why are you always so hostile? 
In the rebalance of industrial hauling ships, CCP attempted to give players a choice: less cargo capacity, but more tank (example: Nereus), or more cargo capacity, no tank (ex: Iteron V). Its sad to see some of these ships go down, with no fittings.
I doubt CCP will ever block non-consensual pvp in highsec. But it should make no difference if it was blocked, to the smart players and large groups who claim suicide ganks don’t affect them. Large null groups don’t need to pay much attention to highsec, they encourage everyone to move to null, where the real isk is.
Take all the ship losses in HS. Subtract wardecs,criminal/suspect timers, and losses to npc (PvE). 80% or more of the remaining appear to be afk,fail (very poorly) fit, auto piloting, or hauling cargo worth large sums of isk. HS gankers are no different than those engaged in Industry or the Market; they have researched their style of play, know exactly what and how they will accomplish it, and use third party programs (legally) to accomplish their style of play. Most games penalize you for doing stupid behavior, why should EVE be different? You walk out in the open in a FPS? Dead. You fail to take the right equipment on your dungeon raid? Dead. You go afk to make a sandwich in a dangerous area full of monsters? Dead.
While the HS ganker has put in extra effort to learn how to effectively gank, invested in extra software, learned the mechanics/gameplay, and engaged in fellow ganker corporation coordination, most victims seem to take the path of least effort AND expects to get rewarded for it. Until most of the HS ganks are fully and well fitted ,manned, cargoed, and aware player ships listed as the loss, there is really little validity to the complaints that suicide ganking’s cost is too low.
2 Likes
And that is relative to which part of space one occupies, obviously WH, and null dwellers a plex is not that expensive, for others more of a struggle.
2 Likes
Maybe if you guys actually…you know did things like shoot them vs. hiding behind the skirts of NPCs. 
2 Likes
Well having gone from a member of the GBC, to a Goon “pet” to an actual member of GSF (guess this means I can pet myself–har har har) there isn’t much about it. We do like eating lots of bacon though.
Yes, lots of things are possible if I cheat. 
Given that the Alpha Clone state is a little over a year old…they’ve been doing it for years? Stealing from CCP?
I love how everyone defending statements going against suicide-ganking is that person’s alt.
You guys are pathetic. Everytime a thread against suicide ganking pops up you start spamming your James123 and miner bumping nonsenses, and you bring OP’s killboard “oh hey this noob got killed in retriever while he should be using procurer” or “oh hey this guy was autopiloting in capsule he deserved it” as that is suppose to be a valid argument. And if someone agrees with OP or support his statement you call him “fake” or alt. Just lol.
There is no denial that only those not using proper fits/ships, not using instadock/undocks, not using pirat intels, not using scouts, well those who are greedy or who are not taking care are the targets of suicide ganking but how does that changes anything? It is a one-sided activity - only the ganker is having fun not his target (which is basically whats called griefing in other games but this is eve right). And, because of how it works, the victim has next to zero chance to avenge. Gankers are in 99% time alts with one purpose - to gank in highsec. They never fly anything else than ganking ships and the only time one could attack them is when they arrive on gate to gank someone - and that is already too late.
Because of this, gankers always wins. They take only one risk - failing the gank (which means the ganker made a mistake in choosing a target or during gank). Even then, unless the target is Freigher failing a gank is still not costing anything other than time. The expenses for suicide-ganking are almost neglectible (maybe except Tornado ganking but while that is expensive for me, it is probably not expensive for those doing it).
I am not OP’s alt, if you compare his posts and mine you will clearly see it. I am suicide ganking with several alts - alts specifically purposes for that activity only. I do however fix my security status. Imo the biggest problem here is that majority of the gankers are not doing this. In my opinion, you should not be able to live in highec with -10 sec status. If you want sucide gank, use the options to raise your security status - options that balances this activity out, you ither pay lots of ISKs or you take your time to raise it via ratting. What CODE is doing is essentially exploiting the system…
2 Likes
Well I do these things on my indy alts and I dont get ganked.
As my dear departed gran once told me, “If the goat butts your balls when you’re trying to mount it, it’s not the goat that’s at fault, it’s your poor choice of ride.”
4 Likes
Your Gran sounds…feisty. May she rest in peace, having left behind such a succinct piece of wisdom!
My maternal grandfather was also something of a rogue. He and his wife were tenant farmers. Troubled by a lack of eggs from the hens, she asked him one morning what she could do to make them lay. ‘Cut off their legs’, said he, ‘then they’ll have to bloody lay!’
I nearly peed myself laughing. Must have been about 6 years old…
4 Likes
Except that there may well be a procurer sitting alongside the retriever and it may well not get ganked, and also substituting ships for risk management is something we learn to do in null all the time, as well as placing duplicate ships to avoid flying them backwards and forwards up the pipe which will inevitably get them killed.
A - I do not mind the game of playing the rabbit and avoiding losing things. IMO its not actually much different from small gang pvpers do, which is play kitey, and avoid losing ships to heavier opponents, even if the direct skills are not all the same, its a little part of the mindset a solo hunter needs.
B - the gankers alts are hauling stuff to their staging all the time, its not like eve mechanics magically don’t apply to them.
C - I once sold a player 10 tornados in dodixie, then realised that I needed to undock my blockade runner. I did make it, but I would have laughed if I’d gotten ganked by one I built. ie most of us are complicit in the arms dealing business, so the ramifications of that business have to apply to us.
The real danger is finding no targets. Hours of no money made and no fun had.
So dishonorbrul of CODE. They are not masculine manly gankers like your good self.
3 Likes
Hi OP. Most threads like these are pretty lame, but since you don’t ask to outright “staaaaap the gank”, I’ll reply.
-
Suicide ganking is not much different from Mining or running missions. It’s one of these forms of PVP which you could easily call ratting. CCP doesn’t want us to have fair fights though. Not in Highsec, not anywhere else.
-
Still, there are counter measures, defensive and offensive options, you can choose. You can also choose to try lobby CCP to have them make NPCs being your batphone, but realistically that won’t happen.
-
Highsec is not supposed to be safe. I feel this has to be repeated over and over again. CCP clearly stated that the moment you undock your ship, you take the risk to lose it - no matter the area of space.
-
The rewards you are speaking about can only be high, if people haul very expensive stuff in stupid ways. Seriously, if someone puts 1B worth of modules into a T1 hauler, why should it be the ganker who has to fly a more expensive ship to gank him? If a ganker uses a char for long term there will be already a lot more risk once she drops under -5 security status, as everyone can engage them freely at any time. For ones who try to keep their status above that there will be tremendous cost in form of Concord tags (not sure if any of them even bothers).
This is actually a fair point and I agree to a certain degree. While you probably could find ways to fulfill your hunger for vengeance, these are far more complicated than a gank. On the other hand, if you ask yourself how the gankers got you and if the same could have happened in Lowsec, Nullsec or in J-Space, you might reconsider it.
The one thing I would like to see is to give everyone the possibility to shoot back. Freighters in the real world have weapons on board and while they might not be as effective as these of a Destroyer, at least there is something. Like a Proc or a Skiff - sure they can be ganked, but they also have teeth. If every industrial ship had some, the entire ganking process would be more fun. Both for the gankers and for the ganked. AFK anything will still be a bad idea and punished accordingly.
The basic t1 haulers fight back, the more specialised ships gain their specialist role efficiencies at the cost of general abilities like being able to fight back, and you can also produce many other hauling volume vs combat ability tradeoffs by fitting expanders to combat hulls - I used to use the proteus as a “Tokyo Express”, to covert/nullify run 750m3 of stuff to/from deep null for example.
In any case if you want to shoot back at gankers you can just escort freighters with a specialist shootey-back ship, it is after all a multiplayer game where you are expected to take advantage of teaming up.
PCU today: 37,917
PCU 13 months ago, Sunday Oct 16: 35,231
Wow, Eve has had an uptick…oh wait, that was ALL paying subs 13 months ago.
Yeah, all these decisions CCP have made have been a smashing success.
Like allowing high sec griefing to continue unabated has been a smashing success.
3 Likes
Griefing is against the EULA.
Ganking is not griefing in EVE.
2 Likes
I’m all for change and such, but I don’t believe that ganking has anything to do with these numbers. Personally I think it has to do with changing EVE into an ever more clean and predictable environment, rather than creating opportunities for more emerging chaos on all levels of gameplay.
1 Like
Nah.
-
T1 Haulers don’t have the necessary Scan Resolution to lock targets in time. Normally they’ll be dead by the time they can lock the opponent, even if we talk about DPS not Alpha.
-
None of them has any even remotely significant damage output, even if you survive long enough to lock a target, none of the T1 Haulers has more than 1 Highslot to fit a weapon and only the Nereus has some unbonused Dronebay. You can bling-fit a Nereus to get over 200 DPS, that’s it. If you do, let me know where you fly it. Edit: bait Nereus is ofc a thing, but more for other areas/ use cases
-
Freighters and JF have no offensive capabilities at all. CCP could lower their base hp, give them rigs to choose between normal-level hp or something else, including to up their offensive game.
But sure, teaming up is always a good idea and more fun. I don’t want to shoot back at gankers, I want everyone to shoot everyone.
1 Like
Sorry for the past “year” is what I mean. Honestly though I thought alpha accounts had been around longer than 2 years, seems it’s not yet been 2 years. My mistake. My point stands however.