Did this ever matter in EVE? But if you were looking for a truthful answer … it can be made responsible just like it’s giving you your docking permissions. Or do you think docking should also be possible anywhere since it’s just a passive thing?
As the current mechanic is for Citadels, NPC faction police do not spawn outside of the Citadel like the faction police spawn at a NPC station.
Regardless of whether or not the Citadel is Capsuleer owned is irrelevant because Empire space is owned by each of the four Empires meaning that the faction police are allowed to show up at any Capsuleer owned Citadel because the Capsuleer Citadel is basically rental space that is allowed to be anchored in Empire by each of the Empire factions.
The blockade would only end when the security status of the criminals returns to a level that doesn’t trigger the faction police to respond.
How can a passive ship be responsible for the actions of a random pilot docked in a pod inside of it that allow the ship to be attacked and then destroyed?
making this an active choice someone had to make. But no need to split hairs 
My point is: just because one puny criminal managed to sneak into your territory doesn’t mean others are allowed to invade.
Otherwise all NPC stations would also be collaborating with criminals already (including Concord stations - hehe, let’s shoot those first, burn the Sanctum in Genesis).
If you allowed for this then you’ll also have to allow the owners to disable docking for criminals in return. There has to be more in order to get explosions. Something that adds to the game play, but without forcing players into a fixed path.
Having NPC ships appear [to form a blockade], which anyone can shoot, would keep players around for a while, who can decide to shoot the criminal players, or not to shoot them. Only it doesn’t force too much onto one side of things.
If then nobody shoots the NPCs for a longer period, meaning nobody in high-sec cares for shooting NPCs (…), would I find it acceptable for the NPCs to also attack the station itself.
There are certainly ways how this could be abused, but I also see how it attracts both criminals and non-criminals to the same place, for whatever purpose.
- ship: moves, actively piloted by someone, has an active choice, never a passive thing - if you die while afk, shame on you (try to explain that to the families of your crew)
- The police DOES come to help when you are shot at - pity if they simply take too long
- Shooting at a station also triggers a police response, rightfully so - the station just has more HP
- 2 plus 3 → same rights for ships and stations so far …
- if you want to kill someone back, wardec them or use the kill rights
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NPC Faction Police are not NPC’s that anyone can simply shoot for explosion prone enjoyment.
If a criminal is occupying a ship and uses that ship to commit a gank then the ship is freely allowed to be attacked by anyone because of the illegal act that was committed.
The pod can then also be attacked as well until the Capsuleer is a mass floating in space.
The Citadel occupied by the criminal is being used by the criminal as a secondary pod or shell if you will to protect itself against being attacked after the gank has taken place.
If the real world police shot you out of your car (spaceship) for running after you shot and killed someone and you ran inside of your house (Citadel) the Police are not going to stop just because it is your home. They are going to burn your house to the ground if necessary to ensure that you don’t ever shoot anyone again, that is unless you give up.
Basically CODE can gank to -10 status all day and get attacked by the faction police. But when the criminal runs to their Citadel they are cant’t be attacked by the faction Police. It’s not up to the Capsuleer to administer justice to the criminal in Empire space, that is the job of the Faction Police and CONCORD.
Otherwise High Sec would be just like Null.
So why are Capsuleer’s being made to do the job of the Faction Police in High Sec?
Hiding in a station is more like hiding in a busy mall full of people. Police most certainly will not blow it up to get one criminal.
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A ship never has an active choice because the systems of the ship are always operated by the Capsuleer.
A Citadel also never has an active choice because the system of the Citadel are always operated by the Capsuleer.
As for as I know there aren’t any Sleeper stations or ships that have an active choice either because the central actor in the choice of the Sleeper is a program that has developed and implemented by a biological factor called a Capsuleer.
A steel hull does not have the ability to make a choice because it is not a biological entity.
For the same reason why NPCs are being made to do the job of players. CCP might one day decide to replace the NPC police with a Drifter-like NPC force. Drifters can scram you from insane ranges and DD you, for example. It doesn’t take much to make such a replacement. You could defeat these forces, but not without a considerable amount of effort, and certainly with more than just a bunch of destroyers. It’s in fact my guess that these new AIs and strong NPCs are intentionally paving the way for CCP to get rid of the absolute force, which CONCORD is. And why not add a bit more game play to the game?
We are not talking about a mall because the mall in the fashion that you are speaking of relates to NPC stations.
We are talking about Citadels.
The police would in fact burn down a mall where criminals and their known neutrals are housed in because everyone knows that CODE ganks anyone who isn’t part of their delusional cult or isn’t a Permit Holder. A Citadel known to house CODE would assumed to also house their neutrals, slaves or pets thus extending the criminal status to them as well as accessories after the fact.
I love it.
This idea will shut down:
- All Corp recruitment for highsec Corps that have assets
- All Citadel based markets, reprocessing facilities, clone bays and industrial facilities as Freeport facilities, so owners won’t be able to make ISK on their investment
- The storage of any assets in Citadels, to avoid asset safety quarantining and costs
Love it Dryson. I hope CCP do this because awoxing disappeared with the illegal fire setting for Corps.
This brings it right back into the game.
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hehe - this is getting ridiculous the whole game is just a set of data much similar to the “steel hull”
You don’t want to see it, do you?
A player ship is an active entity because there is an active person behind it moving it.
A station is (usually) a passive entity because it’s just sitting there - having a pilot docked inside does not help the station (unless he is of the same corp and can use its modules - but these are meant for a war, so, again, wardec necessary).
I know you do mean well - but this idea simply isn’t thought through to the end and has too many potential exploits. So my last words here: big NO from my side.
You are right, I just hated it because it was from Dryson.
Thinking a bit more about it it is actually a very decent idea. I completely support it now.
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Ah, sarcasm. Any more of it and you’ll be stomping the thread into the ground!
Not really, as @Scipio_Artelius pointed out, this will totally wreck highsec carebear corps and that is a good thing. So they can join proper nullsec corps instead.
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You are using non criminally tagged targets as shields.
Take for instance the Branch Davidian cult. The Feds went to investigate numerous accounts of suspicion such as child abuse and the cult having illegal weapons.
The cult wouldn’t let the Feds in after a while and eventually fired shots at the Feds who came to take the children to safety. As a result of the cult firing first or initiating a movement such as having aiming a gun at one of the Feds the cult members transferred their aggression to those inside of the compound even though they were children.
The reason the aggression was transferred is because the Feds had no idea who would shoot at them even the kids because the Feds had not been able to determined the level of brainwashing that the kids had gone through during other encounters to determine if the kids had similar tendencies that the adults did.
The aggression is therefore transferable to the Citadel housing the criminals because the Faction Police have no idea what Citadel systems either exterior or interior the criminals have in place to kill the faction police allowing the criminal to escape.
A player ship is an active entity because there is an active person behind it moving it.
A player owned Citadel is an active entity because there is an active player within it the same as the ship.
Therefore transferring aggression from a criminal status of -10 should transfer to the station because when the -10 criminal status player gets into a ship they are able to be attacked because of their criminal status.
The ship doesn’t have a criminal status itself nor the does Citadel.
Both are shells that protect the criminal and a Citadel that is player owned is no different than the player owned ship at all.
In order to get at the capsule of the -10 criminal you have to destroy their ship first. Because the criminal is -10 there isn’t any factor that keeps the criminals ship from being destroyed, such as a war dec.
So why are 10 RIDS allowed to hide behind a war dec mechanic to keep their Citadels safe when their ships are not protected by the warm war deccing mechanism?
IOW, “they are an EVE player”. Please do not confuse “industrial player” and “pathetic carebear like DrysonBennington”. EVE has an industry component, but it is a game of ruthless capitalism where you reach the top by standing on the corpses of your business rivals. The only difference between industry and combat is that for industrial players wars are fought and enemies are destroyed on the market, not by pressing F1. The type of player who can succeed at industry in EVE loves CODE because suicide ganks are great for business.
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Sorry, but Luke’s right. To succeed in industry do you need to work with others, and not against others. You can’t sell what nobody wants to pay for and fighting over it only makes this worse. There are far too many things needing to be mined, to be build and to be moved for anyone to have the time to fight over it. The moment you do only means less offer and more demand.
Nor has CODE destroyed any number of ships for it to matter for EVE’s industry or economy. They are not even close, nor is the assumption they would any funny, that’s how insignificant their damage is. In fact, they may have contributed to an increase in mining output by getting players to be at their keyboards and to pay attention, opposed to being afk and sitting idle in a belt where the strip miners have disabled themselves due to the cargo hold being full. To say CODE was great for business is however about as wrong as saying ‘criminals are good for the police’.