Ganking: High Reward, Almost Zero Risk – The Numbers Don’t Lie

Disposable Ships, Trivial Losses

“Always flying disposable ships” is practically the gankers’ motto[1]. Suicide gankers deliberately use cheap, throwaway vessels so that any loss barely even registers. In fact, you can’t inflict meaningful losses on them because their ships are dirt cheap and easily replaced[1]. Consider how they operate in practice:

· Low-cost hulls: A typical gank-fit destroyer (like a Catalyst) costs only on the order of a few million ISK. For example, a CODE attacker wiped out 250 million ISK worth of mining drones using a Catalyst that cost just ~2.5 million ISK – his entire ship was cheaper than a single drone he destroyed[2]. Losing one disposable destroyer is pocket change to a ganker.

· Mass-produced ganking: Gankers often multibox fleets of alts precisely because the cost per ship is so low. It’s not uncommon to see one player running 5, 10, or more gank characters at once. One ganker even ran 6 accounts simultaneously to suicide-gank; either he paid for all six subs (unlikely) or he funded them with in-game profits, which shows how “it is so cheap to do his activities that he can afford to run those accounts.”[3] In other words, the gankers’ overhead is so minimal that they can scale up their operations with ease.

· No meaningful loss on death: When a suicide ganker gets obliterated by CONCORD (as they inevitably do after an attack), they lose virtually nothing of real value. They just undock in another throwaway ship and continue. As one veteran observed, “Miners risk expensive ships. Gankers risk absolutely nothing. You pop them and they come right back with another disposable ship.”[4] The ganker’s “risk” resets to zero the moment they reship, which they can do almost immediately since their assets are largely disposable.

Victims Bear the Real Losses (100:1 Value Disparity)

So, how risky is ganking when you look at the actual numbers? Spoiler: it’s ridiculously one-sided. An analysis of kill reports over several years found that gankers destroyed about 60 trillion ISK in assets while only losing around 600 billion ISK themselves[5]. That’s a 100-to-1 ratio of victim losses to ganker losses! For every 100 ISK of value they blow up, the gankers only put about 1 ISK on the line for themselves[5]. If that’s what Mr. Gerard considers “risk,” then Las Vegas casinos must be paragons of danger by comparison.

Think about it: on average, it only takes a couple of cheap ships to execute a gank. Indeed, stats show an average of just 2–2.5 gank ships lost per kill[6] (since each gank squad usually sacrifices a few expendable ships to take down a target). Those 2-ish destroyers might cost, say, 20–30 million ISK total – meanwhile, the target’s ship and cargo could be worth hundreds of millions or even billions. The gankers’ “investment” is a rounding error next to the victim’s loss. No wonder gankers keep at it; the reward (loot and damage inflicted) wildly outweighs their measly risk. In economic terms, high-sec ganking is an almost absurdly favorable trade: minimal costs, massive returns. It’s practically the closest thing to printing ISK that PvP offers, which is why gankers have made a lucrative career of it. (Case in point: the top 100 gankers have over a thousand kills each on average[7] – they wouldn’t be farming ganks by the hundreds if each attempt put them in serious peril.)

“Risk” for Gankers = Spare Change

Gerard argues, “ganking can fail,” and when it does, the gankers lose some ISK; therefore, it involves risk. Cute theory, but let’s put that into perspective with facts. Typically, the most a suicide ganker loses on a failed gank is a single cheap ship (e.g., a Catalyst and its fittings) – a trivial expense that they can earn back quickly[8]. We’re talking a few million ISK, maybe 10 or 20 million at most, that evaporates when CONCORD blows them up. For a seasoned ganker, that’s chump change. They’ve probably looted far more than that from previous victims or have it budgeted in as the cost of doing business.

Meanwhile, look at what’s on the other side of that equation: the target might lose a ship and cargo that took days, weeks, or even months of effort to obtain[8]. The miner or hauler on the receiving end isn’t gambling with pocket money – they’re risking their expensive barge, freighter, or mission ship (often worth hundreds of times more than the gank ship killing it). For example, gankers routinely blow up mining barges worth 30–50 million ISK using throwaway destroyers worth <10 million[9]. In what universe is the guy risking a 50 million ISK ship on uneven footing with the guy risking 5 million and expecting to die anyway?

Even if a gank does fail, what happens? The gankers lose a handful of cheap ships and get nothing to show for it. Big whoop. They can shrug it off and try again later. There’s no lasting setback. As a commenter dryly noted about high-sec PvP balance: “The most a ganker can and will lose is a Catalyst… a trivial amount easily made up. The target might lose a ship and cargo that took them days, weeks, or even months to earn.”[8] In other words, calling this “risk vs reward” is laughable – the gankers assume almost no real risk, while the victims take on all the risk and the loss. It’s a one-way street. Gerard pointing out that “failed ganks cost ISK” is technically true, but losing a few million ISK (with a high chance of profiting hugely if they succeed) is hardly the kind of risk that deters anyone. It’s like betting $1 for a chance to win $100 and saying, “See, I’m a big risk-taker!” :roll_eyes:

Indeed, even other EVE players have slammed how “risk/reward is messed up in high sec” because “the most a ganker can lose is a Catalyst… [while] the target might lose a ship and cargo that took them months to earn.”[8] Gankers are basically wagering pennies against someone else’s dollars. If that’s Gerard’s idea of risk, I have a bridge in Jita to sell him.

Minimal Consequences and Easy Mode

What about non-ISK consequences, like security status or other risks? In theory, suicide gankers get punished by game mechanics: a security status drop and an inevitable ship destruction by CONCORD. In practice, those “penalties” are a joke. There are no serious, lasting repercussions for high-sec gankers – and they know it[10]. A criminal security status should bar you from high-sec, but gankers have learned to roam even at –10 sec status with impunity. They flit around in cheap pods or interceptors, use neutral scouts to spot targets, and only undock their gank ships at the exact moment of attack[10]. CONCORD and faction police are just a predictable part of the routine. After a gank, the criminals dock up or warp off, wait out their timers, and do it all again.

Even the supposed drawbacks are easily negated. Security status hit? “Meaningless.”[4] Gankers can literally pay ISK to erase their crimes using clone soldier tags (buying back sec status in chunks) – effectively bribing their way out of negative sec if they ever need to enter high-sec freely[11]. But most don’t even bother; they operate with throwaway -10 characters that live in NPC stations or citadels, undock to gank, then zip back to safety. There’s no real risk of permanent loss or exclusion. They don’t care about kill rights (they’ll just use a different alt), and they certainly don’t fear bounties (which were removed for being useless anyway). High-sec gankers are, for all intents and purposes, untouchable outside of the gank itself. They have gamed the system such that their assets and characters are never in danger except during that brief window where they willingly suicide a disposable ship at a target.

And let’s not forget: gankers often practice and theorycraft in complete safety before executing their plans. Gerard himself pointed out that “practicing on the test server costs nothing if you lose.” Exactly – gankers have taken full advantage of that. They min-max their fits and tactics on CCP’s test server (Singularity), where nothing they do has consequences or cost, then import those perfected strategies to the live server. It’s like doing live-fire exercises with invincibility enabled. By the time they go gank on Tranquility, they’ve eliminated as much uncertainty as possible. The element of risk is reduced to near-zero because they’ve already figured out the winning formula in a no-risk sandbox. Meanwhile, regular players can’t “practice” saving their freighter on the test server – only the aggressors benefit from that kind of free rehearsal. So much for ganking being some daring, unpredictable venture; it’s more like a well-rehearsed science experiment with your ship as the test subject.

Gankers Even Boast How Easy and Safe It Is

Perhaps the most telling of all: many gankers openly acknowledge how one-sided and low-risk suicide ganking is. They’ll brag (sometimes tongue-in-cheek) that it’s not even real PvP. Case in point: a notorious ganker (leader of CODE, no less) once quipped, “I have no interest in PvP. I only engage in PvE against CONCORD versus ships that can’t shoot back.”[12] Read that again. Even the gankers admit their targets are defenseless piñatas and the only thing resembling a fight is the inevitable NPC police response. They literally compare ganking to PvE – meaning the outcome is predictable and the “enemy” (a helpless miner or hauler) offers no resistance. It’s effectively farming; the gankers’ real opponent is just the clock until CONCORD arrives, not the player they victimized. Calling that risky is a joke when the gankers control all the conditions of the engagement.

Some veteran players have pointed out that ganking is practically the only “100% safe” activity for the aggressor in high-sec. Why? Because the ganker always knows the exact price of the attempt upfront – one disposable ship – and they’re willing to pay it every time[13]. As one observer put it, the ganker “knows exactly what you pay. The price is one Catalyst… It gets factored in, the cost of doing business.”[13] They undock, expecting to lose that ship. There’s no risk of anything more going wrong for them. They’re not going to be counter-attacked or end up in an ongoing war; they incur no additional danger beyond that pre-planned loss of a cheap hull. In contrast, every other pilot in high-sec faces uncertainty — you don’t know if someone will attack you, what you might lose, or if you’ll be targeted repeatedly. The ganker, however, operates with near-certainty: they’ll lose their throwaway ship (big deal), and more often than not they’ll make a profit by vaporizing someone else’s hard-earned assets. It’s asymmetrically safe gameplay for the attacker.

Even CCP’s own data (as cited by some CSM/CCP communications) suggests that high-sec ganking isn’t some edge-case fluke – it’s a systematic activity that experienced players engage in because it’s effective. High-sec gankers perfected the art of maximizing reward while minimizing risk, to the point that the practice has a reputation for being “practically zero risk for tremendous rewards.”[1] Those are not just my words – that’s how players on the official forum have described the current state of suicide ganking. When the risk-to-reward ratio is so skewed that gankers themselves joke about being PvE farmers, you know something’s off-kilter.

Conclusion

At the end of the day, calling suicide ganking “risky” for the ganker is like calling a rigged lottery risky for the person running it. Yes, technically, the ganker can fail – and in that rare case, they lose a few million ISK and go have a coffee break. Meanwhile, their victims regularly lose ships worth far more, with far more severe impact on their wallets. The factual evidence (killboard stats, economic ratios, and myriad player experiences) paints an unambiguous picture: gankers enjoy an almost risk-free gravy train. They invest minimal ISK, face almost no lasting consequences, and yet reap outsized rewards by preying on targets who can’t fight back.

So my snarky-yet-factual response to the claim “ganking has risk” is this: Sure, ganking involves risk, about the same way betting a nickel to win a hundred-dollar bill involves risk. :upside_down_face: The numbers don’t lie: gankers risk a microscopic fraction of what their victims do, and they’ve engineered the system so heavily in their favor that failure is a rarity and a mere inconvenience. In EVE’s supposed risk-vs-reward balance, high-sec ganking tilts the scale so far it’s basically risk-free piracy[14]. You can keep pretending that losing a throwaway Catalyst equates to meaningful risk, but everyone can see that the emperor has no clothes. Gankers have virtually no skin in the game while their targets pay the price – and that’s a cold, hard fact backed by statistics.

Bottom line: Suicide gankers are the ultimate risk-averse carebears – they’ve found a way to get rich blowing up others with almost zero danger to themselves. So let’s not kid ourselves that they’re bravely gambling anything significant. The only “risk” they face is laughing all the way to the bank after yet another easy kill.

Nice chatgpt spam within a couple of minutes just to make a point in another thread!

With links and all, wow.

Can we have a policy against these kinds of things?

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High-Sec Ganking Risk vs Test Server Risk: Clarifying the Differences

Gankers Use Cheap Ships to Lower Their Risk

In EVE Online, suicide gankers deliberately minimize their risk by using very cheap, disposable ships for their attacks. These ships (e.g. Tech 1 destroyers like Catalysts) are inexpensive and easily replaceable, so losing them to CONCORD retaliation is a trivial cost. This creates the perception that gankers take “no real risk,” especially compared to their targets who often fly much more expensive vessels[1]. In effect, gankers manage their risk so well that each individual gank attempt costs them very little. They also often use alternate characters dedicated to ganking (with low security status) so that any consequences (like faction police aggression or sec status loss) don’t impact their main characters. All these factors make the personal stakes for a ganker relatively low.

However, saying ganking has “no risk” isn’t entirely precise – it’s more accurate that the cost or immediate risk to the gankers is kept as low as possible. Gankers expect to lose their ship every time (since CONCORD will destroy it), and they plan for that. The lost ship is simply treated as the price of doing business (often joked that gank ships are just “ammo”). Because the ships are cheap and often bought in bulk, the financial risk per gank is minimal. From the gankers’ perspective, this low cost and ease of replacement means they hardly feel any loss at all when a gank ship explodes[2]. In contrast, the victims risk far more value, which is why many players argue the risk-vs-reward balance feels skewed (the target’s expensive ship and cargo vs. the ganker’s throwaway ship)[1].

Failed Ganks and the Risk of Negative Profit

Even if gankers fly cheap ships, there is still a risk of failure – and failure carries a consequence: negative profit (or an outright loss) for the ganking attempt. Gankers are typically motivated by profit (loot from the destroyed target) or killboard glory. In profitable ganking crews, a gank is only worthwhile if the expected loot value exceeds the cost of the ships sacrificed[3]. For example, if a ganker squad spends 10 million ISK on ships and ammunition to gank a hauler, they want the haul (loot drop) to be well above 10 million ISK to come out ahead. If they destroy the target and valuable loot drops, they can cover their costs and make profit. But if the gank fails (e.g. the target doesn’t die before CONCORD intervenes, or not enough loot drops), the gankers receive no payout to offset their losses. They’ve essentially spent those ships for nothing, resulting in a net loss for that operation.

It’s important to note that experienced gankers try to avoid failed ganks as much as possible. They carefully pick targets and calculate required firepower so that success (and profit) is highly likely. Nonetheless, failure can happen due to miscalculations, target resilience, or interference by defenders/anti-gankers. In those cases, the risk materializes: the gankers lose their cheap ships (and any associated costs like equipment or security status hit) without any reward. While those ships might be cheap, losing multiple ships repeatedly with no payoff will eat into profits. In other words, ganking isn’t literally free: gankers always risk wasting ISK and time if things go wrong. As one EVE player pointed out, the only real risk gankers take is the chance of a failed gank – if they pick the wrong target or make a mistake, they lose their investment (however small) for no gain[4]. Good gankers mitigate that by stacking odds in their favor, but the possibility of negative returns is the balancing factor that keeps ganking from being completely riskless.

Ganking on Live Server vs. Test Server (Zero-Risk Environment)

Even in the most optimistic scenario for gankers (cheap ships and high success rate), ganking on the live server (Tranquility) is not as risk-free as the test server. The EVE test server (Singularity) is a special environment where nothing that happens has any lasting consequence on the main game. On Singularity, players can try out ships, fits, and even practice ganks with zero real risk – ships and items are often provided at virtually no cost (100 ISK for most items) and any losses or explosions do not carry over to your real assets[5][6]. This means on the test server you can suicide gank, PvP, or run missions purely for practice and experimentation, without fear of losing ISK, expensive ships, or progress. It’s a controlled sandbox purely for testing mechanics. For example, a player could attempt an outrageous gank on Singularity just to see if it’s possible, and even if their ship gets destroyed, they haven’t truly “lost” anything of value – they can simply respawn items and continue. In short, the test server offers a completely safe way to test strategies with no meaningful stakes[6].

By contrast, on the live server, every ship and item has real value and is part of the persistent universe. When a ganker undocks on Tranquility to execute a gank, they are putting something on the line, even if it’s a cheap ship. The ship’s cost in ISK (while small) is real and must be re-earned or reimbursed after it’s sacrificed. Over many ganks, those costs add up. Additionally, repeated ganking affects a character’s security status, potentially limiting their future activities (unless they spend time/ISK to raise the sec status back up). Essentially, there is always some level of risk or trade-off on the live server: you’re expending resources that have value to your account. This is fundamentally different from “zero-risk” test server gameplay.

To put it simply: High-sec ganking on Tranquility has a low risk, but not zero. Gankers have optimized the risk down to a minimal ISK cost and accept those losses as routine. But it’s not the same as the test server where losses are completely consequence-free. Even low risk is still not no risk. There’s a big difference between “I’m likely to lose a 1 million ISK ship for a chance at 100 million ISK loot” and “I can try anything I want with absolutely no permanent loss.” The former is ganking on the live server – a calculated gamble with ISK on the line and potential profit or loss. The latter is the test server – a sandbox with play money and no lasting impact[7][6]. Thus, comparing ganking’s risk to test server conditions is an exaggeration: gankers may face low risk relative to their reward, but it’s never literally zero-risk like Singularity, where you can experiment freely without fear of losing value.

Conclusion

In summary, high-sec gankers do everything they can to keep their risks minimal: using cheap ships, specialized alts, and careful target selection. This gives the impression (and partially the reality) that their immediate risk is extremely low[1]. However, risks do remain: a failed gank means lost ships and negative profit, and even successful ganks require accepting the guaranteed loss of those disposable ships. Unlike the test server’s completely safe environment, the live EVE universe always forces players (gankers included) to put some skin in the game. Ganking is low-risk, not no-risk – the distinction matters. Good gankers simply make the risk asymmetrically small compared to the reward, but even they can’t escape the fundamental rule of EVE: losses have consequences on Tranquility (if only minor ones in this case). Meanwhile, nothing on the test server truly costs you anything, which is why “zero risk” is an apt description for Singularity but not for live-server ganking[6]. Keeping these differences in mind helps clarify the discussion around ganking: it’s relatively safe for the attackers by design, but it’s not equivalent to practicing in a no-consequence sandbox.

Spam and not even up to date spam. How exactly is a Cenotaph an easy to produce and disposable ship?

Also AI spam is against forums rules. I am sorry.

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What are you tlking about?

Ganks using Cenotaphs have become popular. Your or ChatGPTs knowledge is outdated. Do a research on zkillboard.

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“Cenotaph ganks” are a sideshow, not the standard. The overwhelming bulk of high-sec ganking is still done with cheap, disposable ships like Catalysts and Thrashers because that’s what makes the risk/reward skew so heavily in the ganker’s favor. Pointing to some obscure, niche tactic doesn’t change the reality: ganking is designed around asymmetry, where the attacker’s stake is trivial compared to the victim’s loss.

Why is your chatgpt comparing the attackers stake to the target’s loss?

You mention asymmetry; well, your comparison is asymmetrical.

There are many haulers, all potential targets, who successfully haul goods without loss.

If you want to make a convincing point about the low risk on one side of the comparison you should also take ‘risk’ and not ‘loss’ at the other side of the comparison as well.

And face it, many haulers succesfully take the risk of hauling without loss.

They may lose a lot when they fail, but the chance of failure is very small so the risk isn’t nearly as big.

Ganking may have lower stakes, but unless you ignore the risk of their failure in your comparison the comparison isn’t worth much.

Could you come with numbers for stakes and chances of failures for both gankers and victims?

Maybe then we will have a useful comparison!

What about a Talos-based Gank then?

I disagree.

With refuted regards
-James Fuchs

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You’re trying to redefine “risk” as only the chance of failure, while ignoring the size of the loss when failure happens. That’s not how risk works in any field, whether insurance, gambling, or economics. For a ganker, the “worst case” is losing a few cheap ships, which is trivial. For a hauler, the “worst case” is losing billions in assets.

Even if the probability of loss is low for haulers, the severity is so high that the expected risk is still massively tilted against them. That’s the asymmetry: gankers risk pennies, haulers risk their house. Comparing those two is valid because it’s the imbalance that defines high-sec ganking.

ChatGPT does not play EvE Online.

On the contrary, I’m trying to explain to you that “risk” is a combination of both ‘chance of failure’ and ‘estimated loss in case of failure’, in other words, that comparing stakes is meaningless if you don’t also take the different chances of failure into account.

and here you compare only stakes, or ‘estimated loss in case of failure’. You forgot to take the other part of risk into account: the different chances of failure.

This makes your comparison meaningless at best, intentionally misleading at worst.

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Risk is always a mix of probability and severity. For gankers, the probability of failure is low, and the severity is trivial. For haulers, the probability may be low, but the severity is catastrophic. That’s why the asymmetry matters. Calling that comparison “meaningless” doesn’t change the fact that the ganker’s exposure is pennies while the hauler’s exposure is everything they’re carrying.

I would be very interested in why you just don’t found your thought with math? You can easily compute what a ganking ship of each type costs and then compute based on the target size how many you would need and how much base cost is there for the gankers and what is lost if it fails.

So why don’t you just bring up the numbers of a freighter gank with a fleet of Catalysts, a fleet of Talons or a fleet of Cenotaphs?
And then set this in relation to the ganked ship cost and the average loot drop maybe?

A gank can also fail in several types, even if the ship pops, the loot drop can be of zero value.

So please stop beating around the bush and base your discussion on actual numbers.

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You sound like you’ve got the gankers’ loyalty card. Keep this up and you’ll earn a free Catalyst after your 10th defense post…

I am just suggesting that you do the maths based on the different targets. Learning from the mechanics teaches you how to minimize losses or avoid them altogether. Also studying zkillboard helps you to identify hotspots and to scout or avoid them beforehand once you have your numbers and intel. You could also compute the breakeven point of your ship and fitting at which the gankers don’t make money anymore.
But they also like to collect tears and therefore might also gank your empty ship.

Hehehe, good work defending us. Your free catalyst will arrive shortly…

With machiavellian regards
-James Fuchs

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Hey, i was promised a free Cenotaph if i derail this thread!

I am altering the deal. Pray I don’t alter it any further!

With authoritative regards
-James Fuchs