Yea I’m recently back from a hiatus. Read my reply just below yours. I used to run JF hauling for push heavily. Given how fast you can buy ships as well as inject SP there is no reason to do it a month ahead of time. And I’ve also been around long enough to know these announced changes NEVER make it into the game from the post to implementation without changes along the way.
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So um…this is great and all, but how are we supposed to get T1 haulers in place? Some of the markets are shall we say…bare. And no one is going to go around in DSTs with T1 haulers as cargo for lighting cynos. Have you guys fully thought through the sheer logistics of setting up cynos with these ships?
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One thing I’ve learned irl and in game is to sweat the small things and get stuff moved from pending to done in as short as time possible. CCP announced a change like they always do. Much grumbling from the player base follows, like normal. Players make changes to be prepared for the upcoming change, again like normal. Only this time CCP actually made a rather meaningful adjustment to their plans, and this is the key part. CCP so rarely reacts to player feedback on big changes (occasionally they may delay implementation), why would myself or others not get ready? PLEX, Injectors are sitting at much lower rates than they have been for the better part of 2 years. The Isk faucet has dried up to the point they are contemplating adding some increases to compensate which would drive up said PLEX and Injector costs. Bully for you and your procrastination theory, doesn’t change the fact that the proposed change and subsequent alteration have had a negative impact on players and should be rectified in the spirit of fair dealing and good business.
Well that one bit you in the @ss.
I don’t disagree at all with their changes and changes from that. Aside from the training I was actually ok with the covert changes. As I already mentioned above I started my cyno queues to train to 5. Yea I wasted some training time but that isn’t the biggest deal.
The new changes are both bad in how they flip flopped and bad in the decision. As I had replied further up, it is worse for those of us who contract haul. When hauling for push I could easily move cynos 200+ jumps per day because there was no way to stage routes and ppl wanted their deliveries all over the place. Now aside from the danger trying to move a T1 hauler through LS and 0.0, the extra time to fly those boats that many jump is just painfully stupid.
That doesn’t change the fact that injecting this far in advance was dumb. Sure you could have bought the injectors now, if prices are good and just held onto them. It takes seconds to inject the skills. And if ultimately things changed you could have probably sold them for a profit.
So it is perfectly fine to complain about these changes, I agree with you. At the same time it is ok to admit that injecting billions worth of SP this early on was kinda dumb since there was really no reason to do so this early.
BTW why would I play WoW, that game is crap.
And do you have a picture you took in the rain of your name on the EVE monument?
Anyone who was playing at the time has their name on it. I’m on Row 3, Column 20, Line 4. @whee. Means nothing. I wish that wasn’t true, but that CCP ain’t here anymore.
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I know, it was just cool. Family was there last year so I was able to get an office tour. Took my 13 yo son who is now a capsuleer, which is why I dusted off my accounts and got back into it.
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And that is far cooler than anything CCP has done. 
The only reason I even posted is due to being called some scrub. I care enough about this game that when we went to Icelend I dragged my family to see a monument to my favorite virtual world (my wife and daughter rolled their eyes) and dragged my son to an office tour (he got some sweet swag the lucky bum). And I got to meet some of the devs in person (now whenever I see CCP Falcon online I’m like I have a picture with him).
So while I’ve not been playing much in recent years I still keep up with the game. I’ve flown a JF enough to know what I’m talking about.
And yea these wishy washy changes are BS and that is on CCP. People jumping the gun by wasting isk this early in the process is dumb and that is on them. That was my only point.
Tomato/Tomatoe, I’ve played this game >than 12 years and rolled with the changes. I have 6 toons named on that monument and don’t need a picture to prove my virtual life. I’m glad your kid is enjoying the game and it brought you back, hopefully he won’t be so quick to insult other players who have a legitimate issue with the business practices of the new CCP overlords. WoW IS a crap game and given your childish insults and lack of perspective I immediately assumed you must have been on hiatus there for the past 4 years, my bad.
I’m sorry but pointing out that you wasted isk by jumping the gun is not childish. You gambled that the changes were final and you lost. That is on you.
I gambled and lost as well. Not as badly but I did waste this time training the cyno skill up. That is on me. I am happy to criticize the change. It was a bad change and done in a bad way. But “I” am not the one whining that I should get my 2 weeks of skill queue time back.
He’s right, you are being a twat 
But one who understands that nothing CCP says can be taken as gospel until it goes live, and even then…
If being a twat is pointing out there is a personal responsibility aspect to the decisions you make, then guilty as charged.
LOL oh damn you’re right - The 1% of lost ship value that CCP pays by default IS really putting isk into the game - Lose a 9 billion isk T2 ship - get 800K isk from CCP.
Regardless of whether you buy another 9 billion isk ship from another player, simply moving your 9 bil from one place to another, not actually “adding” more isk - That equals 9 bill minus 800K isk removed from the game.
If blowing something up DIDN’T affect “isk in game” why is it CCP is ALWAYS pushing for more destruction over manufacturing.
The ONLY way insurance can "add’ to an economy is if it pays out more than what was lost - Pretty sure CCP closed all those loopholes years ago.
Oh and Tipa if you still don’t follow - Go buy 5 ships, fit them out - Then meet me somewhere and ill pop them - Then you can show me first hand how losing ships, insured or not, adds isk to the economy.,.
Can you show me where in the OP’s description of the change they gave roughly two weeks to prepare for (with 40+ days training for many) that it even hinted - This isn’t what we are actually doing, it is only something we “might” do in 2 or so weeks?
Saying it is a players fault because he believed CCP is just a bit childish.
It is also a bit naive of anyone who has played Eve for more than a few weeks to take what they say at face value - CCP leadership has turned “misleading dialogue” into a fine art over the years.
If they gave out PHD’s for “misleading thousands of people for profit” Hilmar would be the second Steven Hawking.
- No offence meant to the brilliant mind of Steven Hawking.,.
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Irrelevant. Buying skill injectors and using them this far in advanced is a dumb idea. It takes virtually no time to buy and use injectors to get the skills. So if you are choosing the injector route there is no reason to do that weeks ahead of time vs wait until the changes are finalized in the upcoming patch notes. There could be an argument of buying the injectors now if they are cheap and you are gambling the cost will go up due to these changes. However you can simply hold on to them in case things change so you can sell them back if you don’t need them.
Complaining that CCP should reimburse players who made the mistake above is childish. Looking up someone’s KB so you can call them “pubbie” is childish. For the record I did neither of those things.
Pointing out that a players poor choice is their responsibility is not.
No, you are a twat, simples… that people believed, and therefore acted upon what CCP stated, does not make them dumb - that’s just believing what a game developer states they are going to do, is going to be done…
Of course, anyone with a longer term knowledge of CCP decision making and development would see huge red neon warning lights hovering over anything any of them say, but that’s largely down to experience
Asking for a reimbursement is somewhat different, not going to happen - CCP…
It’s not, material worth 9b in this time is gone, that’s a huge difference. The 9b you originally paid are still in the economy, same as the second minus every ISK sink, like sales taxes, build costs …
The thing with the destruction is this … there is also just too much material faucets, too much you can have. Too much to be built. What does it mean if you build more than beeing lost ultimatively at the end? Prices deflate hard.
For ISK sinks you need to compare what goes into the game in ISK and what is taken away, not the material. Therefore an blow up ship is a ISK faucet but an material sink. Given, it is a much bigger material sink than ISK faucet. And the player losses worth, but for the economy it remains nearly the same ISK floating around.
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I guess you stopped reading at what you thought was my point, instead of finishing my post.
All good.,.
No I read the whole thing. There was not a need to respond to your final point as I agree with being skeptical of CCP’s announcements. They have a history of being ready shoot aim. It was also not relevant to the point I was making.
The point was that the decision of players was a dumb decision not because they believed CCP. It is because there is no value in injecting SP this early in the process, while CCP is still getting feedback in this thread. You can inject SP immediately so it is smarter to wait until you are sure you will need to and lessen the risk of losing the gamble.
That being said I have helped to contribute to derailing this topic far too long. For that I apologize and will say this to try and get things back on task.
@CCP_Rise The freighter Cyno changes are a poor solution. And also in my opinion poorly handled.
They are poorly handled as this entire cyno change seems to have been rushed and incomplete. And then further freighter changes feel like an OH CRAP knee jerk reaction.
The change itself is bad for the following reason. It is bad enough to have to stock industrials as cyno ships. But not everyone flies JF in situations where they have static routes that they can stock cyno ships to begin with. For the many haulers (smaller LS corps, contract haulers) those cynos have to be moved around constantly. Trying to move an industrial all over is painfully slow compared to any cruiser or smaller ship. They are also suicide once you hit LS or 0.0. Even if you form a fleet to escort the cyno (seriously?) most industrials will get popped as they are far to squishy.
I wouldn’t mind having to risk a more expensive ship to move my cyno into place. I don’t mind it being a bit more of a challenge. But having to use an industrial isn’t a challenge, it is straight up suicide.
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All I really want is to have the expensive option back for jump freighters.
Jumping to a covert cyno provides more gameplay opportunities.
You could jump into jammed systems
You can come in behind a blops to loot
You can sneak structures and fittings behind enemy lines
You can supply forces that you don’t want anyone to know about
And if you don’t want any of that, you can use an indy ship with indy cyno, or go full tilt and use a recon with a normal cyno.
Being a freighter pilot is a thankless task, but a necessary one.
And trying to play this change off on vigil cynos is just adding insult to injury.
Stop pandering to your one minority playerbase, otherwise that’s all you’ll have left.
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