Everybody works hard for what they have. So it’s understandable when people react poorly to people hating on everyone’s career choices. It’s also understandable when people react harshly when someone attempts to take that from them.
A primary difference is that you completely missed the context of the convo you replied to. That being,
- I said CCP should do more to mentally prepare players for losing their ships to other players
- Altara said “Hey no, in the tutorial you lose a ship, and get told you’ll lose more, so it’s already done”
- Sasha said “Well it’s different because it’s NPCs not Aiko”
But of course, all the replies missed the point, and yours missed it by the proverbial mile. That tutorial ship is given to you for free as part of a cutscene, you’re literally told you’re going to lose it for sure (so you have no attachement to it), and then you’re given another ship to replace it shortly after.
This is a considerably different scenario than “I bought my first BC or hauled my first T1 load and lost it 15 minutes later to a gank where I had zero chance”. Let’s be clear, I’m not making the argument that ganks drive new-ish players away - that would require more data and CCP appears conflicted on doing that.
But I am saying that if ganking is meant to be an accepted and notable part of EVE, then it certainly wouldn’t hurt to be more up-front about it and prepared for it than the current startup process does.
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That’s me!
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With that in mind they would also have to include low sec into the tutorial, being scammed on the market and a CEO who’s taking advantage of them.
There is nothing wrong with “oh crap I lost my stuff”, it’s a wake up call. To some it’s a learning moment and to others it’s an uninstall moment. For the ones who uninstall they would not last long anyway regardless of how much hand holding you’d add. The game grew fine without any sort of hand holding and it seems that the more safe/easy it becomes to more people seems to think it needs to be MORE safe/easy.
We don’t need, nor want, equality of outcome where every new player regardless of how lazy or informed, or how open to “pvp” or not, get the exact same outcome and rewards. It doesn’t work in the long run just like how it doesn’t work IRL, where the result is just more people who can’t read or do basic math.
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Thats the point, barely anyone will get ganked in their “first BC”. Simply because BCs aren’t a target for gankers. This example is therefore a pretty bad one. It might work with using “his first barge”, but once a miner has made enough profit with his venture and skilled for a barge he should know that the only risk in this game for a highsec miner is gankers and he should have done one single step (google search / youtube video / wiki page / ask around in the game) how to deal with this problem. If he doesn’t he isn’t protected more than the noob who warps in his BC that could handle L3 into his first L4 and simply dies there without a chance because he simply hasn’t imformed himself about the content he was about to do. There is no “gank where I had zero chance”, you always have chances by being informed and cooperating with others and at a point where you have enough stuff to actually lose anything of value, you absolutely could have learned that. It isn’t anyone elses fault if you haven’t.
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Then, Kerzai, we should consider why it is that CCP hasn’t yet given it the prominence or the kind of treatment you clearly think it could have.
Thinking hats on then.
There! That didn’t take us long!
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I blame @Mike_Azariah.
He claims to have an influential role on the development of the NPE, but when I suggested he help new players by including ganking, he just got snarky and pretended this would “legitimize” ganking. So the carebears want to stick their heads in the sand, and pretend like ganking isn’t a thing, and that’s their problem (not mine).
Last time I checked, the NPE urges miners to “hide” in the asteroid belt.
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Mike is not what most people think he is.
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Hammer, meet nail.
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It’s been a bit over a year since I ran a new char through the NPE, but that’s what I recall as well. Also that the NPE appeared to focus on mining as a ‘great’ wealth creation opportunity. Probably time soon to check it out again, I guess.
A side effect of making the potential for ganks more apparent in the NPE would be the possibility that more new players might get interested in the idea of ganking/piracy/PvP early on. PvP in general is pretty much absent from the entire NPE/careers/AIR process from what I can tell.
Mining can be a great way to make profit, but what they don’t tell you is what type of mining is profitable. Highsec mining sucks. I hate it, but I’m not good at anything else, so I do mining. Gas mining is extremely profitable, and I encourage any new players to try it. Highsec mining can go die in a hole, where it belongs.
Yes, if someone wanted to help new players, that would be the place to start.
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Biggest issue with learning how to PvP is that you need a ton of isk to throw at experimental fittings. Other players advice will only get you so far, you have to actually learn how through experience. Sure, you can do FW, but that only teaches so much.
I teach new players to gank in my newbro friendly Safety alliance.
What did @Mike_Azariah do with the t1 double scram venture killers that Frostpacker donated to the magic school bus?
That’s because unlike EVE, WoW has very few non-gamers playing it. This is uniquely an EVE problem, due to the way CCP has opted to market their game for the past dozen years or so.
This is why I keep telling people that if they want to understand what’s actually going on, they need to roll a few alts and join some random high-sec carebear corporations (where most new players end up). Then see what kind of people those players, especially the leaders, are. It will start to make sense very quickly.
Fake news, of course.
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Anything’s a target for a ganker if it’s got enough bling
I don’t think you understand…
I move billions upon billions in and out of Jita on a very regular basis and through Uedama, never been ganked. The only times I HAVE been ganked (4 times total in my whole EVE “career”) was when I got complacent in a decently tanked, not super bling, ship on AP to Jita while going “eehh it’ll be fine”.
It’s not so much about your value, although it certainly can affect things, it’s about the (lack of) effort and planning.
Dude, you can’t play both sides like that without being labeled a hustler. So who you hustling snake tongue?