I think I do.
With the same habits and activities for more than just the last year, I can count on 2 hands the number of people I have come into physical contact with. All of them healthy, just as I am, and never infected with covid.
Outside of them, There is a real barrier between myself and any other interaction. We’re talking geological barriers, as well as a fence, plus distance.
I can’t pass what I don’t have. Just like I can’t pass something to another person when there is no other person to pass it to. It’s pretty simple.
Clary Daemon, you clever beast
The only thing you are clarifying here is that you do not understand how families work. It is very good that you do not have children.
What a weird concept to go to when discussing things like this.
It’s not weird at all. It’s a natural extension from your philosophy of “old people don’t matter, who cares if my actions kill them”.
I can count on 2 hands the number of people I have come into physical contact with.
“Less than 10 interactions” is not “literally zero”.
I will grant that, in your miserable existence of almost never passing within transmission range of other people because you have completely withdrawn from society, your risks are very low. But that is not a reasonable representation of what normal people are dealing with. And even in your case your low risks are still higher than the negligible risk of getting the vaccine, and your only argument against getting it seems to be stubborn insistence on YOU CANT MAKE ME MOM.
how did you measure these risks Merin? I still didn’t get an answer
I didn’t. The safety trials did.
tests for the effects of the vaccine were not carried out, not long-term
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I’m 37 same height and weight as you, so im in the demographic that you claim is unbothered by this virus… the problem is, this virus is attacking those in our demographic. i’ve had massage clients YOUNGER than me, go through COVID.
I see the impact that older adults, much much older than me, those who are retired, have plenty of benefits for children, not just what you mentioned. Old people have been through hell, and they know how to advocate for what children need when children have been abused by the parents *** im using that term loosely because our demographic millenials and younger that have kids, are doing a piss poor job of raising kids, and most kids are being raised by grandparents. because of your lack of interaction, you don’t realize what reality is really like.
Just what long-term effects are you concerned about? Do you have credible analysis done by experts in the field demonstrating a cause for concern, or just empty speculation from non-experts about OMG WHAT COULD HAPPEN THEY DIDNT TEST THIS FOR 999999 YEARS?
How can I be sure that three years after the vaccination is ordered, my brain or other organ will not start to crash?
I think I do understand how families work. I’ve just had the opportunity to really ponder on the nature of the individual relationships within a familial environment.
I agree that it’s good I don’t have children. I probably wouldn’t be a good father.
I’d probably let them be children until they were at least 10, then I would impart real survival skills and teach them to be independent. That appears to be nearly criminal these days.
I do not agree that it’s a natural extension. A lot of things have no benefit. Look at 3/4 of the shelves at walmart. No real benefit, and infact some detrimental effects. People still consume. Look at fast food, same thing. Look at politicians. We can clearly see that they are detrimental, and of no real benefit. Yet we keep them around.
My dogs serve no purpose at all. They are not work dogs, they do not hunt, they don’t produce anything except feces and urine. They really serve no purpose or benefit to earth, other than to keep me company. When they die, I doubt I’ll get sad. Again, it’s a fact of life.
They will have lived their entire lives without any purpose.
I do agree, my situation is not normal. I never said it was. That being said, I do not feel the need to take the vaccine. It would honestly serve no purpose for me, and as I understand it, the benefits wear off after 6 months or so.
That would mean more personal contact, in order to get it. I’m not ok with that.
My reasons for not getting it have not been explored here.
- It takes 10-15 years for any other vaccine to get approved, due to obvious barriers. For example, human trials are usually not done on one group and called good. Usually multiple human trials. Data is reviewed, discussed and reviewed again. Multiple experts are usually brought it for this part.
These vaccines have not gone through that process, which is why they’re not approved. They’re only approved for emergency use, which comes with its own considerations. - I’ve been stuck with enough needles, and injected with enough vaccines that I simply don’t feel the need to have more. It’s sort of a requirement in the military, and as a corrections officer.
- I am not at risk, so do not warrant the use of a vaccine. I am part of a tiny percent of people that has other barriers between myself and potential exposure. Even in the 75% herd immunity concept, people like me arent even included. They mean normal people that are in contact with others regularly.
The United States Public Service Act of 1944 mandated that the federal government issue licenses for biological products, including vaccines. After a poliovirus vaccine accident in 1954 (known as the Cutter incident), the Division of Biologics Standards was formed to oversee vaccine safety and regulation. Later, the DBS was renamed the Bureau of Biologics, and it became part of the Food and Drug Administration. It is now know as the Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research.
Cutter incident :
Some of drugs and vaccines long term effect can be very unpredictable .
I do believed and vaccined my kids … 2 of them developed heavy reaction to chemical compound of that was something i havent heard before … so they stop vaccine my kids and my 3. Kid havent been vaccinated. After that when i searched i found so many family groups that kids has similair reactions … doctors told that vaccines are not necesarry which means if my kids dies im the responsible as person make the decision
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Do you have any credible analysis by experts in the field suggesting that this is something to be concerned about, or merely empty speculation about WHAT IF IT HAPPENS YOU CANT PROVE IT 100%? And why stop at 3 years, or 10 years, or whatever? By that standard you should never accept treatment for anything because no matter how many years of trials they do you can never prove that they didn’t stop just short of discovering the catastrophic problems.
Programs such as this are where long term adverse effects of vaccines are collected/monitored. Just because and effect is reported does not mean it was caused by the vaccine.
https://vaers.hhs.gov/
I would argue that your location probably plays a role in that.
I am not in a city, I have described the natural and artifical barriers between myself and everyone else. You’re not the same demographic as me just because of similar age and size.
I’ll give you that. I do see the benefits of older people fighting to protect children.
I think I mean on a more personal level. Of course nothing is more personal than abuse, but I mean…
When I was younger, I didn’t really understand the children my age. I gravitated towards older kids, and even adults. I spoke with old people regularly.
I listened and thought I learned, then I turned around and made some of the very mistakes in life that they warned about.
I couldn’t fully grasp what they were trying to impart, because I was not intellectually or emotionally ready to comprehend.
I’ve tried to impart some knowledge on younger people, and I came to realize that I am not capable of speaking their language. I’m only 35, going on 36 at the end of this month. When I was a corrections officer, my LT would give speeches at schools and events. I went with him sometimes. It was obvious that parents got more from it than children.
I volunteered at a retirements home for individuals on hospice. My wife at the time was an RN there. Over and over I would see grandchildren visit, and couldn’t be bothered to care one bit about the situation the elderly person was in. They cared about praise and attention from the elderly person, but not much else.
I can’t tell you how many people I’ve spoken to when I was in the Army, and later as a CO, that would tell me that they wished they could take what they knew now, to their younger selves.
You really don’t, if you think that there is no value in a kid getting to interact with their elders.
A lot of things have no benefit.
That’s not what I said. Your philosophy is not just that old people have no benefit (itself a ridiculous claim to make), it’s that because they have no benefit it doesn’t matter if they die because of your reckless actions. And from there it’s not much of a step to mandatory euthanasia for the benefit of society.
It takes 10-15 years for any other vaccine to get approved, due to obvious barriers.
And, again, those barriers are primarily two things:
-
Previous vaccines have not been developed using modern technology. For example, gene sequencing now takes minutes or hours where it used to take days or weeks of lab work. We’re simply better at making vaccines than we were 20-30 years ago.
-
Previous vaccines were developed without writing blank checks for R&D costs, which forced a more conservative approach to development that accepts a longer R&D process in exchange for less financial risk. But this is purely financial risk to the company and has nothing to do with health risks.
I am not at risk
And here is where you are once again wrong. Unless you never leave your property or allow anyone but delivery people (outdoors and at a distance) onto your property then you are at risk. Your risks are small, but they are not zero and they are almost certainly greater than any risk caused by the vaccine.
Also, I notice that you have completely moved the goalposts from talking about hypothetical vaccination for kids to focusing on your specific one in a million scenario where you have sufficiently isolated yourself from the world that your risks are very small even without a vaccine. Do you now concede every point about vaccines in general, and admit that your “we don’t need it” position only applies to people living at your level of isolation?
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The Cutter incident had an ambivalent legacy. On the one hand, it led to the effective federal regulation of vaccines, which today enjoy a record of safety
unmatched by any other medical product'. On the other hand, the court ruling that Cutter was liable to pay compensation to those damaged by its polio vaccine—even though it was not found to be negligent in its production—opened the floodgates to a wave of litigation. As a result,vaccines were among the first medical products almost eliminated by lawsuits’. Indeed, the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program was introduced in 1986 to protect vaccine manufacturers from litigation on a scale that threatened the continuing production of vaccines. Still, many companies have opted out of this low-profit, high-risk field, leaving only a handful of firms to meet a growing demand (resulting in recent shortages of flu and other vaccines).
The contemporary climate of risk aversion and predatory litigation deters the introduction of new vaccines and discourages innovation in a field which boasts some of the most impressive achievements of modern medicine. To protect vaccine development—and ultimately public health —Offit proposes that the option of suing vaccine manufacturers should be stopped and that compensation should only be available through the official programme.
Horrible incident which changed the way we approve vaccines.
But I think you didn’t take time to read the article
The conversation evolved. You stopped mentioning the hypothetical kid, so I did too.
I do think I was fairly specific when I said I don’t care if they die. I don’t think I said You shouldn’t care if they die. That’s a personal choice that you have to make. It’s not up to me.
Ignoring your financial reasoning, which is mostly sound, I would mention again the multiple rounds of human trials. Those simply have not happened for the covid vaccines. From what I’ve read, one or two trials, and they call it good.
I’m pretty sure I read about a couple of cases where they found people were allergic during that human trial.
Then you have other situations, where a small town in germany? I’ll have to look it up again. 26 people vaccinated and died. unknown if connected, because the science hasnt been done.
Point is, rushed science ignores a lot, and could pose significant risk down the road.
The conversation evolved, and I explained my personal situation.
If, hypothetically, I had a child, that child would be living in the situation I do. They would have limited interaction and exposure. They’d probably be doing online school, as so many are.
The point is, I wouldn’t be taking my hypothetical kid to old people, even ones I’m related to. I think I saw something on the news for oh… 6 months or so? saying to stop visiting older people, as you put them at risk.
Even if you’re healthy and no covid, you put them at risk. They don’t explain how, other than you might have covid and not know it and not show up on any tests. It’s like covid is Batman. pop up out of nowhere, and nothing you do can prevent it.
Of course, they also said masks would help. Now they want you to wear 2 masks, because if 1 helps, 2 helps even more. Despite early adoption from cities like new york having the highest covid rates in the country. We need the riddler for that one.
And no offense to anyone, but how can this thread still be going and my post asking for donations from disgruntled players gets locked?
because conversation is allowed by forum rules, but begging is not
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