Risk vs reward imbalance in w-space


(Taesic) #1

Today I packed up and left wormhole space for the overpowered safety of an NPC station in k-space (why are there so many of these things spammed around the map? what is this local shit?). I loved playing in w-space. It was extremely tense, required a lot of specialized skills that were hard to learn and harder to master, sometimes lonely, but overall it has been the best “sandbox” experience I’ve had in EVE since beta so many years ago.

I decided to leave w-space due to an overwhelming imbalance in risk vs reward. Let me explain,

  • W-space is less profitable than it used to be, and much less so running trying to sustain a micro operation in a C3.
  • The citadels are paper thin to begin with - with major disadvantages over the POS.
  • The timers in w-space have always been shorter than in other places, and we never had the gluttonous luxury of asset safety.
  • We could never set jump clones to w-space, requiring an anchor alt to “reopen the door” as it were, if a main was lost.
  • The new changes to the citadels – Low Power Mode – combined with the short timers make it nearly impossible to log off.

The new mechanics demand eternal vigilance for wormhole dwellers. CCP, I have a job that pays the bills; I don’t have the time to press “v” 24x7x365. (Why was I even pressing “v” so much to begin with? Wouldn’t advanced spaceships with FTL drives have automated threat detection radars? Who thought this was gameplay?!)

It seems to me that CCP so despises solo/small team play that it can’t help itself from turning the screws ever tighter on what is already a very difficult play style that requires skills you can’t inject.

I can’t wait to provide “content” from the safe perch of my new NPC station home though. Come by some time, maybe I’ll have my lemonade stand out. And I won’t be signing up to be yelled at to login and orbit some FC and rock the F1 button on behalf of the bot mining corps back home though, that’s for sure. That’s not even a gameplay experience, that’s just tedious garbage. Thanks for chasing me out of w-space CCP, and ensuring that I really don’t have much reason to log on anymore – good thing for you folks that I’m paid up till December though, eh? Probably saves on server costs.

(Although, more likely, I’ll just go into cryogenic hibernation until something more interesting happens with whichever PM is responsible for w-space features.)


(Sugar Smacks) #2

There is no asset safety in wormhole space? What?


(Trevor Dalech) #3

You only press d-scan once an hour? That explains a lot.

Yes, there is no asset safety in WH space. If you blow up a citadel you get to loot it. (There are also no nearby stations, where would things be asset-safetied to?)

Put an active module on the citadel and it won’t be low-power, and just as defensible as before. You have to fuel it, but then you also had to fuel a POS before citadels arrived. If you want to live in a WH cost-free, then there is an additional risk to balance that. Seems fair to me.


(Dark Engraver) #4

Because of the all so important and superior attitude wspace players have I can’t say I feel sorry for you.In fact it brings me joy


(Zeatrix Antheria) #5

I don’t live in a WH, but I often operate in some since I just love the whole idea of Sleepers, unknown space and the constant lurk of threat, and anecdotally WHs are much more empty than they used to be. This might also simply be because there are less people playing EVE than some years ago.

I agree the lack of asset safety is the biggest issue with WHs currently. As for where the assets should be transferred to, I don’t see it any more different than how loot is magically saved and moved in k-space citadels. Perhaps add the 15% tax like k-space has when the assets are moved to a different system than its origin. As for where it is moved, could be a random low-sec system, and not the benefit of a close low-sec system like null-sec.

Regarding the profit, it’s not good compared to undisturbed null-sec, but I don’t think it ever should be. I often see complains about the safety of deep controlled null-sec systems, but people forget that it takes and has taken enormous activity, organization and money to maintain these sovereignties. It’s not something a few guys just do, unlike the possibilities of WHs.


(Nana SkaIski) #6

Because of that I would like citadels to work like POSes in defence part. Just instead of forcefield a tethering park mode that would nail something into a place, so you can park your titan around, secured. Structure Shield could take a forcefield’s defensive hp and reinforcement role.

Offensive citadel abilities could stay as they are now.


(Wander Prian) #7

When CCP was planning on how they would implement the new structures, they were going to add asset safety to W-space as well, but the players asked it to not be included. People wanted there to be danger in W-space as there was with POS.


(Makshima Shogo) #8

POS won’t last much longer thou.


(Scipio Artelius) #9

No there is not. It’s the way the whole game should be.


(Beast of Revelations) #10

I myself tried like hell for months to scrape something out of w-space, and all I got for my trouble was a big nothing-burger. I’d have easily made many billions in ISK in that time if I’d just joined a nullsec corp. Anyway, yes I agree - there needs to be some adjustment to risk/reward in w-space.


(Makshima Shogo) #11

Agreed; Local, Tethering, lack of scramming webbing rats in nullsec anom’s its very easy to never die lol


(Beast of Revelations) #12

Are you sure sleepers don’t scram/web?

Do they warp disrupt in any way?


(Makshima Shogo) #13

When last have you seen sleepers in null sec anom’s?


(Nana SkaIski) #14

Good fol nullbears, wormhole people want more risk, but even they have their limits. :sweat_smile:

I dont think CCP cares much tho. Wormhole players make only small percentage of all players, so I dont know why they still keep it in the game, If you know what I mean. :wink:

Its like we got CQ in citadels, to make them more popular among people who liked their CQ. :laughing:


(Beast of Revelations) #15

It’s been a while. When I last attempted to run sleeper sites I just didn’t have the wherewithal and firepower and tank, so I moved on to other things, e.g. attempting to run PI (which was also disaster as far as risk/reward).

Answer question?


(Makshima Shogo) #16

Read Im talking about nullsec not wormhole space. It was in response to:

Because i’m agreeing with him, k-space is way to safe, there I edited to make it easier to understand.

P.S. W-Space has no local so its easy to see I’m talking about k-space.


(Corraidhin Farsaidh) #17

More accurately: There is between your own citadels that sit in the same system, however once you lose the last one you lose all your stuff that you didn’t evac.


(Ag3nt Jita) #18

You forget how hard it is to defend sov if you are not one of thoose big alliances… Do not compare sov null to any other part of the game.


(Sugar Smacks) #19

I agree I thought it just added a big + for wormhole space.


(Nasar Vyron) #20

Is this another whine thread from a player trying to play solo [in WH space] in an MMO? You realize those ads from way back when said a single player could make a difference, not go it completely alone. Hell the ad even had him join up with a larger group before making the decision to rob it blind.

Anyway the solution to your problems involves getting friends to keep vigil in your stead. Also try throwing a module on and fueling your citadels if you don’t want it running in low power mode. You’ll have an easier time defending it if you try being a little less of a freeloader.