Theft of moon ore and war

Communications Center Crime & Punishment
81

Anderson, chill out… the point of Freylee’s post isn’t that they hbdicapped PIRAT and shouldn’t have.

It’s that they handicapped noobs who want to have a war with a semi-legitimate target.

Noobs who find someone stealing ore off their moon harvester should be able to declare war and pursue the grudge.

But paying 100 mil to try to field a structure bashing fleet and elevate the risk on their own station is a lot of risk to ask noobs who haven’t tried war before.

Freylee is concerned for the game and it’s newer players. Whether you agree or not, I think we could try to have a discussion.

Isn’t that why the forums are here?

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82

Who is “they” ? I assume it’s CCP’s war modifications.

it was already not possible before war changes.
I repeat : war protection changed NOTHING to the problem.
I tried to set up moon mining. Like a year ago or so. Or more. dunno. If you ever are 1H after the chunk detonates, there is nothing to mine anymore. I ended up stopping fuelling the moon, it’s just a waste of time. I did not complain, I have anyhow better activities that don’t rely on a structure. Just one example : ice mining pays more than moon mining in HS, request less investment in isk or in time investment. I just gave it a try, made my maths, and draw my conclusions : moon mining in HS sucks, it’s a trap.
Those “moon thief” are just the exact same thing as “blue balling” : they don’t bring any content, they are risk adverse people and thus make the game dull. The only way to fight them as of now is to shut down the refineries, and do something more worth your time - even belt mining may be better.

It’s better to have a correct discussion rather than complain that the game does not provide you the fun and SHOULD force people to fight you when you blueball them.

83

You are the forum equivalent of a griefer.

We are trying to have a civilized discussion. Our perspective is different because we play the game differently.

You continuously interrupt on the basis that anyone you disagree with is an idiot and a liar. Neither of which is typically true.

You force what is being said out of context and then complain like a child that we would have the perspectives or behaviors you imagine e have.

While I have no issue with your playstyle, your abundance of hate and prejudice are making discourse of any sort with you impossible.

I’d hide your posts if I could. I won’t be responding to you in the future. Please do not respond to my posts.

4 Likes
84

You do not anyhow respond to my question, so you mean you will stop adding useless garbage ? I’m all in !

(I use YOU refering to both you because you used WE)
YOU are the one complaining about the game, not me. That means all the accusations that you made actually apply to YOU, not me.
YOU complained about players being able to NOT defend the structure and still make money out of it, while not fighting for it, while YOU are making it this way. There is no interpretation, YOU made those complains.

There is no discussion when you claim that people SHOULD fight you when you blueball them, it’s just a stupid idea because YOU feel entitled to have fun while not providing any content. There is no discussion around such a stupid idea.

YOU pretend that wardec modifications had an impact on the topic while had ZERO impact. You thus ARE a liar, trying to pass vested interest in a topic where those ideas do not belong.

85

Greetings Pilots,

The question I ask if you do PI , you go to a Planet and laydown stuff and get stuff in return, You pay tax to someone who paid for the right to collect tax, How do you bypass the tax and how do you poach the commodity that is created.

I think this is similar. I find a moon you find a planet , I build a station and a drill , you build a gathering system, sort of the same except the moon miner had no way to collect his tax , and no way to protect being poached. , I dont think thats fair… Just like in America 3 criminals come into your house and you shoot them the police come to help the criminals not the victim , Maybe Eve is just like life…

86

I’ve read that there is a lot of concern for new players defending their holdings especially ore created from moon explosions but I don’t see truly new players jumping straight into owning a structure within the first few weeks or even months of playing unless they were mentored by a good veteran in skill training and so on. This is by no means an easy game and it takes time to truly understand the mechanics. I see this “New Players won’t be able to punish those who steal ore from their moon stations” as a false flag to get a change that will benefit only those with the experience and mechanics understanding.

87

Well, that is unfortunate. :disappointed_relieved:

LMRE

88

My objective doesn’t come with a pre-packaged winner.

I only aim for content.

Back when I was new to the game, noobs could and did declare war.

Noobs flipped cans and engaged in casual PvP of many types.

Though they also got attacked by non-noobs and surely didn’t enjoy their every experience, I’m going to lay my opinion in support of each idea that I think will contribute to our noobs doing unruly and content rich numbnuttery that results in the explosion of ships and the delivery of smacktalk.

Eve is not a game to me. It is interactive theatre.

Mining and empire building aren’t engaging in my theatrical framework for the game, and thus I rail against their dull, lifeless, and un-interactive nature.

Give me war. Give me strife. Give me interpersonal conflict.

I don’t even care if I lose.

1 Like
89

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90

The easiest solution to this would simply be adding corp tickers to the field. This would give ownership of the field to the corporation who created it. I don’t think someone coming along should get a suspect flag i think thats a little harsh. It would be much easier to simply flag them to the corporation who owns it since they are by definition taking something said corporation created.

91

Op there is nothing stopping you from bumping him back or suicide ganking his orcas/bumper with a bunch of other aggrieved moon miners

Seems to me that the mechanics already exist but op and others here are to lazy to use them

4 Likes
92

Carebear apologists told me that ganking is super easy and actually risk and ISK free. So I don’t see the problem here. Maybe they where lying though.

3 Likes
93

You need to learn that this game only caters to the masses and does nothing for small groups…

97

Removed some off topic posts.

98

Hahahahah…careful what you wish for. :rofl:

1 Like
99

So a bit of story time about this. Sorry about the giant text wall as well!

TL;DR: They attacked me first and didn’t like it when I decided to retaliate. :grinning:

The OP here I guess is the head of the Alliance New Eden Empire (ANEP) alliance. This alliance has around 13 moon Athanors in the Fabas constellation, Genesis region. Currently they are all [LOW POWER] status as the OP stated in this thread after they off-lined all of them following the… uh… “incident” mentioned. From what I can tell the alliance is comprised of multiple corporations with a handful of players and their alts.

Here is a pastebin list of the Athanors I am currently aware of them off-lining if anyone is interested: Alliance New Eden Empire (ANEP) Moon Athanors

Apparently their Athanors were all listed as “Non-public” in their names. I don’t really tend to care about that or anyone else who marks their moon refineries as private - I mine them anyway. I also don’t “tip” so refinery owners in Genesis beware! :wink:

What ended up happening is a series of poor bluffs and subsequent whining. When I warped my fleet in and started mining the owner started sending me EVE mails of “bills” for the amount of ore that I mined.

I had an idea of what was coming, so I just ignored them. Eventually the owner from what I could gather logged in one of their suicide ganking alts and started… having a conversation with themselves(?) between their own characters about how I wasn’t willing to pay. It was strange, but also a poor attempt to intimidate someone so I decided to just sit and watch.

Eventually the owner gave the ganker pilot the “go-ahead” to start ganking my drones. What followed was them sacrificing destroyer after destroyer to slay some Mining Drone Is which I had brought plenty of. I ended up making more in profit from their dropped modules than they were able to kill drones by several orders of magnitude. They also weren’t familiar with pulling CONCORD which limited their success in alpha striking more drones on each gank attempt. In the end they were out several destroyers and I had some kill rights I could sell on the cheap - one of which did sell and I ended up with even more profit.

Once their plan to gank my drones failed they decided to just go back mining like nothing happened, but I decided at that point to just bump them out of the moon belt in retaliation for their ganks. After a short while they made a poor attempt at a bluff and threatened in local chat that they were going to contact P I R A T to put a bounty out on my Orcas. Oddly it seemed like they were talking to another one of their own alts when they were publicly discussing this. Eventually they gave up trying to mine altogether and I guess came to the forums to create this thread.

From what all I can gather they had some issues with other groups in the area mining off of their Athanors too, but I may have been the first one to have retaliated against them and I suppose they decided to just throw up their hands (and throw in the towel as well) and felt it wasn’t worth the frustration. Not sure why they have this much real-estate in Highsec if they aren’t familiar with how to use Highsec mechanics to their advantage to protect them.

One thing that is quite humorous is reading the biographies for some of the pilots in their alliance. It gave me something funny to read while I was mining. It seems like they may not completely understand what type of game they are currently playing.

I’m also currently seeing some resistance from other groups that have a bunch of refineries or mining operations in the area too. So far their efforts haven’t amounted to much. I guess only time will tell on how that plays out.

8 Likes
100

Thanks for posting that, really interesting to see the other side of the incident. I’ve been on both sides of this, trying to protect “our ore” and also have been bumped and harrassed out of other hisec moon belts. I’m happy with the options available to both hisec athanor owners and would be ore thieves, changing the situation in favour of the athanor owners would be a big mistake.

Frankly I’m half convinced that hisec moon mining was a bad decision even tho I’ve taken advantage of it alot as an industrialist. It seems to have promoted a fair proportion of newer players who are only interested in group PvE activities and want nothing to do with the PvP side. As a miner/huffer/explorer/hauler/manufacturer I enjoy my game but only because every time I undock there is a risk, without it I’d go play something else.

Last thing we want is the situation in ED where Open Play is viewed as only for psychopaths and everyone gravitates to killing rocks and NPCs with their buds in sanitised group play or even … horrors … solo play.

101

Remove the ability of Orcas and Rorquals to mine moon ore. Create a new moon harvester only fit to barges and exhumers. Moon ore becomes “too heavy” for any drone to mine. This will remove the scourge of afk Orca moon miners. Ice was mined this way for years before CCP screwed it up by adding drone capability. If they come in exhumers rather than Orcas to steal ore, at least you have a chance to have them ganked. Create mining upgrades and maybe a rig to go with it. If CCP wanted to go an extra step, create moon ore crystals and a new line of training.

It’s time for CCP to start removing all this afk/botting crap. Play the game actively or GTFO!

102

If you are not capable of ganking an Orca you will be equally unable to kill a tanked Skiff. They are also bloddy hard to bump if piloted correctly, so be careful what you wish for, you may even lose options.

103

Here’s a thought… a mechanic change to prevent hiding behind concord while you do what you do.

Any “that should be illegal” action (as suggested by players but ultimately decided by CCP), such as stealing ore in this case, results in a suspect timer. No need for a wardec, when they come, their actions result in them being engagable. Won’t stop them from doing it, but it’ll cost them a lot of orcas.

Lets them steal ore if they want to, lets other people blow them up if they want to.

Or, like Tipa originally said, go where you can shoot them without concord. It’s not a wrong suggestion, if you want to live in space where concord protects everyone, you live in space where concord protects everyone. It’s a simple fix to go live in space where they won’t save him from your wrath (at the cost of not saving you from anyone else’s).