(post deleted by author)
Nicely dodged, but my point was this: when was that peak? Before or after the creation of CODE. and the ganking for profit? Several years after. Your point is an illusion here. Ganking in Eve never stopped the peak player count this game saw.
Iâm saying that without freighter ganking being a risk, there is less incentive to cluster around the trade hubs, and therefore less of a bottleneck in resource availability as players are more free to expand into lesser-travelled areas.
A stabilisation at the bottom of a multi-year trough, not an increase (other than marginally for R4s going into cap production).
This doesnât follow. You are arguing that restricting a type of play in certain areas makes a game more of a sandbox? This is oxymoronic. The literal definition of a sandbox game is one in which players are free to play as they choose, where they choose. I donât disagree at a higher level that some boundaries are necessary, but trying to claim thereâs more sand in the box when you stop players playing is incorrect.
Without the risk that - according to you - is insignificant in the scheme of things, and has so little bearing on the wider game that it is functionally irrelevant? Again, this is a case of you wishing to have your cake and eat it. Either ganking is relevant to the broader game economy, or it isnât.
Of course there is choice. The choices are well known, and widely discussed. Fit for tank, or for DPS. If youâre moving freight, carry only an amount that makes you unattractive to gank, with a fit that makes you a hard target. Or donât, and run the risk of being taken. Learn to check your surroundings, using local and d-scan. Be aware of what pilots are in system. Pay attention to who is killing whom near to where you live. Look up the wider corporate politics, why shouldnât you run an orca during a vengeful gankerâs killing spree.
There are the things that playerâs stories in Eve are made of - yes, even at the start. Those guys that camped me into station back in 09? I looked them up when I came back a few years later, and joined a group that was fighting them. I extracted my revenge. The corp they were in? Ended up in Co2, and my first nullsec experiences were fighting against that coalition. Later still, I got ganked in a wormhole in my shiny new Stratios (like a fool, I took the bait). I moved to wormholes, kept my eyes open for the group that killed me, and have since murdered every last one of them.
You say that ganking is bad for new players - I say, that this is only the case where those new players have not yet internalised that ships are ammo in Eve, and their death is inevitable. That this should be taught quickly, and repeatedly, should be obvious to any long-term player. The losses may be significant in the moment, but are ultimately easily overcome. More importantly, the learning about the reality of Eve is invaluable to shaping the experience and expectations of new players.
Without this element, we will simply be producing more generations of Eve pilots that are risk-averse, hiding away from conflict and trial to scurry out to their safe farms - be those high sec, or null. This is the mindset that allows for mega-blocs and stagnations, of content-averse players and fear of loss antithetical to the uniqueness of Eve online.
4 Likes
The fun thing about Lucas is that he always thinks he is winning the argument.
2 Likes
OstensiblyâŚbut Iâd argue that something where thereâs no record of the outcome and no conceivable bragging rights is the real â not true PvPâ. If I take an Orca and suck an asteroid belt dry so nobody else finds anything thereâŚwhat have I âwonâ ? Itâs possibly nobody would even know that I, alone, did it. I think proper PvP involves a bit more than a Machiavelian smirk.
Thatâs not coexisting with PvP players. Thatâs joining a PvP game and being entitled enough to think that you shouldnât have to PvP.
Baseless, Iâve done every form of PvP imaginable in this game. HS, LS, NS, small group, solo, blobs, wars, baiting, ganking, literally all of it. Iâm obviously not the GOAT but Iâm pretty damn good at PvP in general. The problem is, you and most others like you fail to understand that many of us like to PvP for our PROFESSION. To me, PvPing at a loss and then having to PvE to compensate is in fact losing the game.
A separate PvE only server would kill the game outright. We canât afford another fracture of our playerbase. Not to mention a PvE-only server would completely crumble without PvP destruction to fuel demand. Not to mention itâs horribly entitled for you to come to a PvP game and actually expect them to start an entire separate server with game rules that revolve around what you specifically want to do. So pathetic.
As far as the game changing, sure, but is it for the better? Obviously not. Eve has hemorrhaged subs for a decade specifically because of the removal of PvP content. Iâve seen multiple entire PvP communities get completely demolished over my 10+ years of playing this game. All to serve some solo mission runner that, 10 years later, no longer plays because it turns out PvEing ad nauseum isnât the point of this game.
Anyways, I donât expect you acknowledge any of these and fully expect you to continue to gaslight and lie about literally everything. Your perspective is so warped itâs pathetic really.
3 Likes
Its typical Lucas. Something is miniscule when it suits him and massive when it suits him. This is what happens when someone becomes so obsessed with a cause that they completely lose sight of the wood for the trees and honest discussion becomes impossible.
2 Likes
Its an actual name, unlike Un.
Seriously are you guys bots or what?
Oh wait, this about you thinking Null is dangerous, so yeah, bots. Or krabs. Or both.
Have you played Albion? They have exactly the safe-zone youâre talking about and guess what? Itâs pointless to stay there. The amount youâd make in an hour in the SafeZone would take mere seconds in the black zone. As such, anyone outside of the tutorial heads straight to the most dangerous place to make money.
So back to Eve. CCP would have to CASTRATE HS PvE profitability to make it a safe zone. To the point youâd HAVE to go to low or null to make any meaningful isk. Furthermore, there are far more people out hunting SPECIFICALLY PvEers in those zones because it would be the only place to accomplish anything PvEwise.
It will just keep cascading. Next youâll want a safer low and null sec. Itâs just entitlement man. A player driven market only functions when everyone faces the same risk/reward.
Here you go again with the lies and gaslighting. I could go through an entire timeline with examples and proof but itâs been done a million times, youâre just going to continue to gaslight and I have an exciting RL and ainât got the time.
It wouldnât be more popular and both servers would be dead.
3 Likes
⌠fish. Or birds. Or- hey! Itâs Superman!
Quit making Ramona look like a dummy or else heâll complain about your name again.
When did âmost PvE playersâ elect you as their spokesperson ? When was the massive questionnaire asking what âmost PvE playersâ thought about it all ?
You gonna talk to an obvious forum bot again for our amusment?
Pretty funny in that other thread
What are you going to do about it, boy?
He doesnât just look like a dummy.
Why would I want to do anything about it girl?
Rather a dummy than a krab any day
Fight me or kiss me you beautiful bastard.
Why not both?
Lucas has been replying for the last 5 mins Iâm getting anxious.
majority of the freighters these days are on autopilot
the risk of being ganked is extremely, but extremely low and you can mitigate this risk to exactly 0 if you donât:
- transfer more than 2bil
- donât have cargoholds or even better have 1-3 bulkheads
This is why you often see 5-10 freighters being multiboxed and autopilotting simultaneously - this way neither is worth to gank
The cost of the freighter gank is around 1bil itself, using catalysts it can be like 500 but then you need to plex/sub more accounts and with last tether nerf, each such gank char needs to use clone soldier tags which further increases the costs. And there is 50% chance for each item to drop, so the 2bilions are basically a miimum for the gank to be profitable and pay back at least input cost. And there is a risk of antigankers saving the freighter or stealing the loot.
There is daily like 1000 freighters passing Sivala. Majority if on autopilot. And the last nerfs made them even more safe. What you are cheering for was never a problem, these fleets were using omega accounts as they were mostly multiboxed.
1 Like