New Pilot Protection - Ganking Immunity in High Security Space - Limited Time Only

A quick suggestion, to allow new players a protected period of time in EVE online in Hichsec, so that a day one Char, can’t be aggressed by another player, while in a venture, T1 frigate or shuttle for their first 30 days in-game. I think this would be a great feature to consider, to allow them time to adjust to the game, and to also have a chance at seeing some of the game mechanics in action “Such as Ganking in High Security Space”, so they have time to form their own ideas and strategies about that aspect of the game “Either they like it and want to join in themselves, or they have better opportunities to ask questions and gain knowledge on defending themselves against those aspects of the game they will face.” Either way, it allows for a break in period, and encourages the pilot to learn more about the game without a fairly large negative pilot v pilot interaction right from the start of their career.

  • 30 day immunity from non-consensual PVP for new pilots in Ventures, or T1 Frigates, and Shuttles, so long as they are engaging in PVE content in EVE online in High Security Space.

  • Option to disable the immunity, but with a warning, that doing so voids the 30 days of High security space PVP aggression immunity on the ship categories listed above, since some new players are not new, and they may want to jump into PVP asap as their skills allow.

Just food for thought,

Best Regards,
Allen S.

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I think this is a terrible feature to consider because it gives players a false sense of security and they’ll become EVEN MORE risk averse after the 30 days are up because they are no longer immune.

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I think you are over estimating the amount of sub-30 day old characters in ventures that are ganked in hisex…

Not only no, but ■■■■ no, as this would be game breaking.

It would create an illusion of safety/security which DOES NOT EXIST IN NEW EDEN.

New Eden is a cold, cruel and essentially lawless place, and any attempt to create any form of absolute security is not only stupid, but wrong, as it sets up new pilots for failure.

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  • It is better for newbros to learn hard lessons in cheap ships, than it is for them to learn hard lessons in expensive ships.
  • Coddling new players for 30 days might give them the wrong impression about the game. Better they learn what Eve is and whether it’s the right game for them from the get-go, rather than have them invest their time and/or money in something they don’t actually like.
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If there is an issue of highsec ganking of new players, then nerfing the ganking seems like a better solution than this proposal.

Isolating new players away from the sandbox doesn’t seem to be the best approach to resolve an issue if one exists; but showing that their is an issue is a needed step before trying to solve it.

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Two questions Scipio.

How would “Nerfing Suicide Ganking” be better than a conditional, cancel-able, limited time and Hisec only PVP aggression immunity for a new Pilot Character?

What is the purpose of High Security Space, why have it all in EVE online?

CCP have stated multiple times that the best indicator of new players sticking with the game is when they are involved in the more engaging aspects of the game, including being in Corps, trading on the markets, fleet activity, pvp, etc.

Providing immunity from the sandbox runs counter to encouraging new players to get involved socially, which is known to help them stick around.

Additionally, it targets the wrong area to solve a problem. If more experienced players are ganking new players to the point that there is an issue, then nerf what those more experienced players can do addresses the issue more directly.

But, is there an issue to be solved anyway? So far, no one that has raised similar threads has ever shown that there is a problem, before proposing solutions.

Is it really a sandbox though? The first experience you have is undocking into 0.0 like space right? and absolutely no ganking is allowed in the starting systems or you get a ban hammer right? So we are not dealing with a 100% sandbox experience there are limits to this sandbox.

No, EVE online will definitely not be every player’s, cup-of-tea, but for a truly new pilot however, they should not get the impression that it’s completely lawless or a MadMax type game, it’s a little bit of everything, but to say it’s only one thing is not stating the truth, and I think we do lose some value in players that give up because of one negative experience at the beginning of their EVE pilot career, or who might otherwise stick with it, seeing some of these things occur around them “like ganking”, and preparing for it for when they do choose to dive into the deeper ends of the pool or when the pool gets inevitably deeper.

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Yes, it’s still a sandbox.*

CCP limits on new player griefing is part of what CCP see as their responsibility to help teach the basic mechanics of the game, so players can then join the rest of us, with at least the basics. It’s designed to just be a short period of time, because you can do the initial intro and the career agents in just a couple of days.

After that, they are in with the rest of us.

But show us that there is a problem. That step is completely missing,

* see this article from 2012 on CCP’s view of the sandbox aspect of EVE - being social goal-driven and emergent – making a game open, giving players control, essentially, and if you’re making a multiplayer game, making it as social as possible, because that’s why they’re playing the game in the first place ( Gamasutra - EVE Online and the meaning of ‘sandbox’)

I concede the possibility perhaps it isn’t a problem from a business standpoint, I don’t have access to the statistics that CCP has on New Player Retention and the reasons they don’t stick with it “It may be compiled somewhere for public viewing?”. I do have my perspective though over the past 14/15 years or so, and I know the High Sec Meta has changed over that time and in a way that is not entirely healthy for growing up new pilots IMO. I do still stand by my suggestion 100% though.

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Do you have numbers on how big of an issue this it? Or are you using a mythical playerbase that doesn’t exist as a justification for your bad idea?

And you are totally entitled to. I don’t really see it going anywhere though, because it just lacks any analysis of whether a problem exists and then runs counter to CCPs stated views about what they are trying to achieve for new players.

Like many, he’s using a rationalist approach to justifying the change. He thinks there might be a problem, because rationally, being ganked isn’t fun - so let’s do something about it.

CCP act much more and are swayed more, by empirical evidence though, because what they realized a long time ago is that what we think is rational, doesn’t necessarily reflect reality in a game as complex as EVE and as diverse as the playerbase is.

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@Scipio_Artelius

I mean no offense, but “rationally speaking”?, then the opposite arguments would be “irrational?” or “realistic” in your assessment?

No. I mean a rationalist approach as in regarding reason as the main source of knowledge.

Relying on other ways to justify decisions doesn’t mean the opposite of rational thought, it means relying less on an “I think therefore it must be” approach.

Getting past the first time, or even the first few times you get killed in Eve is actually kind of important in my opinion. This is one of those things where if you just get back to it you will be fine, but if you freak out and start spinning your ships while docked you aren’t likely to last all that long.
Besides that, a fair number of people would just park their mains in a station and make a new alt once a month using the invite thing to give them a million skill points, use their risk free month up and then make a new one.
This might seem strange, but getting killed is why I stuck with Eve, it was strangely incentivizing and motivated me to get past the learning curve.

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@scipio a.

Copy that.