Battleships no longer exist in modern Naval doctrines.
Note that the guy listing them, left them out.
The IRL comparison model only superficially fits EVE.
I can agree with T1 BS at 2.2, and T2 BS at 2.4.
Mixed bag with them but basically anything stuck on 2 AU should be nudged to 2.2 donât see a reason for giving them more.
Edit
2.4 is fine after thinking about it my primary concern are 2.0 slowpokes.
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And you know this how?
The following thing happens whenever some posts a battleship in dullsec (dull because everyone in dullsec IS dull).
Make report the battleship. Call 911, the FBI, CIA, MOSSAD, FSB, the president, the prime minister, the queen of Spain, The prince of the Netherlands, the national guard, the coast guard and prepare zee cyno button to cyno in 34057289057248905289056278927895627946179956956278956793456 titans and press FONE at the same time, then go back to ratting in said titans.
It is very irrelevant if that battleship warps at 0.1 AU per second or 12000 AU per second.
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Be very careful with that kind of statement. Otherwise Salvos (no @ since that would call him and nobody wants that) will ask: If it is irrelevant, why do you want it?
Buffing warp speed would be great to waste less time warping around without changing anything to how powerful (or not) they are on grid. I agree that it is unfortunate that it meets so much reluctance from a few people who seem to think looking at your ship in warp is somehow enjoyable or will make battleship the next interceptor gang.
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So according to you, making them warp faster wonât change anything so there is no point to doing it.
Ack⌠I guess thereâs not only Salvos who jumps on âsound bitesâ to try to undermine peopleâs argument without first trying to understand them.
It would be irrelevant to the balance between ships on grid, since warp speed doesnât matter once on grid. It would be a QoL improvement to travelling with them, which might make them more likely to be taken for a spin in space (as opposed to spinning them in station) and seen more on grid, which some people think would be great.
But you were already well aware of that, werenât you? Youâre just stalling the discussion, hoping it dies and nothing changes. So, are you really worried about a potential faster warping capability of battleships making them too slippery? Or too fast and able to catch people unaware?
Even with quite a substantial buff to warp speed, they would be nowhere near as slippery or able to catch something as other ships we have currently which align and warp much faster. I have a hard time believing it is much of a concern, or is there something else?
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Well, I would see a return to 3AU per second warp speed and I was on board from the beginning but zoned out when the bickering began.
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That depends entirely on what youâre sacrificing. Rigs can make a massive difference.
Look at it this way. What sacrifices do frigates through cruisers make for their warp speed?
They can:
- Sig/Active/Buffer tank, with appropriate trade-offs depending on which you choose to focus on
- Apply DPS to literally every other ship in the game
- Dictate range against larger ships
The frigate, destroyer, cruiser make no sacrifices for their warp speed. Yet you expect a battleship, with inherent combat weaknesses (tracking, mobility) is expected to further sacrifice its combat viability in order to not be painfully slow to travel with.
Another way to look at it, imagine everything warped as fast as a frigate. Would battleships suddenly become overpowered? Would they gain new combat advantages over frigs/dest/cruisers? Or would a cruiser gang still utterly wreck a battleship gang by sig tanking the bulk of their damage, dictating range, and applying perfectly to the battleships?
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I see battleship on grid all the time. I know very well how it feels to travel with them and I do not feel they need to be faster. Their current speed mean you have to plan your strategy around their limitation since they canât just sip around system to system like you could with cruisers for example. On the other end, once they are on grid, they bring more to the table than cruisers do so I think their strategic movement being a limited isnât that bad. You can also go around some of those limitation when you enjoy home field advantage.
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You mean, beside the lower tank/dps those hull bring as opposed to a slow warping battleship?
Remind me again which is more likely to die?
Battleships have no effective answer to even a moderately well piloted cruiser, say nothing of frigates or destroyers. Yea they can neut out frigates, thatâs literally the only thing they can do unless itâs dumb enough to get close enough for a grappler to matter.
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I wonder why battleship fleets arenât getting wrecked by those cruisers to which they have no effective answers to.
Or maybe those battleship are being used to their strength instead of trying to fit the square peg in a round hole.
Thatâs a statement with a lot of variables. Counters exist for any composition.
Battleship fleets donât get wrecked by cruiser fleets often because people arenât stupid enough to take them into a fight that theyâre going to get wrecked in. No FC wants to whelp a battleship fleet.
Consider, for example, a common null doctrine. The Arty battleship. Specific hulls are moot. They canât track cruisers.
So you can of course switch to a missile battleship and paint the â â â â out of the cruiser, sure. But if you can switch, so can they.
9 times out of 10, a cruiser fleet will beat a battleship fleet. Which is a big reason why cruisers are the meta.
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I get the feeling that you believe that battleships should be engaging at range, in a sniper-esq role, not in a brawly role. If this is the case, why would I ever bring a battleship when attack battlecruisers exist? Far cheaper, far more mobile, same dps (for the most part). Itâs really telling that battleships need help, as attack battlecruisers are used fairly often. Battleships are too expensive (comparatively) and far too immobile to warrant bringing them over attack battlecruisers, if they are to be relegated to range engagements, as you allude to. Sure battleships can snipe, and quite effectively might I add, but attack battlecruisers are just better at it. Battleships are too slow to get to engagements, And once they do, they canât effectively fight off anything that gets close to it.
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I guess everybody is doing it wrong by flying arty BS instead of tornadoesâŚ
Why are there so many engagement involving many arty battleship then? Are they all missing the meta and failing at the game? We never should of flown armor mach because the meta is supposedly cruisers?
Because arty BS are more effective than tornados? Congrats, youâve just asserted that a single hull cannot replace an entire doctrine.
Because at the end of the day, itâs not just battleships is it? Arty battleships are used because with support they work.
The problem that I keep saying is that battleships are too slow. Nobody wants to bring them on a roam that doesnât have a Titan bridging them in, because smaller craft move so much faster.
In a pure engagement, cruisers will mop the floor with a battleship fleet.
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It was in reply to someone telling me that ABC are better snipers than BS. If they were, people would not fly BS over them unless they intend to loseâŚ
If you fly a pure battleship doctrine with no support, you deserve to lose badly and no amount of warping faster will help you. At best you will get killed faster by getting to the grinder faster. If cruisers are so much ebtter, why do you even want to roam in a battleship? The tool is obviously the wrong one for the job but you keep thinking you should pry that square peg in the round hole.
We already see fleet using Machs, Ravens, Tempest, Typhoons, Rokh and we will now see more Megathrons, Apocs and Bhaals. You even saw a âmeme fleetâ of Scorpions not too long ago. Only one of them warp faster than 2.0 AU.
What the game really lacks is a battleship sized hull that is specialized in taking down capital ships and is cost effective against them.
I couldnât agree more.
Battleships need support, and I like that they need support. With support they become extremely effective platforms.
As I said before, the problem with battleships is theyâre too slow. Nobody wants to bring them on a roam. The time cost is not worth the power of the platform.
If you speed them up youâll see them used more in roams. That doesnât make them more powerful, it makes them used. As evidenced by the fact that they do get used in null fleets where titans can bridge them around (mach fleets travel, nothing else will travel any measurable distance), they do have counters. Making them get used more will not break things because we can already see that they have counters.
It just means theyâll be on roams. Which is utterly fantastic if you ask me.
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I was only saying what others have said about it, as a statment to which some people will say it is cancer if it is buffed.
Try taking it in context next time please.