They don’t care about isk positive anymore, since they hide the lost on ZKB.
That assumption should not be taken seriously.
Another assumption that it needs more than 5-6, yes they use 10-12 on KMs now.
Not sure EHP is alpha strike based, it may lead to wrong pvp conclusions. Regen is worthless against catalysts, it’s all buffer and timer.
But taking @Gerard_Amatin argument in consideration.
10 catas aprox. 80mil. No pod kills. He got an angle. The only question is of your hulk can take 10 catalysts, probably 11. Your fit is probably more expensive than 100mil. If you can, you ptrobably not going to be ganked.
So you honestly only believe in one course of action for every situation? Just that one? For everything? All the time? That’s it? You’ve never once heard of a “backup plan”?
“Well… I tried my one thing and it didn’t work… oh well. Guess I’m done!”
Having a high EHP gives you extra time to dock up. Do you want to know why? Because it takes a very long time to dock up!
I’d love to see you docking a Hulk with 30,000 EHP inside an Orca as it’s being attacked! That would be a popcorn worthy moment! I really thought you knew how to play this game. You must solo more than I do if you don’t know how fleet support works.
So what? I have more ISK. I could buy a fleet of those right now if I so chose. I have the ISK.
Prove it with the zKillboard. Last time I’m going to say it. Prove it. With Hulks. Just because you’re too afraid of the bling boogeyman doesn’t mean that I will join you in that fear. Suffer alone.
Wrong. Cheap Hulk fits get blown up in High Sec get blown up. Only cheap fit Hulks in High Sec… unless they hit a gate camp, I suppose. But I don’t travel with mine unless it’s docked in the Orca.
So AGAIN… Prove it. Prove it.
I said 100,000 with shield repair. I see the problem now. You have a learning problem and cannot process information. I get it. I’m sorry.
Wrong. A T2 fit would get shredded in 15 seconds by Safety.
True, but the regen bumps that up even more. I did mention that. Shield Regen. That’s shield repair. From Large Shield Repair Drones and a Large Remote Shield Booster. They help as well.
Don’t you think that would give me the time I need to properly store the Hulk inside the Orca?
I specifically said that I don’t rely on JUST one thing. I have several things working together. Am I the only one who knows how to play this game?
Please- I’m not drunk enough for this conversation. If you have an issue with it or are just determined to prove me wrong- like a need so great, it’d get you committed if you ever told you therapist, come get me. Attack me and PROVE ME WRONG.
How long does this generally take?
And can you not do that the moment you see Catalysts enter system and warp to your belt?
Do you really need to spend and risk 700M to have a few extra seconds?
Do keep in mind that you could lose 3 extra Hulks by not paying attention and still be more profitable than losing your one bling Hulk once by being slow.
I’m not against bling hardeners, I’m just against bling hardeners in this particular situation as I see them as a negative contribution rather than positive contribution to your effectiveness.
Next, comparing your Hulk to a 30k EHP Hulk is disingenuous. A fair comparison would be to the same fit but with T2 and meta hardeners, rather than a fit without hardeners at all.
With two compact and one T2 hardener you can get 75% of the EHP for 30% of the cost, with 100% of the yield of your current Hulk. Instead of a very profitable kill gankers would lose ISK killing it.
Again… zkillboard.
Zkillboard. Zkillboard.
You keep saying ‘zkillboard’ while ignoring that those expensive hardeners don’t help you, but make your losses both more likely and more expensive.
Also, zkillboard has biases.
If more players fly T2-fit ships than bling-fit ships, it’s only natural that more cheap Hulks die and show up on zkillboard than expensive fits, even if both types of ships are killed equally often when used. You would have to account for the usage before zkillboard death stats become worth using in this discussion.
3 T1 destroyers took down this T2 fit Hulk.
And you’re damn right I use zkillboard to make my point.
And you keep insisting I’m wrong when I’ve been proven right over and over again.
If you’re so right, show one example of a high sec kill that proves your point.
I’ve been over-tanking Exhumers, Avalanches, Bowheads (I even put capital rigs on this in addition to the Dread Gurista Hardeners), and Orcas and I’ve posted my fits.
Still waiting for you to be proven right.
Let’s make this easy, Gerard. I will not change my fits down to a T2 fit that has been ganked over and over just because YOU said I’m wrong. “Because I said so” doesn’t work for me.
By your logic you should fit Estamel’s Multispectrums on your Hulk, because you have the money and hey, there is no Hulk on zkill being ganked with Estamel’s Multispectrums on it!
Gerard is absolutely right, the chances of being blown up are just higher with 3x Faction Invuls than with T2. You are just a lot more juicy target, both for loot and for a shiny killmail. There are no such Hulks easily to find on zKill because barely anyone is that stupid to fit his Hulk this way.
Then i guess you’ll easily be proven right in a matter of days. Piece of cake right?
if anyone would want to bring it down, yes, piece of cake. There are ships with much more eHP ganked every day. But you misunderstand your position: Absolutely nobody cares to prove you wrong. 
The only reason Gerard is even responding is “community service”, to prevent any newbro believing that idea is smart in some way. Because it isn’t.
Feel free to fly however you want!
I just wanted to have said that your current strategy and argument makes no sense, to help you, just like I helped you with an Orca fit earlier.
Syzygium worded my arguments well. If what I said wasn’t convincing maybe his message was clearer, but it seems you’re still stubborn.
I only hope that others who read the thread may be more responsive to reason and not triple their Hulks value for no good reason at all. The only time it might be worth it is if the base Hulk is already expensive, such as with ORE and/or abyssal rolled strip miners in which case such hardeners are relatively much less of a value increase, but even then I personally just use T2 hardeners as the choice of hardeners on a ship as squishy as a Hulk won’t make the difference; you’re going to die anyway and people want you dead and you’re too slow. Try to be faster at getting away instead.
I’m not against letting him fly what he wants, not even saying his fit is wrong or bad.
I just updated his expectations about Safety, nothing more.
I don’t like much this attitude of telling people what to do, let them do it. You can’t convince people of what they don’t know, experience is the only teacher.
That’s why physicists are different from engineers, fits are to be tested. Sometimes they are bad by definition, that’s not the case here, here the case is the value, which the OP is not preoccupied.
@Glenduil now you need to expose yourself, including Weekends, using it now and then does not count. If you make it intact, you were right.
No point arguing anymore, time to test.
And to be honest, I don’t know why you brought your fit to the forums before testing it.
One may think you wanted theorycraft and opinions on it, but you got personal after receiving them.
Maybe you wanted it, but you couldn’t handle the rejection to you idea. Never get in love with ideas… Terrible mistake.
I talk to Aiko frequently. I even see her often and I’ve even ganked with her. I’ll be doing that again soon enough. She could find me if she wants to. She travels through High Sec even more than I do. Plus there are locator agents. Eve has few secrets.
And that’s why no one will. Ever. That’s exactly why. Tracking down one Hulk with 10-12 people would be an annoying endeavor. I’m only interested in protecting myself from the small gangs that do come around. That’s the beautiful logic of it.
Small bands will take down Hulks just for fun- no malice- just spot and kill tactics. That’s what High Sec is about. Large groups with premeditated coordinated attacks go after structures, not one Hulk. The large groups sit at gates like the ones in Uedama. Small groups roam around.
Three T1 destroyers can take down the T2 fit that Gerard told me to use. That means that I have to ALWAYS be on the lookout for them and take drastic measures anytime I see an Amarr destroyer enter the system.
That Hulk pilot was “smart” in that T2 fit and got taken down by a roaming 3 person team of T1 Amarr destroyers. I do things that yield results.
You claim that people will want to destroy me and then say things like:
So… people will want to destroy me because of my fit, but no one will want to destroy me just just because of my fit…
Hulk w/ ice harvesters, mining upgrades and medium extender. Nice ragebait 
Nobody wants to “destroy you”. We are just pointing out that a stupid fit is stupid. If you think that is a personal attack, your problem.
You have to realize that you are simply totally unimportant. You could fly your Hulk totally empty, or Officer fitted, and nobody would care or make any effort to specifically “hunt you down” just to prove you wrong or something.
But if you claim doing so is in any way a good idea, yea, people will keep telling you that it isn’t. You simply misunderstand your own position, it isn’t about what fit you are actually using out in space, thats totally irrelevant. It’s about the misinformation you spread. Thats a danger for newer or unexperienced players. And that, naturally, creates resistance. Because some of us actually care for the game and will warn others to follow stupid advice. Which “fit 3 Dread Guristas Invuls on your Hulk!” definitely is.
Yeah, sorry about that. I haven’t mined ice in at least a year and I forgot that mining upgrades don’t buff ice yield. That was my fault. I’ll do better.
you sir have been pretty toxic from the beginning, and i admire the patience of Gerard, Syzygium, etc who stayed calm and tried to give reasonable opinions, while you quickly turn it into something personal.
You come to a forum, you tell everybody that you are right, that others are wrong, you don’t want to accept others suggestions. Why come to a forum? just look at yourself in a mirror and congratulate yourself for your fit!
