiser even 2x the cost of a BB is still more affordable even if tank and dps are identical.
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Im getting tired of requoting the same thing. Stop moving your inital argument to “cruisers”. Its HACs that i mentioned and was discussing.
Dont care about gila, or any other cruiser except HACs. That was the statement i was correcting you on which led to this abomination of a discussion as you keep referencing things that arent HACs. A HAC with t2 prices all jacked up are 300-350m for the hull itself. I can fly 2-3 insured t1 BS for that cost.
how silly of me. clearly we should be hard at work discussing things only in the immediate time scale. it’s not like many of us didn’t see this coming and stocked up on loads of T2 before the spike for our selves alliances and corps. nor does ccp have a habit of fixing the market when this happens even if it takes them a bit to make sure the problem can’t sort itself out
and it is still cheaper to buy a hac at 2x the cost of a t1 bb
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Pre-t2 apocalypse, HACs were at 150m-220m depending on the hull. This is before you fit out the HAC.
A t1 typhoon is 180m, insures for approx 160m with a 45m cost for insurance. Total hull cost is ~65m.
Add in 6 torp launchers, at worst is 42m (closer to 30m on average, but lets go worst case scenario cause either youre trolling or just painfully unaware of t1 insurance payouts).
Now we will add in the rigs, which is another 20m. MJD, t2 plates and other fittings is another 20 to 25m.
Total cost is 130m-145m depending on cost of launchers. Add in another 10-15m for ammo/nanite/mobile depot/drugs, but a HAC will have similar costs.
So a fully fit and ready t1 BS is the same cost as just the HAC’s hull, before you even fit it.
…
…
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So its cheaper to buy a HAC at 300m than a 150m t1 BS?
yes
(fuck 5 character limit)
Regardless of our discussion, the fact it restricted the character limit, but not the profanity filter amuses me.
Cant say i follow that logic/math, 150m seems cheaper than 300m, but i think ill just agree to disagree. Since youre including building mats, i might well include all the free modules i get from pvp, or maybe when someone donates isk to me. Outside sources counteract market prices amiright?
i didn’t even notice ccplz
hmm all the factors that go into it aren’t exactly easy to explain i hope some examples can help
a 2.4b BB is cheaper than a 1.2b carrier
a 1.6b T3 is cheaper than a 1b BLOPs
a 68mill frig is cheaper than a 30mill cruiser.
another reason not entirely connected to the ones above (i can’t stress enough that i am trying to demonstrate something different with the above examples than with the below even though the below applies in some ways to the above.)
300mill HAC is cheaper than a 150mil BB because a HAC will simply die less. it is far easier to not only chose your fights in a hac but also to escape fights you realize you should not have taken.
i don’t follow.
EDIT:
also forgot to add that a BB is not only the cost of the BB but the fleet needed by most BBs to properly support it as well. a HAC has a much better time solo than a BB does.
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Ok can we give up on the HAC thing and attempt to steer this topic back on track? Any other suggestions to fix BBs?
You nerf bombers, duh.
i mean to be fair it was about weather or not cruisers overshadowed BBs
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While i understand where you are coming from, i think our opinions/experiences are vastly different in game. You’re more fleet orientated, i’m more solo orientated. I go out knowing that i’m going to lose whatever ship I am in, thats just how it is. Sometimes they live a lot longer than expected and its a win/win. But if my intention is to go roam delve/fountain in a ship, and my option is a 150m typhoon or a 400-500m HAC, i’m choosing the 150m typhoon as in either case, there is a high likelihood that i’ll die regardless. That is the nature of the beast when flying solo. With a battleship though, its much easier to avoid jams, get kills and sometimes escape with the MJD.
I tend to throw caution to the wind and just fight whatever fights i get, even if it results in my loss. Game is funner that way.
So, to put an end to this, i think its best that we agree to disagree. I don’t think we can convince each other otherwise through our own personal play styles.
Can’t remember you dropping a opinion on a subject.
As such do you think slight warp buff(basically copy paste buff BC recieved)to 2.2AU base would up QOL for you using those hulls?Any downfalls of that change etc.
Feel free to post any other more significant changes too if you have any.
at the same time not all classes should be built around solo BBs being one of them